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If you really want to grief botters, afk'rs, industrialists and miners

Author
Haas Tabris
Peace Love n Harmony
#1 - 2012-05-09 07:16:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Haas Tabris
If you really want to grief botters, afk'rs, industrialists and miners, it's really pretty simple. Nerf local. Make it so that a player doesn't show up in the local channel unless they type something. It's that easy.

Most of the botting programs are tied to a change in local chat (or at least that's how they worked a few years ago when someone offered to set one up for me). Nerf local and you could go kill most of the bots 'cause they wouldn't know to warp to a safe as soon as someone jumped in system.

Want to really mess with the afk miner? Or the half-afk ratter? Nerf local. Make them hit their scanner button every 2 seconds or post scouts on the gates or actually tank and stab their hulk or their ratting ship. Give the griefers REALLY good odds of catching these lazy sobs.

Want to kill a freighter or two each night? You guessed it... Nerf local. Park your gank fleet more than 14 AU off the travel line and go on a killing spree. Seriously.

Want to ambush jump freighters? Or cap ships in travel fittings? Drum roll please.... Nerf local. Your poor victims will have no way of knowing that you're cloaked up and watching their POS.

Put the fun back in EVE guys. Nerf local. Please. It's only about 9 years overdue FFS.

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.

Edit #1: This post was all about lowsec and 0.0. I honestly think high-sec should be high-sec and folks should be safe there. I just wrote this 'cause i was sick of the goons and all their high-sec hulkageddon bullshit. I wanted to see how many of them would come out and support the nerf local idea. Looks like none of them. In fact, I had several oppose it. Hmmm. I wonder why that is... Oh, perhaps they need local for their afk mining and ratting in 0.0...?

Edit #2: When did the goons start trolling the forums 24/7...? Is that a new thing or have I just been asleep for the last 3 years?
Gerrick Palivorn
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#2 - 2012-05-09 07:28:29 UTC
I support this product and/or service

MMOs come and go, but Eve remains.  -Garresh-

Castor II
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-05-09 07:30:30 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:
Give the griefers REALLY good odds of catching these lazy sobs.


Oh god the irony Lol
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#4 - 2012-05-09 07:32:34 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:

If you really want to grief botters, afk'rs, industrialists and miners, it's really pretty simple. Nerf local. Make it so that a player doesn't show up in the local channel unless they type something. It's that easy.

Most of the botting programs are tied to a change in local chat (or at least that's how they worked a few years ago when someone offered to set one up for me). Nerf local and you could go kill most of the bots 'cause they wouldn't know to warp to a safe as soon as someone jumped in system.


For what I know, the client gets the list of the people in local even if it won't show them (i.e. in WH). That's enough for a injection + bot software to detect those who come in and react like they appeared in local.
malcovas Henderson
THoF
#5 - 2012-05-09 07:35:35 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:

If you really want to grief botters, afk'rs, industrialists and miners, it's really pretty simple. Nerf local. Make it so that a player doesn't show up in the local channel unless they type something. It's that easy.

Most of the botting programs are tied to a change in local chat (or at least that's how they worked a few years ago when someone offered to set one up for me). Nerf local and you could go kill most of the bots 'cause they wouldn't know to warp to a safe as soon as someone jumped in system.

Want to really mess with the afk miner? Or the half-afk ratter? Nerf local. Make them hit their scanner button every 2 seconds or post scouts on the gates or actually tank and stab their hulk or their ratting ship. Give the griefers REALLY good odds of catching these lazy sobs.

Want to kill a freighter or two each night? You guessed it... Nerf local. Park your gank fleet more than 14 AU off the travel line and go on a killing spree. Seriously.

Want to ambush jump freighters? Or cap ships in travel fittings? Drum roll please.... Nerf local. Your poor victims will have no way of knowing that you're cloaked up and watching their POS.

Put the fun back in EVE guys. Nerf local. Please. It's only about 9 years overdue FFS.

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.



Are your balls so small that you can only take on indies? Not only this, but you need the element of surprise aswell. The problem with what you are asking, is that in Hi sec you cannot pre-emptive strike.

There is nothing stopping you from having your wish tho. Go into a WH. It has all your obvious pleasures, and then some. Be warned though. WH dwellers bite back. Oh does that scare you? Is this why you want Hi Sec easier one sided kills?


vOv
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#6 - 2012-05-09 07:42:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Brooks Puuntai
Most bots from my understanding use injection into the client to control and receive the information. Local is just a GUI so in WH space that GUI is just disabled, but the information is still sent. So while this could be good for griefing semi-afk/Afk actual miners, it won't do much for bots.

Edit: For the record I do like the idea but not for the reasons you stated.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

Andreus Ixiris
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2012-05-09 07:44:05 UTC
As long as delayed local is implemented in low-sec and null-sec as well. This would make stealth bombers and recon cruisers far more deadly.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Tor Gungnir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2012-05-09 07:45:18 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.


Ganking is not PvP. Nor is griefing. You're just a lowlife dickwad. Man-up and go find some real PvP to satisfy you. But I bet you don't dare.


It is called High Sec for a reason. Local stays.

Space. It seems to go on and on forever. But then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you.

Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-05-09 07:47:35 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
As long as delayed local is implemented in low-sec and null-sec as well. This would make stealth bombers and recon cruisers far more deadly.


hah

no

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#10 - 2012-05-09 08:04:26 UTC
Tor Gungnir wrote:
Haas Tabris wrote:

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.

Ganking is not PvP. Nor is griefing. You're just a lowlife dickwad. Man-up and go find some real PvP to satisfy you. But I bet you don't dare.

