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Unified Winferno is now live - and it sucks as much it did on test server

First post
Author
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-05-07 11:48:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Grey Stormshadow
http://i50.tinypic.com/2ez1wz4.jpg

If you want to know more...
read all about it, go test and don't hesitate to leave your personal opinion after done. This is one of those moments when it just might be worth to do so. The blog forgets to mention thing or two.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#2 - 2012-05-07 12:33:11 UTC
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
http://i50.tinypic.com/2ez1wz4.jpg



That gave me a laugh, I like things that do stuff.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Smoking Blunts
ZC Omega
#3 - 2012-05-07 12:39:07 UTC
Serge Bastana wrote:
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
http://i50.tinypic.com/2ez1wz4.jpg



That gave me a laugh, I like things that do stuff.



made me laugh also..

just a shame it dosnt do as much as it promises to do

OMG when can i get a pic here

SpaceSquirrels
#4 - 2012-05-07 14:08:11 UTC
I must be missing something.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#5 - 2012-05-07 14:18:23 UTC
Seems like despite huge advantages with the new system, some small bits of functionality need to be added here and there. Top that off with a liberal helping of people complaining because they can't use their clunky work arounds anymore.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Solhild
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-05-07 14:27:33 UTC
New build up now, I like the idea of the window and how it's intended to function when done - hoping for progress on the WIP.
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-05-07 15:14:39 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
Seems like despite huge advantages with the new system, some small bits of functionality need to be added here and there. Top that off with a liberal helping of people complaining because they can't use their clunky work arounds anymore.

Pretty optimistic to call them bits small, but if that works for you who am I to say. I find the original idea of one window for everything and no real support for others being quite big "bit" myself.

This is in test server - yes. Dev blog is out - yes. Dev response to fundamental issues - none.

Read the entire comment thread... at least up to page 24 and you get the whole idea what this is about. I'm not whining here just to for whining. In fact I rather would do something else atm :) The details are all there.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#8 - 2012-05-07 15:54:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
Seems like despite huge advantages with the new system, some small bits of functionality need to be added here and there. Top that off with a liberal helping of people complaining because they can't use their clunky work arounds anymore.

Pretty optimistic to call them bits small, but if that works for you who am I to say. I find the original idea of one window for everything and no real support for others being quite big "bit" myself.

This is in test server - yes. Dev blog is out - yes. Dev response to fundamental issues - none.

Read the entire comment thread... at least up to page 24 and you get the whole idea what this is about. I'm not whining here just to for whining. In fact I rather would do something else atm :) The details are all there.


I read it.

You can drag anything you like to the "tree" on the left to move things around.

Shift click on the tree to open another window if you prefer means there isn't much left to complain about. Most of the rest are niche cases or center around wanting to do things in a somewhat eccentric way. For the vast majority of routine tasks this is much easier, only for some things does it require an extra click or two.

I stand by my original statement.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.

Thomas Kreshant
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-05-07 16:01:38 UTC
Grey Stormshadow wrote:


This is in test server - yes. Dev blog is out - yes. Dev response to fundamental issues - none.



It was the weekend, how about you cut them some slack?

They'd have come back and seen plenty of feedback to read so how about giving them some time to actually read and digest it before moaning they're not responding on their days off work.
Blatant Forum Alt
Doomheim
#10 - 2012-05-07 16:25:54 UTC
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
Oh God, why are they changing stuff? Why change?!? I can't cope with change! Make it stop, or I will spew butthurt on the forums until someone listens! Don't make me bring out THE CAPS LOCK!!!!111 I USED 1'S INSTEAD OF !'S, THATS HOW PISSED OFF I AM!!!!!1111!!ONE

Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#11 - 2012-05-07 16:34:58 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:


I read it.

You can drag anything you like to the "tree" on the left to move things around.

Shift click on the tree to open another window if you prefer means there isn't much left to complain about. Most of the rest are niche cases or center around wanting to do things in a somewhat eccentric way. For the vast majority of routine tasks this is much easier, only for some things does it require an extra click or two.

I stand by my original statement.


I agree with this.

Only things worth complaining about are just simple tweaks.

I LOVE the new filter system. I created a filter that shows all but cans so that I can hide the cans to prevent accidental repackaging of them.

I think the only thing I'd like to be added is so options for the "value" thingy. Lemme pick between universe average, regional average and regional max buy order or regional lowest sell order.

The Drake is a Lie

CCP Arrow
C C P
C C P Alliance
#12 - 2012-05-07 16:37:57 UTC
Hey this is great Big smile I lol'd out loud, oh and I'm reading this thread now, sorry about late reply, we have been monitoring the official feedback thread of the blog over the weekend and are collecting valuable input for iteration tasks as well as setting up User testing sessions to be able to actually observe in action the things you are describing so that the changes and fixes we do will be the right ones.

CCP Arrow   |   Director of User Experience   |   EVE Online   |   @CCP_Arrow

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#13 - 2012-05-07 16:44:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Ranger 1 wrote:
Shift click on the tree to open another window if you prefer means there isn't much left to complain about.
Yes there is, because the multiple-window functionality is broken. The inventory system isn't aware of the fact that you can have multiple windows so it has a nasty habit of resetting itself and make all those windows more of a chore than an aid. This is not a niche case — it's every case for unopened containers.

