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Market bots in Amarr?
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Ank Parkor
WildSpace Otters
#1 - 2012-04-30 20:56:20 UTC
Have you noticed some of them?

Some parts of the market are flooded with very fast modifications.
As they are pretty lucrative it could be players but a modification of price each time under 5 minutes sounds weird to me.

[u]Short time trader, short term missionner, long term ambitions.[/u]

Bring justice to EVE: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1171333
Aina Sasaki
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2012-04-30 21:09:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Aina Sasaki
Yeap. It's pretty annoying too. x_x

Well I don't know if its bots...

- Rei
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#3 - 2012-04-30 21:13:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Kara Books
Ank Parkor wrote:
Have you noticed some of them?

Some parts of the market are flooded with very fast modifications.
As they are pretty lucrative it could be players but a modification of price each time under 5 minutes sounds weird to me.


Im keeping a very vigilant eye on Amarr, so far Im happy to say, its looking pretty good.
Im not noticing anything very anoying
obviously there are no rampant bots like before, not even close.
these are players, the market is lucrative, don't whistle till your really onto a single entity DO whistle when your onto something.

I also want to take the opportunity to thank CCP for making merchanting once again enjoyable, there are ALLOT of new people to eve playing the market game, iv talked to a few new guys this month and they are here for the market.
Aina Sasaki
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2012-04-30 21:14:02 UTC
Kara Books wrote:
I also want to take the opportunity to thank CCP for making merchanting once again enjoyable, there are ALLOT of new people to eve playing the market game, iv talked to a few new guys this month and they are here for the market.


One of those is my alt, Yureina. :)

- Rei
Barakach
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-04-30 21:14:49 UTC
Come for the market, stay for the PvP.
Padma Daq
State War Academy
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-04-30 21:25:27 UTC
Yes. it's gotten really bad lately.

I have reported some. Some aren't online anymore, some still are, so not sure if CCP is activly looking into it or if the botters simply switch their characters.

Plus it takes quite a bit of resources to identify a botter in the first place: you have to buy/sell from/to them to get the name, add the character to the watchlist, observe their online time, repeat buying/seling to them to confirm it's the same person undercutting you constantly etc.

I have tried to figure out strategies how to beat them, but near impossible. They have buy orders in really low volumes (often buy orders for just a single item), but compensate with near instant new orders in case the buy order is met and with near instant order adjustment. This way they keep a firm grip on the item in question but have almost zero risk to fail for price fluctuations.
Kara Books
Deal with IT.
#7 - 2012-04-30 21:51:56 UTC
Padma Daq wrote:
Yes. it's gotten really bad lately.

I have reported some. Some aren't online anymore, some still are, so not sure if CCP is activly looking into it or if the botters simply switch their characters.

Plus it takes quite a bit of resources to identify a botter in the first place: you have to buy/sell from/to them to get the name, add the character to the watchlist, observe their online time, repeat buying/seling to them to confirm it's the same person undercutting you constantly etc.

I have tried to figure out strategies how to beat them, but near impossible. They have buy orders in really low volumes (often buy orders for just a single item), but compensate with near instant new orders in case the buy order is met and with near instant order adjustment. This way they keep a firm grip on the item in question but have almost zero risk to fail for price fluctuations.


Recently I made a huge investment into a certain T2 item, which I fear to openly admit as some people dont like me because of my open and public honestly.

for the past 4 days iv bin babysitting it, il penny the thing with 5 buy orders and 10 sell orders.
This is called a market manipulation

Dont get me wrong, im not trying to charge 6M isk for an item worth 3M isk manufacture cost, this was an item being sold 60% below manufacture cost considering the recent inflation, im just trying to make the price closer to manufacture cost.

my 2 and a half cents for this conversation.
Dataa
LightBender Mining and Research Corp
#8 - 2012-04-30 23:47:19 UTC
Padma Daq wrote:
Yes. it's gotten really bad lately.

I have reported some. Some aren't online anymore, some still are, so not sure if CCP is activly looking into it or if the botters simply switch their characters.

Plus it takes quite a bit of resources to identify a botter in the first place: you have to buy/sell from/to them to get the name, add the character to the watchlist, observe their online time, repeat buying/seling to them to confirm it's the same person undercutting you constantly etc.

I have tried to figure out strategies how to beat them, but near impossible. They have buy orders in really low volumes (often buy orders for just a single item), but compensate with near instant new orders in case the buy order is met and with near instant order adjustment. This way they keep a firm grip on the item in question but have almost zero risk to fail for price fluctuations.



