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UI Changes - The Inventory System [UPDATED 2012.05.30]

First post
Author
Lord Regent
Caldari State
#221 - 2012-05-13 01:10:49 UTC
Bumping in support of Zagdul's excellent idea!

DO IT CCP

powers-sa: flaming deadtear is like lighting your own farts powers-sa: eventually you are going to singe your ass

Nirnaeth Ornoediad
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#222 - 2012-05-13 01:14:22 UTC
Bumping for support.

Fix POSes.  Every player should want one (even if all players can't have one).

Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#223 - 2012-05-13 01:27:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Grey Stormshadow
I doubt that you really think about split windows, but just in case:
split window would take 2x more screen estate than 2 stacked windows if preferred to stack them.

I strongly recommend that you stick with plan to have one window which can be expanded to as many windows as the end user pleases. It is important that any extra windows can be stacked and they will remember their locations between sessions. Only then this new system can be improvement to the old one in functionality that it has.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#224 - 2012-05-13 05:43:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Zagdul
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
I doubt that you really think about split windows, but just in case:
split window would take 2x more screen estate than 2 stacked windows if preferred to stack them.

I strongly recommend that you stick with plan to have one window which can be expanded to as many windows as the end user pleases. It is important that any extra windows can be stacked and they will remember their locations between sessions. Only then this new system can be improvement to the old one in functionality that it has.


That's too easy... The little arrows I left on the top left corner of the pane minimize one pane thus reducing the used real estate.


EDIT: And how would that make it any different or improve on the current live inventory system.

Because frankly, the one on TQ is atrocious. We're just so used to using it we're accustomed to it's terribleness. For example, the slight hesitation the entire game has when clicking through stacked/tabbed windows. Or when stacking windows.

A few people have complained that the 'loading' animation is annoying. I have to say it's a lot less annoying than the whole game waiting for a corporate hangar to load.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#225 - 2012-05-13 06:38:14 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
A few people have complained that the 'loading' animation is annoying. I have to say it's a lot less annoying than the whole game waiting for a corporate hangar to load.
…then again, you're so used to that behaviour that, when you click the corp hangar and it takes a while to load (because it still does), but the rest of the UI is responsive, there is this tendency to click it again because something feels wrong — like you didn't click it right — and then when it finally responds, it immediately folds up again because you clicked it twice. P
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#226 - 2012-05-13 06:44:01 UTC
Zagdul wrote:
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
I doubt that you really think about split windows, but just in case:
split window would take 2x more screen estate than 2 stacked windows if preferred to stack them.

I strongly recommend that you stick with plan to have one window which can be expanded to as many windows as the end user pleases. It is important that any extra windows can be stacked and they will remember their locations between sessions. Only then this new system can be improvement to the old one in functionality that it has.


That's too easy... The little arrows I left on the top left corner of the pane minimize one pane thus reducing the used real estate.


EDIT: And how would that make it any different or improve on the current live inventory system.

Because frankly, the one on TQ is atrocious. We're just so used to using it we're accustomed to it's terribleness. For example, the slight hesitation the entire game has when clicking through stacked/tabbed windows. Or when stacking windows.

A few people have complained that the 'loading' animation is annoying. I have to say it's a lot less annoying than the whole game waiting for a corporate hangar to load.

I would agree with you if you were asking split window to one window with all the fancy other extra bits.

I don't really mind how good/bad the "one" window is as long I can open plenty of standard old fashioned windows, set them as I want and trust that they stick where I put them. Everything added to that will most likely be improvement - your idea included.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Tierere
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#227 - 2012-05-13 10:43:03 UTC
Dont have the time and energy to read everything that has gone before so some of this might repeat points mentioned already.

While keeping ships and mods on one window seems very neat, however it makes transferring stuff between station hanger and ships irritating,

For example filling the active ship with different ammo requires finding the ammo dragging it to the ship where then the ships cargo bay appears so you can see what's in there, however the cargo hanger disappears. So you need to then select the cargo hanger (now you cant see what's in the ship hanger) find the next ammo to put in, search etc. this is just irritating when doing it repeatedly. Need two separate windows so can see and search both at once then drag and drop.

As there is now no way of viewing separately the contents of a ship then it would be helpful if the ship fitting window showed the contents of the cargo and drone bay. Also enabling fitting window to save the contents of the hold so ammo could be filled at the same time as ship fitting or in a similar way would be helpful. Basically the inventory and ship fitting window need to work together better.

Finding stuff in cargo/station containers is still a pain, need to be able to search inside them as one of the filters.
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#228 - 2012-05-13 11:28:58 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
A few people have complained that the 'loading' animation is annoying. I have to say it's a lot less annoying than the whole game waiting for a corporate hangar to load.
…then again, you're so used to that behaviour that, when you click the corp hangar and it takes a while to load (because it still does), but the rest of the UI is responsive, there is this tendency to click it again because something feels wrong — like you didn't click it right — and then when it finally responds, it immediately folds up again because you clicked it twice. P

Oh the pain. Stop it!

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement

Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#229 - 2012-05-13 11:30:21 UTC
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
Zagdul wrote:
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
I doubt that you really think about split windows, but just in case:
split window would take 2x more screen estate than 2 stacked windows if preferred to stack them.

I strongly recommend that you stick with plan to have one window which can be expanded to as many windows as the end user pleases. It is important that any extra windows can be stacked and they will remember their locations between sessions. Only then this new system can be improvement to the old one in functionality that it has.


That's too easy... The little arrows I left on the top left corner of the pane minimize one pane thus reducing the used real estate.


EDIT: And how would that make it any different or improve on the current live inventory system.

