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How to make eve interesting again..
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Mirime Nolwe
Mantra of Pain
#41 - 2012-05-08 23:14:02 UTC
Some "resources should be "random", once they deplete (2/3 months) they should spawn in other systems, that way, the alliances will have more reasons to fight for space. In the current state i dont see why they should lose time with 0.0 warfare. (aka Blobing and lag hell)
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#42 - 2012-05-08 23:47:10 UTC
OP.
Please stop.

Yet again I think I'll post some more specific alternatives....

-Improve Mining:
Either add a new mining ship bigger then the hulk or change the mechanics or both. We need to pick up the supply that we lost to the drone ally removal for prices to come back down so to do that we either need to better equip the existing miners to better keep up with the mineral demands or make mining more exciting to get more people to do it....or both.
-Increase the value of low sec
Do something like cut the amount of anoms and plexes in high sec in half and double the ones in low sec. Change the blueprint values of the high end minerals to require more of them so that stuff like jaspet actually becomes valuable to mine. Add in a "semi-sov" mechanic similar to how the new FW stuff is gonna work.
-Re-distribute the wealth
Flip a table on the moon mining and moon goo. Make the moons change values and materials back and forth. Sitting on and camping down designated moon goo systems is making null sec stagnant. There needs to be a new mechanic for people to want to fight over. Something that DOESN'T give the holders money cause that just helps fund the holders to defend the space forever. Null sec needs to be more volatile. The question is now, what possible thing can you give null secers that doesn't have a monetary value? Could it perhaps be some item or group of items have more functional value then ISK? And it's only valuable to null secers so that they cant sell ti to high secers?

The Drake is a Lie
Torneach
Doomheim
#43 - 2012-05-09 01:19:10 UTC
Cloned S0ul wrote:
+1 for OP trol or not he say truth

"0.0 space is a nap fest, everything is blue.."

Totaly Right nullbears and pirates are bored form 0.0 - low sec so they hunt miners or mission runers...

And now see Eve Online Sovereignty map changes form 2007 to Jan.2012, here no big changes! Same colors-alliances names on same map places almost no changes since X years, the big changes while BLUE color dissapere was by click button not because somone was awesome and true warrior.

1599 Days of Eve Online Influence/Sovereignty Map 2007 to Jan 2012


I saw lots of changes, even saw Goonswarm get wiped off the map cause their old leader decided to scrap the alliance and run off with the loot (if I remember correctly).

What other people in this thread have said is true - there are periods of intense activity followed by a lull, followed by another period of intense activity. Surely you don't expect people to war constantly?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#44 - 2012-05-09 01:23:19 UTC
Torneach wrote:
I saw lots of changes, even saw Goonswarm get wiped off the map cause their old leader decided to scrap the alliance and run off with the loot (if I remember correctly).

What other people in this thread have said is true - there are periods of intense activity followed by a lull, followed by another period of intense activity. Surely you don't expect people to war constantly?

That did happen, but I think losing sov was forgetting to pay the bills.

We did get disbanded too, so yeah~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Gretix
Einherjar of Vanaheimr
#45 - 2012-05-09 01:23:23 UTC
NickyYo wrote:
0.0 space is a nap fest, everything is blue..
Something needs to be created; something that is..

  • Extremely valuable
  • Scarce
  • Worth fighting for
  • A game changer


Eve needs 0.0 at each others necks, we need a new big war! thus will make that happen!
BOB should have never been allowed to disband by the push of a button.. I wonder what 0.0 would be like now?

Basically this sums up 0.0 space atm; No conflict, blue, nothing worth fighting for as everyone is already rich and has a trillion titans.



No conflict? You haven't been around long have you?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#46 - 2012-05-09 01:25:26 UTC
Gretix wrote:
NickyYo wrote:
0.0 space is a nap fest, everything is blue..
Something needs to be created; something that is..

  • Extremely valuable
  • Scarce
  • Worth fighting for
  • A game changer


Eve needs 0.0 at each others necks, we need a new big war! thus will make that happen!
BOB should have never been allowed to disband by the push of a button.. I wonder what 0.0 would be like now?

Basically this sums up 0.0 space atm; No conflict, blue, nothing worth fighting for as everyone is already rich and has a trillion titans.

No conflict? You haven't been around long have you?

Titans ~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Gretix
Einherjar of Vanaheimr
#47 - 2012-05-09 01:27:16 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Gretix wrote:
NickyYo wrote:
0.0 space is a nap fest, everything is blue..
Something needs to be created; something that is..

  • Extremely valuable
  • Scarce
  • Worth fighting for
  • A game changer


Eve needs 0.0 at each others necks, we need a new big war! thus will make that happen!
BOB should have never been allowed to disband by the push of a button.. I wonder what 0.0 would be like now?

Basically this sums up 0.0 space atm; No conflict, blue, nothing worth fighting for as everyone is already rich and has a trillion titans.

No conflict? You haven't been around long have you?

