EVE General Discussion

You should have kept on reading rather that go into instant strawman mode. Fallacies don't make for good arguments, you know.

So no, if you think that's the case, you have to be pretty stupid. Good thing that you were the one who said it, and not me.

…except that it doesn't. If 70% of active characters are in highsec, that means that 70% of active characters are in highsec. Nothing more, nothing less. It tells us absolutely nothing about where there are more people, because “people” and “characters” are not the same thing. For every person, there are (according to the guesstimates) two accounts; for every account, there are just over two characters. For every character, we have no idea which one is actually active.

So, again, considering the widespread use of “utility alts”, and considering the convenience factor of having an alt in highsec for various purposes, we can quite easily imagine that for every non-highsec character, the same player has a highsec alt and suddenly those 30% non-highsec characters translate into the game having 60% non-highsec players.

Let's see if you can read it properly this time. Just for reference, I'm saying that 60% > 40%.

No, it doesn't have to, but it can and therefore this steadfast claim from highseccers that they are a majority is highly misplaced. They have nothing to actually support this assertion that doesn't rely on exactly the same kind of assumptions that would say that they are actually a minority.

Actually, that just makes it worse: it means that, if you were the standard for highsec, those 70% highsec characters (about 600k) only account for 120k players out of the 200k guesstimated from the game having 400k accounts. That kind of weighting alone reduced the population by 10 percentage points, and that's before we include the highsec alts (which, while we can debate how numerous they are, do indeed exist). At this point, only one highsec alt is needed for every four non-highsec character for the highseccers to lose their presumed majority status.

Not really. Quite the opposite: carebears seem rather obsessed with gankers. Gankers just look for something that can be ganked.

I can't give you a number for reason of knowing it would be wild guess at best. I really can't hope to estimate it accurately. The subset of people I know who play and generally know where their alts are is very highsec skewed. Despite none having only a single account, none are "nullsec focused." The closest runs WH sites, but does so to pay for highsec PvP. I also can't really see us being the only ones, but I could be way off base.

Exactly. If we use you as a standard for a non-highseccer, then those 30% non-highsec characters translate into 47% non-highsec players.

…and we haven't even begun to touch on the assumption that highsec players all want highsec to be the same, when there those who, by any measure, are highsec players, but who still want it to become a lot more risky, unsafe and insecure, and who agree with the push towards low/null.

Allow anyone over +2.5 sec status shoot at anyone under -2.5 sec status, the issue will go away.

I played UO-Online and left for entirely other reasons. If you had a house placed somewhere and did not refresh the thing once every few days it would vanish. After going on vacation for a long weekend and returning to find everything gone (100's of Vanq weapons and other rares), I promptly quit playing. It was not the PvP that drove me out but the lack of common sense from the developers in reguard to the value I placed on my goods in the game. My guess is that I was not the only one that left prior to the additions of non-pvp areas in UO and the carebears were touted to try to regain those subscriptions.

Players are creative and will find ways to work around the mechanics of the game to take advantage of others, this is much easier to accept then poor quality of planning and programming on the developers end. However, the main reason I feel UO is not the game it used to be is that well its old, It was created years before EVE - EQ - WoW Etc. It was also more of an experiment then anything. When subscriptions dropped they tried everything to regain their losses, many ideas which may not have worked. So there is a lot to learn from the other MMO's but lets not be too quick describing the situations that lead to their successes or losses.

I will add that I feel Hardcore gaming is a recipe for long term MMO subscriptions. Still you need room for new players to learn and grow into the hardcore gamers, and that includes casual players who are doing care-bear missions till they have the time, resources, and connections to compete in the more hardcore aspects of EvE.

And while I don't disagree with anything you said, none of those numbers will have any bearing on the outcome of High Sec in the long term.

CCP inch by inch moves towards a safer High Sec to encourage the new players to stay in the game, it offers tit bits of incentive way too late to get involved in pvp once they've become totally risk adverse.

Then the calls to make High Sec become even safer ring out and CCP will end up responding to it as no credible plan to get people involved in the greater game.

The NPE and community (HTFU noob) at large fails to introduce people to the game properly with only the Goons and TEST having a clue how to do a NPE properly and it's about time those lessons were learnt.

k, lets do that.

You guys really need to stop listening to the passive income specialists in Deklein then. The guys who in one thread say Morphite is only really worth 8-10K but at the same time have no reservations about driving technetium to 210K each. Then turn around and zerg the game with fleets that don't even use Technetium and very little morphite.

Yes, we all want a bigger piece of the pie but you have no problem ignoring me or 300,000 other EVE players. Yet you seem to perk up when the residents of Deklein speak out.

Bolded all failed on their own merit actually, Thought youd lump Star Trek Online in there even tho it as an MMO launched even without any penalty for death at all other that hit the "respawn" button... THAT game DEFINATELY failed all on its own.



Brilliant. Turn that over to the Goons... THATD work
Literally noone in game NOT a Goon, sounds great

I have four characters, all four are currently in high sec (moved the last one out of a wh last week). I would like high sec to be less safe.