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Bringing mulitplayer to missions
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FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#1 - 2012-05-04 19:14:14 UTC
About a month ago I was writing a blog post about all the different kinds of PVP that exist in Eve. As I was listing various activities and the ways in which we can impact each other, it occurred to me that missions are apparently the only activity in which, by design, we fly solo. Obviously a ninja can invade and sometimes interrupt your mission, but a competent missioner can almost always just ignore ninjas and go on about their business, completing the mission with no problems but some lost loot.

So what I want to asking the missions community is this: would you like to see more cooperative/competitive play brought into missions? What do you think it would look like?

On the cooperative side, I think it would be awesome to have a new kind of corporate missions, assigned to a corporation rather than character and requiring a wide variety of skills. Perhaps require things to be done in sequence in multiple places to encourage better coordination. This would be great for smaller groups looking for something to do together.

As for competition, I should start by saying that I'm not wanting missioners to have to compete in deadspace. I have a lot of half-formed ideas on this, but none of them to the point I could write them out. So I'll just ask: how would missioners compete, if you did?

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Kalli Brixzat
#2 - 2012-05-04 19:25:57 UTC
Missions do not HAVE TO be a solo activity. I mission with friends most of the time. I'd say about 25% of my missions are solo endeavors. Do I need the help? Certainly not. Is it more fun to do this with friends? Heck yeah, it is.

As for what you're suggesting - love the idea. Feels a little like a relay race mated with an easter egg hunt, but it's an interesting concept. Corp-wide missions would be an amazing addition.
Derath Ellecon
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2012-05-04 19:44:18 UTC
Kalli Brixzat wrote:
Missions do not HAVE TO be a solo activity. I mission with friends most of the time. I'd say about 25% of my missions are solo endeavors. Do I need the help? Certainly not. Is it more fun to do this with friends? Heck yeah, it is.

As for what you're suggesting - love the idea. Feels a little like a relay race mated with an easter egg hunt, but it's an interesting concept. Corp-wide missions would be an amazing addition.



sure you can fleet up for missions, but the missions are specifically designed as a solo activity. For example, person a could not start a mission and person b complete it.

Yes I think it could be cool to have missions specifically designed as multiplayer.

I recall in past MMO's having missions (or quests) that specifically required 2 teams. In some cases it required 2 separate teams that had to work in conjunction, one side unlocking parts for the other etc. They were great fun.
Pinstar Colton
Sweet Asteroid Acres
#4 - 2012-05-04 19:53:03 UTC
Isn't this what incursions are? PvE combat designed with fleets of players cooperating in mind?

In the cat-and-mouse game that is low sec, there is no shame in learning to be a better mouse.

FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#5 - 2012-05-04 19:53:58 UTC
What about the other side of the coin, competition? I'd really like to see something connecting missions to Eve's overall competitive spirit somehow. I'm just struggling for a good way to do that. It could be racing others to get to a prize or competing for a "unique" mission that has special rewards, I don't know. Just...*something* to make missions more than "click agent, undock, warp to mission, shoot plusses, dock, click agent"

To be honest, I don't see how people do them for long. It's been a year since I personally ran missions because I found them too repetitive. Still they're a major part of Eve, and there's nothing in this game that couldn't get better.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Kalli Brixzat
#6 - 2012-05-04 19:58:32 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
What about the other side of the coin, competition? I'd really like to see something connecting missions to Eve's overall competitive spirit somehow. I'm just struggling for a good way to do that. It could be racing others to get to a prize or competing for a "unique" mission that has special rewards, I don't know. Just...*something* to make missions more than "click agent, undock, warp to mission, shoot plusses, dock, click agent"

To be honest, I don't see how people do them for long. It's been a year since I personally ran missions because I found them too repetitive. Still they're a major part of Eve, and there's nothing in this game that couldn't get better.


Faction Warfare says hi.
FloppieTheBanjoClown
Arcana Imperii Ltd.
#7 - 2012-05-04 20:00:58 UTC
Kalli Brixzat wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
What about the other side of the coin, competition? I'd really like to see something connecting missions to Eve's overall competitive spirit somehow. I'm just struggling for a good way to do that. It could be racing others to get to a prize or competing for a "unique" mission that has special rewards, I don't know. Just...*something* to make missions more than "click agent, undock, warp to mission, shoot plusses, dock, click agent"

To be honest, I don't see how people do them for long. It's been a year since I personally ran missions because I found them too repetitive. Still they're a major part of Eve, and there's nothing in this game that couldn't get better.