Titans ~



Right? lol
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#48 - 2012-05-09 01:54:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
I've mentioned it time and time again so cba to post the details here again so tl;dr:

- Huge parts of nullsec are unpopulated wastelands.
- That is because there is no incentive for anyone not holding the sov to go there because there is nothing to strike at with a small, mobile gang since anything of value is protected by millions of EHP and Timers. Other than some e-peen stroking with killmails killing an idiot ratter, there is no point for a small outside entitity to roam that space.
- Likewise, there is no reason for members of large alliances to log in a lot - whenever anything of value is reinforced, you do a jabber ping, people log on their alliance alts and form up the blob. In case you're a grunt and dependent on ratting income, you're better off in highsec - no need to watch anything, no hauling to highsec required.

So:


Make nullsec assets more vulnerable - enable people to e.g. steal from moon mining arrays. This would encourage people to go to null as well as kill AFK empires who just log on their supercaps whenever income is threatened.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
NickyYo
modro
The Initiative.
#49 - 2012-05-09 02:00:28 UTC  |  Edited by: NickyYo
Torneach wrote:
Cloned S0ul wrote:
+1 for OP trol or not he say truth

"0.0 space is a nap fest, everything is blue.."

Totaly Right nullbears and pirates are bored form 0.0 - low sec so they hunt miners or mission runers...

And now see Eve Online Sovereignty map changes form 2007 to Jan.2012, here no big changes! Same colors-alliances names on same map places almost no changes since X years, the big changes while BLUE color dissapere was by click button not because somone was awesome and true warrior.

1599 Days of Eve Online Influence/Sovereignty Map 2007 to Jan 2012


I saw lots of changes, even saw Goonswarm get wiped off the map cause their old leader decided to scrap the alliance and run off with the loot (if I remember correctly).

What other people in this thread have said is true - there are periods of intense activity followed by a lull, followed by another period of intense activity. Surely you don't expect people to war constantly?


=

..
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#50 - 2012-05-09 02:01:54 UTC
Large Collidable Object wrote:
Make nullsec assets more vulnerable - enable people to e.g. steal from moon mining arrays. This would encourage people to go to null as well as kill AFK empires who just log on their supercaps whenever income is threatened.


Yup. This is the "farms and fields" concept that has been generally agreed upon in theoretical form, finding the practical form being the hard part.

Average nullsec grunt residents in space extracting wealth based on structures that are vulnerable to small gangs. IHubs and pocos are an attempt, but still based on this all or nothing destruction timer. The holy grail is some kind of gradated extraction of value from sov space based on being there and using it.

If someone can actually design a good system like that, let CCP know and you'll probably get a job out of it.
Shian Yang
#51 - 2012-05-09 02:07:12 UTC
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
I find it hard to believe that people continue to build square houses in zones well known for high winds and tornadoes. The lip on the roof alone creates a perfect catch allowing the roof to be ripped right off. Building design should be based more on the biodome, which not only builds its strength on itself but also creates far less drag. Many area's could save millions each year in clean up and rebuilding efforts.


Greetings capsuleer Dietrich,

Is there a mechanism for recovering any of the excess energy? This would be useful on some planetary environments and could perhaps lead to increased profitability of some of the outlying colonies.

Regards,

Shian Yang
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#52 - 2012-05-09 02:26:38 UTC
NickyYo wrote:
Thanks for all the troll and you suck posts, nice posting guys, nicccceee...

Now anyone want to give me some constructive criticism?


When the sign on the door says pull...

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Large Collidable Object
morons.
#53 - 2012-05-09 02:42:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
Darth Tickles wrote:
Large Collidable Object wrote:
Make nullsec assets more vulnerable - enable people to e.g. steal from moon mining arrays. This would encourage people to go to null as well as kill AFK empires who just log on their supercaps whenever income is threatened.


Yup. This is the "farms and fields" concept that has been generally agreed upon in theoretical form, finding the practical form being the hard part.

Average nullsec grunt residents in space extracting wealth based on structures that are vulnerable to small gangs. IHubs and pocos are an attempt, but still based on this all or nothing destruction timer. The holy grail is some kind of gradated extraction of value from sov space based on being there and using it.

If someone can actually design a good system like that, let CCP know and you'll probably get a job out of it.



Well - I already have a job CCP wouldn't be able to top, but the problem when Dominion was rolled out were the complaints about timezone differences which lead to the Implementation of said EHP buffers and timers.

Ironically, they were introduced to give smaller entities some space to breathe, but when you give entity A (large and international) and entity B (small and timezone-restricted) more time to organize, it's a force-multiplier for entity A in the long run as entity B will be worn down with constant alarm clocking if they're on the offensive (if people still do that).

If nullsec was dependent on constant population, which would only be achieved by vulnerable assets it would lead to a far more diverse and layered structure. If I'd ninja-rat a nullsec entities space, I would probably take a complex away from them, but also help them to upgrade their space - so it doesn't hurt them at all.

Enabling small gangs to hurt their passive income (not sov) more effectively would be an awesome incentive for small gang PvP and would add an another layer to eves tactical depth.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#54 - 2012-05-09 02:49:51 UTC
Ya, I was thinking it has to be something that you "wind up", so going into your peak time(s) you want to be extracting the max value for your space, but if small gangs were there disrupting your activities/shooting your structures, then that "winding up" would be lessened accordingly. So if you just pos up for an hour while smacking in local, when you do get back to the anoms and belts there will be a notable loss in the value you are now extracting.