It is called High Sec for a reason. Local stays.

Ganking isn't pvp? Oh dear ...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Francisco Bizzaro
#11 - 2012-05-09 08:06:32 UTC
If a human can use the d-scan to detect threats, so can a bot. And more reliably, I'd guess.

AFK people aren't influenced by local, so this won't be a nerf for them. It would probably make finding gank targets more of a hassle.

But local is both too easy and too deceptive, so I agree with the sentiment to replace it.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#12 - 2012-05-09 08:09:24 UTC
Francisco Bizzaro wrote:
If a human can use the d-scan to detect threats, so can a bot. And more reliably, I'd guess.

AFK people aren't influenced by local, so this won't be a nerf for them. It would probably make finding gank targets more of a hassle.

But local is both too easy and too deceptive, so I agree with the sentiment to replace it.

Of of course, a bot can endlessly hit the d-scan. Much better than a person.


It's just a ganker's thinly veiled desire to have local gone so they can gank more easily.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Myxx
The Scope
#13 - 2012-05-09 08:09:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Myxx
to be practical, botters don't care for rules... they'd get that information somehow either by automating dscan as well or some other method.

everyone else would be ****** and it could really only serve to screw everyone else over at this point. people would still use alt eyes and other methods to check gates, stations and belts.

I can see why people would want that, im just not sure it would be good for the game. There are too many people around these days that are entirely risk averse and would probably quit over it, sadly.
Tor Gungnir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2012-05-09 08:17:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Tor Gungnir
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Tor Gungnir wrote:
Haas Tabris wrote:

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.

Ganking is not PvP. Nor is griefing. You're just a lowlife dickwad. Man-up and go find some real PvP to satisfy you. But I bet you don't dare.

It is called High Sec for a reason. Local stays.

Ganking isn't pvp? Oh dear ...


No. That has always been my opinion since I first started with MMORPGs. Suicide ganking a miner is not PvP because he has no reasonable chance to fight back. You want PvP? Go down to null-sec and pick on someone who can defend himself. I'm more in favour of structured and more honorable PvP á la Battlegrounds/Scenarios in WAR or WoW. That's not to say that I'm not prepared for EVE's flavour of "PvP". I've come to accept it for what it is.

But just don't try and justify making ganking and griefing easier under the disguise of wanting to improve PvP because that's bull.

Space. It seems to go on and on forever. But then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you.

Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#15 - 2012-05-09 08:47:04 UTC
From a PvP standpoint there are negative aspects to delayed local. So its not all in favor of the aggressor.

Now while I said I agreed with the idea, I forgot to state that for Low-Sec and Null. High-sec I'm a bit partial on, due to the fact I don't see the need of restricting it.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden

Spectre80
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-05-09 08:47:48 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:

If you really want to grief botters, afk'rs, industrialists and miners, it's really pretty simple. Nerf local. Make it so that a player doesn't show up in the local channel unless they type something. It's that easy.

Most of the botting programs are tied to a change in local chat (or at least that's how they worked a few years ago when someone offered to set one up for me). Nerf local and you could go kill most of the bots 'cause they wouldn't know to warp to a safe as soon as someone jumped in system.

Want to really mess with the afk miner? Or the half-afk ratter? Nerf local. Make them hit their scanner button every 2 seconds or post scouts on the gates or actually tank and stab their hulk or their ratting ship. Give the griefers REALLY good odds of catching these lazy sobs.

Want to kill a freighter or two each night? You guessed it... Nerf local. Park your gank fleet more than 14 AU off the travel line and go on a killing spree. Seriously.

Want to ambush jump freighters? Or cap ships in travel fittings? Drum roll please.... Nerf local. Your poor victims will have no way of knowing that you're cloaked up and watching their POS.

Put the fun back in EVE guys. Nerf local. Please. It's only about 9 years overdue FFS.

Oh, and if any of you so called "PVP'rs" who are just a bunch of whiney high-sec haters argue against this, well, you're just showing your true carebear colors. I'd LOVE to PVP without local. It's almost a wet dream of mine. And if you doubt me, well, this is my main and you can go check my record - I probably have more kills than you.



Nope. would just end up lots legit players quitting and bots would keep botting.
Tor Gungnir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-05-09 08:49:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Tor Gungnir
Brooks Puuntai wrote:

Now while I said I agreed with the idea, I forgot to state that for Low-Sec and Null. High-sec I'm a bit partial on, due to the fact I don't see the need of restricting it.



Thing about Hi-Sec is...

Well, it is Hi-Sec.

Local navies and CONCORD would keep tabs on who enters the system. It makes perfect sense to keep Local as it is.

Space. It seems to go on and on forever. But then you get to the end and a gorilla starts throwing barrels at you.

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#18 - 2012-05-09 10:11:14 UTC
PVP without local you say? try a wormhole, the mechanic already exists there.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

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Freggan
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#19 - 2012-05-09 10:40:41 UTC
I really like this idea, even the thought of it adds an exciting little chill Big smile

Only problem is it is a security area where theoretical safety is intended if not completely enforced so its not ideal for the area.
Fabulousli Obvious
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#20 - 2012-05-09 11:08:37 UTC
Haas Tabris wrote:



Put the fun back in EVE guys. Nerf local. Please. It's only about 9 years overdue FFS.



Well Dearest, God has apparently nerfed your head already and you STILL aren't happy ? Why do we always have to do everything for you ?

I am NOT YOUNG ENOUGH to know EVERYTHING.  ~~ Oscar Wilde, writer, d. November 30, 1900

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