Faction Warfare says hi.

FW doesn't encompass all missions though. I'm talking about bringing more multiplayer aspects to ALL missions.

Founding member of the Belligerent Undesirables movement.
Kalli Brixzat
#8 - 2012-05-04 22:28:51 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Kalli Brixzat wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
What about the other side of the coin, competition? I'd really like to see something connecting missions to Eve's overall competitive spirit somehow. I'm just struggling for a good way to do that. It could be racing others to get to a prize or competing for a "unique" mission that has special rewards, I don't know. Just...*something* to make missions more than "click agent, undock, warp to mission, shoot plusses, dock, click agent"

To be honest, I don't see how people do them for long. It's been a year since I personally ran missions because I found them too repetitive. Still they're a major part of Eve, and there's nothing in this game that couldn't get better.


Faction Warfare says hi.

FW doesn't encompass all missions though. I'm talking about bringing more multiplayer aspects to ALL missions.


I can't really think of a way for that to work other than to match opposing players/teams through missions. One team tries to blow up a structure or some particular rat while the other team defends. That's a little too APB for my taste though.
Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#9 - 2012-05-04 22:46:09 UTC
I remember EW football.

For those how do not know: 2 teams try to tractor a can to their goal. They can only use web, points, and the 4 types of racial EW (of which only ECM is really useful). And of course a tractor beam.

So what if we have missions where the goal is to move objects, or collect drops from several NPCs, or just kill the most NPCs, and give all players in that area license to use webs, scrams, and EW on each other without CONCORD intervention? CONCORD would only be called if one player did damage to another.

Know a Frozen fan? Check this out

Frozen fanfiction
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#10 - 2012-05-04 23:17:45 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
Kalli Brixzat wrote:
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
What about the other side of the coin, competition? I'd really like to see something connecting missions to Eve's overall competitive spirit somehow. I'm just struggling for a good way to do that. It could be racing others to get to a prize or competing for a "unique" mission that has special rewards, I don't know. Just...*something* to make missions more than "click agent, undock, warp to mission, shoot plusses, dock, click agent"

To be honest, I don't see how people do them for long. It's been a year since I personally ran missions because I found them too repetitive. Still they're a major part of Eve, and there's nothing in this game that couldn't get better.


Faction Warfare says hi.

FW doesn't encompass all missions though. I'm talking about bringing more multiplayer aspects to ALL missions.


Dead on Arival...

Incursions, level 5 missions and faction warfare pretty much cover everything.

Competent mission runners blow up their wrecks as soon as Ninja comes along.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#11 - 2012-05-05 00:11:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhilia Mann
Quote:
FW doesn't encompass all missions though. I'm talking about bringing more multiplayer aspects to ALL missions.


Ok, why would you want that? Between incursions, FW, any number of null plexes, high end wormholes, and the option to share mission rewards there is no dearth of group PvE options. Lots of players, myself included, like a bit of an opportunity to be misanthropic while playing and solo missions provide that (note: they are far from my first choice these days, but I've had some years to work that out for myself). Why would you build in arbitrary multiplayer any more than it's already there?
Kahega Amielden
Rifterlings
#12 - 2012-05-05 00:25:44 UTC
None of those group PVE options do anything for a player without months of skill training and a logi/well-skilled battleship.

Missions should be revamped to be less ****, even if for no other reason than because they're the only PVE (other than non-WH exploration, which is equally bad) available to newbies.
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#13 - 2012-05-05 00:59:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhilia Mann
Double fail post, again...
Zhilia Mann
Tide Way Out Productions
#14 - 2012-05-05 01:00:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Zhilia Mann
Kahega Amielden wrote:
None of those group PVE options do anything for a player without months of skill training and a logi/well-skilled battleship.


Dude, all high end PvE options require months of training to do properly, not just the group options. FW even has a pretty low barrier to entry.

Kahega Amielden wrote:
Missions should be revamped to be less ****, even if for no other reason than because they're the only PVE (other than non-WH exploration, which is equally bad) available to newbies.