Wanting to drag stuff from one place to the next while keeping both locations in view is not “eccentric” — it's how you most efficiently handle multiple storage locations. What's eccentric is the new system's aptitude for breaking this kind of work flow because it wants to be a one-window system and thus cannot properly handle multiple windows.

There are nice bits and pieces, but anything that requires significant amounts of inventory manipulation is made much harder and requires far more clicks now than it did before. It has also lost much of its ability to set up a “work space” and have consistently appear and behave the same. It works as a framework for an inventory management system, but it is far from being one at the moment due to that multi-window unawareness.
CCP Soundwave
C C P
C C P Alliance
#14 - 2012-05-07 16:47:14 UTC
I'd just like to confirm that "winferno" is indeed going to be awesome.
Blatant Forum Alt
Doomheim
#15 - 2012-05-07 16:50:16 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Ranger 1 wrote:
Shift click on the tree to open another window if you prefer means there isn't much left to complain about.
Yes there is, because the multiple-window functionality is broken. The inventory system isn't aware of the fact that you can have multiple windows so it has a nasty habit of resetting itself and make all those windows more of a chore than an aid. This is not a niche case — it's every case for unopened containers.

Wanting to drag stuff from one place to the next while keeping both locations in view is not “eccentric” — it's how you most efficiently handle multiple storage locations. What's eccentric is the new system's aptitude for breaking this kind of work flow because it wants to be a one-window system and thus cannot properly handle multiple windows.

There are nice bits and pieces, but anything that requires significant amounts of inventory manipulation is made much harder and requires far more clicks now than it did before. It has also lost much of its ability to set up a “work space” and have consistently appear and behave the same. It works as a framework for an inventory management system, but it is far from being one at the moment due to that multi-window unawareness.

/serious post
Then this is a problem with implementation, rather than design concepts, and most of the whining I've read has been about the change to a unified window - hence the troll post up there ^
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#16 - 2012-05-07 16:56:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Blatant Forum Alt wrote:
Then this is a problem with implementation, rather than design concepts, and most of the whining I've read has been about the change to a unified window - hence the troll post up there ^
Sure, I can agree with that. The problem is that a lot of the implementation issues seem like they are direct effects of the attempt to move towards that unified window. Somewhere along the line, the thought that maybe some things shouldn't be fully unified seems to have been overlooked.

The whines about the unification is how that design concept imposes itself onto a lot of use cases that outright call for multiple windows. It's kind of the design version of “categorical statements are categorically false”.

I can fully understand the exuberance in putting everything they could into this new system, but now they need to step back and see what about the old system was actually useful (even more useful than the new one, in some cases), and ensure that those pre-existing good solutions are not overwritten with bad ones.
Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-05-07 16:58:10 UTC  |  Edited by: Grey Stormshadow
CCP Arrow wrote:
Hey this is great Big smile I lol'd out loud, oh and I'm reading this thread now, sorry about late reply, we have been monitoring the official feedback thread of the blog over the weekend and are collecting valuable input for iteration tasks as well as setting up User testing sessions to be able to actually observe in action the things you are describing so that the changes and fixes we do will be the right ones.

Thank you.

And seriously - I'd really rather be doing something else. Only real reason why am I in forums again is to make people aware about the many not so kewl things which were not mentioned in dev blog. You guys had wonderful intentions but left to the task assuming that all people would rather use one window than many windows. How ever as pointed in official thread, there are many real in game occasions where one window just won't handle the task you want it to do. Sure - it may do it for some like mr ranger above, or it may do it for majority of casual players. It still doesn't change the fact that it would be huge nerf and inconvenience to great many.

If you address the fact, make a firm statement to do something about it and be kind enough to leave blue post about it - at least I'm done with this whiny part again and carry on to more fun tasks like running in a forest naked with only tinfoil hat on.

...and yes that picture was intended to have some comedy attached to it - I'm not yet ready to stab you guys even soundwave may have told you so.

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Grey Stormshadow
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2012-05-09 00:25:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Grey Stormshadow
CCP Soundwave wrote:
I'd just like to confirm that "winferno" is indeed going to be awesome.

Indeed - at least we won't be barbecuing at the "door" this time Roll
http://i46.tinypic.com/2nhe3he.jpg

Get classic forum style - custom videos to captains quarters screen

Play with the best - die like the rest

Maul555
Xen Investments
#19 - 2012-05-10 14:46:21 UTC
So dev responses go here now? Please CCP, roll these changes into the Assets window and leave my UI alone! I really really really really cannot emphasize enough how much I do not like using that unified inventory window for everything. I have made several long posts on the subject where such posts belong. I shall assume that someone who effects this project has read them.
Mythrandier
Solace Corp
#20 - 2012-05-10 15:07:05 UTC
Serge Bastana wrote:
Grey Stormshadow wrote:
http://i50.tinypic.com/2ez1wz4.jpg



That gave me a laugh, I like things that do stuff.



Stuff you say? Hmmmm, Intriguing.

"In the beginning the Universe was created. This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move." -  D. Adams.

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