Right now it's either reinforcement timers or people just dock up and wait for you to leave. There has to be an incentive to be in space, using it, and defending it for extended and uninterrupted periods.
Amitious Turkey
10kSubnautic
Warriors of the Blood God
#55 - 2012-05-09 02:50:48 UTC
If everything is blue, just set everything to red. That'll take care of your boredom.

Shocked

I like to lick things.

Haunting the forums since 03.
Large Collidable Object
morons.
#56 - 2012-05-09 03:08:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Large Collidable Object
Well - I have that dream about something I would call 'complete alliances'.

To be effective, they need to cover all timezones and all professions and then take up as much space as they'd be able to crowd with constant population.

Under current mechanics, it's hardly possible to 'overstretch' for an alliance being able to flield the critical blob-mass at any time they can stront their stuff for and having the necessary number of titans to bridge them around.

R&D (if necessary except supercap building) is outsourced to highsec alt alliances or not done at all and space rented to RMT botting alliances.

That would require lots of changes though:

- Revamping any R&D to be far more profitable in low/0.0 than in high
- Massive nerfs to highsec income opportunities
- Vulnerable 0.0 space as detailed above


Eve needs highsec as a walking pen for noobs and a common marketplace -everything else should be shifted to low/null.
You know... [morons.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4gjOx65yD5A)
Micheal Dietrich
Kings Gambit Black
#57 - 2012-05-09 03:19:28 UTC
Shian Yang wrote:
Micheal Dietrich wrote:
I find it hard to believe that people continue to build square houses in zones well known for high winds and tornadoes. The lip on the roof alone creates a perfect catch allowing the roof to be ripped right off. Building design should be based more on the biodome, which not only builds its strength on itself but also creates far less drag. Many area's could save millions each year in clean up and rebuilding efforts.


Greetings capsuleer Dietrich,

Is there a mechanism for recovering any of the excess energy? This would be useful on some planetary environments and could perhaps lead to increased profitability of some of the outlying colonies.

Regards,

Shian Yang



Um, not sure what you want here. Guy just asked for some constructive criticism so I offered some criticism on something constructive in manner. If you are asking for a way to transport energy to a distant planet I would say that is far more inefficient than just having a colony produce it's own power source, as you would just be expending one fuel to haul another.

Out of Pod is getting In the Pod - Join in game channel **IG OOPE **
Ban Bindy
Bindy Brothers Pottery Association
True Reign
#58 - 2012-05-09 03:39:18 UTC
There should be a cap size on corps and alliances, to prevent huge power blocs from forming.

More NPC stations even in deep null, so that sov space is easier to invade.

An alliance or corp ought to be able to defend and hold a pos against even a large fleet of ships; maybe not all poses, but at least one per corp. As it is, few corps manage to defend the pos before it is reinforced, and at that point the biggest fleet, either defender or attacker, usually wins.

Make it easier for corps to hold limited space and harder for them to hold big chunks of space, the design being to get "smallholders" into Eve.

This is the biggest gap in the Eve design. Mid-size corps (100+ members) should be able to evolve into null sec and stay there. My alt's corp did that, but found the process of staying there to be too time consuming. Too easy for the bigger alliances to chase us out.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#59 - 2012-05-09 03:40:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Large Collidable Object wrote:
Ironically, they were introduced to give smaller entities some space to breathe, but when you give entity A (large and international) and entity B (small and timezone-restricted) more time to organize, it's a force-multiplier for entity A in the long run as entity B will be worn down with constant alarm clocking if they're on the offensive (if people still do that).

Note that without timers, entity A's supercapital fleet and (possibly more than one) capital fleet would kill of entity B's structures and have their own POSes and sov up over a single weekend. Or possibly one day.

Consider with timers, an entire region in about a week. Now a small group with about 10 systems. You might be looking at a few hours to shoot all their poses without timers.


Also, even large alliances might have to alarm clock if their say eurotime strength isn't as massive as the smaller eurotime focused corp. You can also tire them out with the constant shoot pos, repair pos battle (structure-based warfare)

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#60 - 2012-05-09 03:47:30 UTC
Ban Bindy wrote:
There should be a cap size on corps and alliances, to prevent huge power blocs from forming.

Consider the CFC, which comprises many "alliances" which are connected via external communications methods. This wouldn't quite work like you imagine. We had max suzed corps before, and it was hilarious to see all the corp names ...

Ban Bindy wrote:
An alliance or corp ought to be able to defend and hold a pos against even a large fleet of ships; maybe not all poses, but at least one per corp. As it is, few corps manage to defend the pos before it is reinforced, and at that point the biggest fleet, either defender or attacker, usually wins.

Essentially, this means the massive groups would be nigh imprenetrable. If 10 ships can hold off 50, then a simple 100 man fleet takes 500?
Ban Bindy wrote:
Make it easier for corps to hold limited space and harder for them to hold big chunks of space, the design being to get "smallholders" into Eve.

Depending on how you go about this, see above with multiple "holding" alliances and so on.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?