These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page12
 

Auto-ignore (mute) for Known Trolls, Spamers, and Harrasers
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Gevlin
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#21 - 2012-04-28 11:39:38 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:


Do you not think the GMs have better things to do than maintain a list of every player in eve who hurts your feelings?


They are muting people any ways. with increasing lengths. these lists are already being completed. Just the Auto Ignore would shorten the list, Allow more harsh speech as people can now choose to listen to this content with out worry of being totally muted because they dropped a 4 letter word. Freeing up the work of GMS

as I mentioned earlier in this thread

Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships
Gevlin
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2012-04-28 12:06:29 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Gevlin wrote:
Dude! watch the video linked at the top of the thread. You will see what I am writing in a different light I will see the tone of your argument would be different. It is becoming apparent I am not describing things will enough.
Yes I still can be wrong, but I feel we are talking about 2 different thoughts.

Side stepping my failed attempt of hummer... Watch the video, it is about 11 mins long.


Alright I'll bite.

The first idea presented: "Auto-mute" based on players muting said individual.
Abuse 1: The problem with this idea is that you can have a large group of people "auto-mute" some poor random sob so that he/she can no longer speak.
Fix 1: Have a threshold for the "auto-mute" to be enabled (ex. 100 mutes from players).
Abuse 2: This puts individual players and/or small corps/alliances at the mercy of large corps/alliances with 100s, sometimes thousands of like-minded players.
Fix 2: You have people/organizations that are set low unable to "auto-mute" others and abuse this mechanic.
Abuse 3: People/organizations preemptively strike and/or use alt accounts to "auto-mute" people, returning to Abuse 1.
Overall Problem: You set the threshold too low and people will be "auto-muted" everywhere. You set it too high and you put smaller entities at the mercy of larger ones.

The second idea presented: "Earning" voice/chat rights.
Abuse: it won't take long for large, tightly knit organizations to give each other (and/or their alts) "promotions" or whatever limit is instituted.
Fix: Set the ability to "earn" such rights low.
Overall Problem: Larger organizations will still get the "rights" faster than individual and/or small groups of people. And if set too low it effectively silences brand new players and/or becomes nothing but a mere annoyance for all.

The third idea presented: People "rating" organizations.
Overall Problem: Same as the first idea but on a large scale.

Also... much of what the video is based on is purely opinion.
I don't smacktalk people in local because I'm a terrible person (well, not a completely terrible person) but because it's funny to see people take it seriously and get mad (sometimes REALLY, unjustifiably mad).
I don't gank people because I am a bully (I was smart enough to stay out of their way and/or be bestest fwends with the teachers) but because I was either paid by said person's competition or I was just hungering for a killmail and that was the closest thing to my stomping grounds.
I don't link "questionable" pictures in local chat because I was deprived of a childhood and/or seek attention (I had a very pleasant childhood and was often given too much attention) but because I find it funny how easy it is to offend people's modern sensibilities (honestly, previous generations were FAR more crude and hardcore than ours... some of the things my uncles and grandparents say still shock me).


Thank You for actually watching the clip.

Your arguments are solid... and yes the majority of the Clip are opinions - base on no real statics as this idea has never been really applied.

I know in null sec, in goon Space where I have played in the past 6 months in Space monkey alliance. (on null sec break currently)
A lot of the Goons have been Mutted for several days preventing them to use their smake talk martial arts. Though giving an option to allow people to heard by people who know the stigma of that individual. In the end two people can have a super X-Rated smak talk conversation in local while those who wish to have Auto ignore on won't know this event is going on.

in general I agree with you... on the couple of items is sorta disagree I can't agrue effectively with out making no scene.

I have tried rewritten response 3 time and nothing is working so I have not posted them. So at this point I have to admit defeat to ShahFluffers.

Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships
XiiX Smyth
Mentant
#23 - 2012-04-28 13:26:32 UTC
I submitted a suggestion/request to increase the Contracts ignore list for obvious reasons.

We now have a high limit on contracts ignore and I'm not even close to filling it yet.

Devs must have had numerous similar requests, and action was taken.

If you get a good part of the community to make a request like yours it should happen naturally.

As mentioned already, we have stuff to deal with this problem.

Suggest making recommendations to build on and improve what we have now.
DitchDigger
Hibi Proletariat
#24 - 2012-04-30 19:56:17 UTC
I think the best solution (for EVE and similar games) would be to have a subscribable block-list. That way, people can chose to subscribe to an ignore list built by someone they trust.

If such lists grow large enough and have sufficient subscribers, then their begins to be atleast some real consequence to running your mouth and behaving like a jerk. This would, however, avoid draining CCP resources or forcing people to ignore someone they might prefer to contact.
Gevlin
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#25 - 2012-04-30 20:11:05 UTC
that is an interesting idea

Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships
PinkKnife
The Cuddlefish
Ethereal Dawn
#26 - 2012-04-30 21:06:03 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:

Also... much of what the video is based on is purely opinion.
I don't smacktalk people in local because I'm a terrible person (well, not a completely terrible person) but because it's funny to see people take it seriously and get mad (sometimes REALLY, unjustifiably mad).
I don't gank people because I am a bully (I was smart enough to stay out of their way and/or be bestest fwends with the teachers) but because I was either paid by said person's competition or I was just hungering for a killmail and that was the closest thing to my stomping grounds.
I don't link "questionable" pictures in local chat because I was deprived of a childhood and/or seek attention (I had a very pleasant childhood and was often given too much attention) but because I find it funny how easy it is to offend people's modern sensibilities (honestly, previous generations were FAR more crude and hardcore than ours... some of the things my uncles and grandparents say still shock me).