Put in a buy order for 1 isk lower than the lowest priced item in the range of their order ...if they auto up the orders they will end up buying the items
Lithalnas
Dirt 'n' Glitter
Local Is Primary
#9 - 2012-05-01 00:00:19 UTC
name and shame? If you tell us what item they are doing someone is going to find a way to drain them of every isk. I have faith in you lot.

https://www.facebook.com/RipSeanVileRatSmith shoot at blue for Vile Rat http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73406
Caleb Ayrania
TarNec
Invisible Exchequer
#10 - 2012-05-01 01:30:32 UTC
High light own order..

Makes every player more effective at changing and modifying orders. 5 min is the server delay.. so it is most likely just 2-5 potential opponents using mouse wheel and folders setup.

Expect even more of this as players get better at using the new UI features..
Lutin Ballista
Ballista Investment Corp
#11 - 2012-05-01 07:52:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Lutin Ballista
Kara Books wrote:


Im keeping a very vigilant eye on Amarr, so far Im happy to say, its looking pretty good.
Im not noticing anything very anoying
obviously there are no rampant bots like before, not even close.


I have to disagree. 1 is making my life a total pain and unless he never eats or sleeps (or just happens to always be on line when I randomly log in through out the day and night to check he is on line) then he is a bot.
Rengerel en Distel
#12 - 2012-05-01 11:37:18 UTC
Lutin Ballista wrote:
Kara Books wrote:


Im keeping a very vigilant eye on Amarr, so far Im happy to say, its looking pretty good.
Im not noticing anything very anoying
obviously there are no rampant bots like before, not even close.


I have to disagree. 1 is making my life a total pain and unless he never eats or sleeps (or just happens to always be on line when I randomly log in through out the day and night to check he is on line) then he is a bot.


not sure 1 would be considered "rampant bots" in order to disagree

With the increase in shiptoasting, the Report timer needs to be shortened.
Ank Parkor
WildSpace Otters
#13 - 2012-05-01 12:05:14 UTC
Of course many of traders are players!

But some parts of the market seem bots controlled to me.
I gave up these items, I just can't compete with.

[u]Short time trader, short term missionner, long term ambitions.[/u]

Bring justice to EVE: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1171333
Stonkeep
Osmanli Empire
#14 - 2012-05-01 14:54:18 UTC
I have been following Amarr market for the last couple of weeks and I must say it is much much better than Dodi. I am slowly moving my business there.
Caleb Ayrania
TarNec
Invisible Exchequer
#15 - 2012-05-01 16:58:19 UTC
Woot traders moving away from over populated and competition hubs to better margins and new territory..

Working as intended then. Hope they give us back those huge ledgers soon.. Then we can really get into healing markets and making the game so much better.
Debiru
Universal Fleet Operations
#16 - 2012-05-01 17:03:27 UTC
Some of us babysit out orders. Depending on how much shipping, buying, etc I do on my alts, I usually check my orders every 5-20 minutes. And with Amarr, there are probably a hundred people doing the same thing I am. It's probably not bots (at least most aren't bots), it's probably people babysitting their orders. Doing production isn't just about building things for a profit, but selling them quickly so you can reinvest that money. Babysitting makes that much more effective.
Maxpie
MUSE LLP
#17 - 2012-05-01 21:28:49 UTC
There are definintely bots (.01 isk my price before I can even refresh my screen?), but it actually seems better than it had been a few months back.

No good deed goes unpunished
Alexis Valentyne
Anacorn Contracts Agency
#18 - 2012-05-01 23:57:03 UTC
It's not the bots, it's me ;). A lot of the time I genuinely find myself checking my orders 2-3 times per minute, and since I split my orders up, I'll always have an order which I can modify to 0.01 you Pirate.

I seem to smell the stench of appeasement in the air.
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#19 - 2012-05-02 01:10:49 UTC
Aina Sasaki wrote:
Yeap. It's pretty annoying too. x_x

Well I don't know if its bots...


I've reported 5 in Rens over the past 2 months or so. They are really obvious. Was "One ISKED" by the same person , even when I woke up in the middle of the night for a few minutes and checked. Went on for 2 days. That's the usual sign.

Rens is packed full of them now beginning right before Burn Jita.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#20 - 2012-05-02 01:15:40 UTC
Alexis Valentyne wrote:
It's not the bots, it's me ;). A lot of the time I genuinely find myself checking my orders 2-3 times per minute, and since I split my orders up, I'll always have an order which I can modify to 0.01 you Pirate.




Not 48 hours + straight though. I had trouble sleeping for a few weeks, and would check while I was up for a few. Didn't matter, morning noon, or night.

I too bought from them just for Name evidence.

Annoying to do, but it works. CCP will look into it. THEY can easily determine who is one ISKing and who is botting. Why they don't just do it with software instead of making US do the dirty work is beyond me.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
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