Because frankly, the one on TQ is atrocious. We're just so used to using it we're accustomed to it's terribleness. For example, the slight hesitation the entire game has when clicking through stacked/tabbed windows. Or when stacking windows.

A few people have complained that the 'loading' animation is annoying. I have to say it's a lot less annoying than the whole game waiting for a corporate hangar to load.

I would agree with you if you were asking split window to one window with all the fancy other extra bits.

I don't really mind how good/bad the "one" window is as long I can open plenty of standard old fashioned windows, set them as I want and trust that they stick where I put them. Everything added to that will most likely be improvement - your idea included.


Where I agree is that the windows really need to remember where they're placed and their size. I can't disagree here dude.

Lets hope the team is taking this request seriously.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement

Tobiaz
Spacerats
#230 - 2012-05-13 11:42:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Tobiaz
Some missing features:

- Drag&drop sorting of columns in list
- A ≡ settings button in the top left of the window. Things for the setup menu:
- Managing (currently too well-hidden in the context menu of other columns).
- Options for how the 'estimated price' is calculated
- Filter management (instead of it's own separate window)

Also PLEASE, whenever CCP allows players to customize UI in any way like setting custom filters, have it saved server-side and add import/export functionality.

Also devs, please check out this document for more ideas on improvements:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1SyqOQ09grn4n-JoKm7h9701p9GIRNcW6e1BQG_ZfCSE/edit#heading=h.8xjoz66z85v1

There are also more entries in other categories, CTRL+F and look for 'cargo' or 'inventory' Blink

Operation WRITE DOWN ALL THE THINGS!!!  Check out the list at http://bit.ly/wdatt Collecting and compiling all fixes and ideas for EVE. Looking for more editors!

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#231 - 2012-05-13 11:45:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…
Zagdul
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#232 - 2012-05-13 12:09:51 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…



Thanks for displaying what is wrong with it :)

Putting this on the first post.

Dual Pane idea: Click!

CCP Please Implement

Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#233 - 2012-05-13 12:34:04 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…

excellent video... should open some eyes.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Tobiaz
Spacerats
#234 - 2012-05-13 12:43:58 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…


Great, now everytime I read a Tippia post, I'm going to hear that accent! Lol

Operation WRITE DOWN ALL THE THINGS!!!  Check out the list at http://bit.ly/wdatt Collecting and compiling all fixes and ideas for EVE. Looking for more editors!

Bloph
Lamarr Industries
Rock Ridge Alliance
#235 - 2012-05-13 15:42:42 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…


Congrats on an excellent video highlighting the main problems with the 'improved' system

Tiger's Spirit
Templars of the Shadows
#236 - 2012-05-13 17:29:18 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…



And you didn't talk about other problems, such a handling cap boosters in pvp with huge windows and other things.
Maul555
Xen Investments
#237 - 2012-05-13 18:23:00 UTC
wow, great video...
MadMuppet
Critical Mass Inc
#238 - 2012-05-13 21:11:09 UTC
Great video.

I went back to see what improvements there had been. A dev had made mention that they could look at something like the looting headache. I have tested again and they went the wrong way with it. Now when you open a loot window it goes away and you are back in to the main cargo hold. You have to chase your loot all button across the screen now.

Please call off UI for Inferno, it is only going to enrage players.

This message brought to you by Experience(tm). When common sense fails you, experience will come to the rescue. Experience(tm) from the makers of CONCORD.

"If you are part of the problem, you will be nerfed." -MadMuppet

Seismic Stan
Freebooted Junkworks
#239 - 2012-05-13 21:47:42 UTC
Functionality Suggestion: Shift/CTRL + select multiple containers in tree pane to simultaneously configure groups of containers.

I've always been irritated by the need to individually remind containers that they don't need to be locked. It'd be great to be able to do this wholesale. I'm sure multiple selections would be useful in other ways too.

I know shift + select currently spawns a new window, but this could always be changed to the more intuitive double-click in line with more traditional UI behaviour.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#240 - 2012-05-13 22:42:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Tiger's Spirit wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Anyway, random mumblings. I'm writing a long-form blog post about it as well, but it'll take a while to finish…
And you didn't talk about other problems, such a handling cap boosters in pvp with huge windows and other things.
My excuse is that I only had 15 minutes and just went in chronological order of the things I found… P

But yes, cap boosters are basically another form of ammo only, if anything, even more vital to keep track of since their sheer size always means they're in lower supply. Same with the other “cap”: handling the various bays on a capital ship (in particular fuel), many of which you'll want to monitor concurrently and where you don't have to spend half a minute after each jump to set up the various views you want.

Also, I needed that bit at the beginning to show why multiple windows are so hugely useful and why, while it might take a little while to set up the first time, it's so easy to use simply because it's a static setup. Once I have my windows working, they just work. It plays directly to muscle memory since I know by heart by now where I can find any one list of items. That demonstration certainly ate a lot of the time I had available to show actual problems with the new system (but most of them are variations on the same themes anyway).

I suppose one criticism could be “why do I have such small windows — if I enlarge them and I can have the tree view unfolded at all times and make use of it to solve some of the problems”, but that's just the thing: I don't want a larger window. I want many small ones except for maybe the personal/corp hangar in-station (because in-station, there's very little information in the background that I need to have at my disposal: no tactical map, no overview… having the screen filled with market and contract windows works there). Having to go big goes against the fundamental problem they wanted to solve — having your screen covered in inventory windows. My three/four-pane view strikes a perfect balance (for me): a fairly narrow strip of windows at the bottom of my screen, leaving plenty of room for other information and other windows; a sufficiently large diversity in the number of inventories; and a good separation of functions (bulk inventory, critical inventory, temporary/fiew-item inventory, workspace inventory).