I guess I have to agree that missions need work, but they definitely shouldn't be mindlessly driven towards group participation. I swear the worst thing I ever did in this game was trick out a mission Mach and blitz away. Boring. As. ****. But not something team work would have solved -- at least not for me.
Flurk Hellbron
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-05-05 14:58:27 UTC
I think Missions should be made less predictable and so become less repetitive.
Make em more dangerous so people will group up to do them.
Herr Ronin
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2012-05-05 19:11:27 UTC
FloppieTheBanjoClown wrote:
About a month ago I was writing a blog post about all the different kinds of PVP that exist in Eve. As I was listing various activities and the ways in which we can impact each other, it occurred to me that missions are apparently the only activity in which, by design, we fly solo. Obviously a ninja can invade and sometimes interrupt your mission, but a competent missioner can almost always just ignore ninjas and go on about their business, completing the mission with no problems but some lost loot.

So what I want to asking the missions community is this: would you like to see more cooperative/competitive play brought into missions? What do you think it would look like?

On the cooperative side, I think it would be awesome to have a new kind of corporate missions, assigned to a corporation rather than character and requiring a wide variety of skills. Perhaps require things to be done in sequence in multiple places to encourage better coordination. This would be great for smaller groups looking for something to do together.

As for competition, I should start by saying that I'm not wanting missioners to have to compete in deadspace. I have a lot of half-formed ideas on this, but none of them to the point I could write them out. So I'll just ask: how would missioners compete, if you did?



In my opinion, Incursions are End Game sort of thing for mission runner's, There is a Ladder in Incursions.

Idiot > Noob > Incursion Runner > Trainee FC > Qualified FC > Make A Community > Train Your Community's FC's > FC The Manifest.

There is so many ways you can go about in incursions.

I'll Race You For A Amburhgear
Fairhand
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2012-05-05 20:15:41 UTC
Some of the Exploration sites are slightly unpredictable... Multiple waves which may or rmay not spawn the entity needed to unlock a gate. They are interesting when compared to the standard mission pattern and are also competitive in that there is a race to the goal. Sadly they are not really cooperative except that you can bring more firepower.

One issue with small group coop missions is the lack of "taunt" or aggro control. We can have a small group with designated tank, dps and logi roles but we cannot easily manage the aggro when new waves spawn.
bubble trout
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2012-05-05 20:36:31 UTC
In my opinion its more about the PvP-competition part of PvE that bugs people more than the solo-able-ness(for lack of a better word lol) that make missions the odd man out. In exploration someone can come in and finish the end/grab the loot after you've killed the vast majority of the stuff, incursion fleets can compete for a site, a bigger better ship can jump to your belt and drive you off of a rat, in a wormhole someone can come in and kill you and steal your loot.

In missions someone can scan you down and steal the object you need to take back to complete it or take some loot, but really they can't "steal" your mission can they? They can't turn that item in for the reward you were working for, they can't kill the majority of rats to complete a kill mission for the reward, and the loot they steal is only a part (sometimes smaller, sometimes larger) of the reward and isk for doing that mission. There is no shortage of mission either like in incursions, or exploration. "Oh he just stole all of my loot/I had to blow up my wrecks, now I have to turn this in for only a part of the reward and grab another." A nija isn't really going to compete for your missions, nor have a huge impact on your isk making, unless you are running level 4s in a drake and really *need* that salvage/loot for the isk/hour(then again get a raven or other battleship).

I really have no idea where you can make decent isk without being open to competition from others during it. Maybe pi, but I've heard of people doing ridiculous things to mess with others on a planet and you do have to move your stuff in dangous space.
Mira Lynne
State War Academy
Caldari State
#19 - 2012-05-06 03:40:14 UTC
Human Interaction? In my PvE? ohwait...

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Korgan Nailo
5ER3NITY INC
The Gorram Shiney Alliance
#20 - 2012-05-08 04:38:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Korgan Nailo
Herr Ronin wrote:

Idiot > Noob > Incursion Runner > Trainee FC > Qualified FC > Make A Community > Train Your Community's FC's > FC The Manifest.

Let me add 2 cents on this:

Idiot > Noob > Idiot in T1 tank > Idiot in T1 guns > Fuc.king Idiot linking awesomez Fitz and flying T1 > Idiot with T2 tank > Noob with T2 guns > Incursion Runner > Trainee FC > Qualified FC > Make A Community > Train Your Community's FC's > FC The Manifest.

There...

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