Most of that video is correct though. There is a reason the women in EVE hide away in our own little channel. Its pretty atrocious the things people say to women in EVE. This new age machismo where proving how much you don't care somehow means your stronger than everyone else is childish.

Did your uncles and grandparents go around saying shocking things in public, or in front of women and children? Not that women can't take it, but generally this older generation you speak of, had a greater respect for women.

In terms of misogyny EVE is probably one of the greatest offenders. Simply as a by product of the numbers, finding any girls strong enough to withstand the onslaught of bullshit thrown out way is miraculous. I'm still surprised we make up 5% of the playerbase. I know a few girls who fake not having mics because of how people act around them and the **** that is thrown at them just for being female.

In regards to the ideas, I'd love an auto-mute function, but the problem lies in coms, not in game usually. Sure pics are awful, but the barrage of bullshit comes over coms, where CCP has no real domain as long as people use third party clients.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#27 - 2012-04-30 21:58:04 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
PinkKnife wrote:
Most of that video is correct though. There is a reason the women in EVE hide away in our own little channel. Its pretty atrocious the things people say to women in EVE. This new age machismo where proving how much you don't care somehow means your stronger than everyone else is childish.

Did your uncles and grandparents go around saying shocking things in public, or in front of women and children? Not that women can't take it, but generally this older generation you speak of, had a greater respect for women.

In terms of misogyny EVE is probably one of the greatest offenders. Simply as a by product of the numbers, finding any girls strong enough to withstand the onslaught of bullshit thrown out way is miraculous. I'm still surprised we make up 5% of the playerbase. I know a few girls who fake not having mics because of how people act around them and the **** that is thrown at them just for being female.

In regards to the ideas, I'd love an auto-mute function, but the problem lies in coms, not in game usually. Sure pics are awful, but the barrage of bullshit comes over coms, where CCP has no real domain as long as people use third party clients.


I will confess... my family has never publicly said shocking things (at least, not in English). But offensive remarks have been directed at us in varying forms. And while we may not like it, we tolerate it because we understand that any system set up to "ban" such remarks can easily be twisted against us for things that WE consider non-offensive.
(also... that same "greater respect" that the older generations had for women was "double-edged"... they may have treated women as "ladies"... but they certainly did not treat them as equals).

Here is a good example:
I employ a bunch of blue collar guys. Their wive(s) and/or girlfriends and/or "ladyfriends" stop by every so often to say "hi" and when they do, they often level most offensive and crass remarks at each other (openly too). I find this not acceptable and have made it clear that I do not wish to hear any of that in my business.
However, when some of my family and/or friends from the "old country" stop by, I give them the traditional "three kisses" on the cheeks... which my employees find deeply disturbing/offensive because it seems incestuous and/or gay.

Who has the greater claim to being offended? The same concept can be carried over into games (edit: which, in my opinion, it shouldn't because when I log into a game I want to be as far away from reality (and all of its constraints) as possible).

Bottom line... this whole thread is about setting up a system based on subjectivity (and the numerous abuses of such a system that people have pointed out). No matter what you do or say, no matter how careful and PC you are... SOMEONE is going to be offended. And rather than deal with a system that can be so easily twisted one way or another I'd rather simply ignore remarks that I find offensive.

How did you Veterans start?
PinkKnife
The Cuddlefish
Ethereal Dawn
#28 - 2012-05-02 18:17:14 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:

Bottom line... this whole thread is about setting up a system based on subjectivity (and the numerous abuses of such a system that people have pointed out). No matter what you do or say, no matter how careful and PC you are... SOMEONE is going to be offended. And rather than deal with a system that can be so easily twisted one way or another I'd rather simply ignore remarks that I find offensive.



Largely, this isn't that. By and far having one person be offended isn't enough to get someone punished. I don't think anyone would agree to a system where one complaint would lead to an auto-mute. However in systems like Xbox live, where there is generally one lone douchebag and 30 silent consenters, those complains could make a difference.

It doesn't touch on EVE and CCP however, as I've already said it isn't feasible to monitor voice coms.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#29 - 2012-05-02 18:55:25 UTC
mxzf wrote:
If you choose to go to where the unsavory people are, don't complain that there are unsavory people there.


Point of interest -- Eve has a place where there are not unsavoury types? I mean, seriously ... you can get violenced anywhere and everywhere for any reason whatsoever, and the devs will simply say to the person doing the violencing

[stuck up rich person voice]
ha ha ha ha
Good show, old boy.
[/stuck up rich person voice]

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Gevlin
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2012-05-03 16:16:48 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
mxzf wrote:
If you choose to go to where the unsavory people are, don't complain that there are unsavory people there.


Point of interest -- Eve has a place where there are not unsavoury types? I mean, seriously ... you can get violenced anywhere and everywhere for any reason whatsoever, and the devs will simply say to the person doing the violencing

[stuck up rich person voice]
ha ha ha ha
Good show, old boy.
[/stuck up rich person voice]


In the real world there is many places where I can be with out hearing X-rated material, I would like to extend that into my experience in eve. There are many people in eve that feel the same way. On the other hand there are many people who enjoy the X-rated material and love spreading it. With the unique place of technology we can satify both camps of play with the option of Auto ignore people who have a history of unsavory behavior. They can now speak their piece to those who want to hear it while those of use who don't want to have to listen to it don't have to.

As recommended when a person is ignored by 100 people, that is a good sign that this person is not some one who is worth listening to, if I wish to have an enjoyable game. Though this option does not Prevent this person from communitcating to those who want to talk to him. It just removes the Megaphone.

Someday I will have the time to play. For now it is mining afk in High sec. In Cheap ships
Previous page12