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Crime & Punishment

 
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exploit the game machanics

First post
Author
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#21 - 2012-04-27 21:23:10 UTC  |  Edited by: LinearBurn Aideron
)
Quote:
The server stayed online
Your note about crashing the server from the EULA doesn't work. CCP had plenty of warning for this event and gave their full and complete blessing for it.
Quote:
The only way you wouldn't have known this was coming is if you live under a rock.
Well i must live under a Rock

Well they had to close jita ... disrupting gameplay , players loged off in jitta found that they couldnt log on.

Quote:
1.You may not take any action that imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on the System.
it says nuthing abought crashing the server just causing large loads

I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#22 - 2012-04-27 21:25:35 UTC
Boomhaur wrote:
This is eve HTFU, and yes this is comming from a carebear who does nothing but PVE and Market PVP (this is your only warning I WILL gank your wallet). I blew past the Jita gank fest twice today already. Use your head and you will survive they can't kill us all, if they do no one will build them any more ammo Bear. And watching the battles outside of Jita is quite amazing I suggest you grab a ship and check it out (use your head I won't tell you how to get there alive).

Ohh and go back to hello kitty online.



as did I however this is not my point .
Immortis Vexx
Onyx Moon Industries
#23 - 2012-04-27 21:35:34 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:

I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec



Ahh the innocence of youth. High sec is high sec, not super-max safety center. While yes, the event has disrupted a significant portion of play for a lot of people, that was the intention. It is not like this sort of thing happens every day though. If GS was going after jita traffic every day, I might take exception to that and so would CCP. There are things called exceptions to rules and they dont happen all the time which makes them okay. You should look around on the gamer sites that have advertised this event about EVE. Go read the comments from various people. Most of what you will find is people who say, "wow, EvE is different than other MMOs." It absolutely amazes me every time this happens and I am glad for it. I want more people to play EvE, I want more people to see this game and how awesome it really is. (holy fanboy rant btw)...

What EvE has is a fully dynamic environment that nothing compares to. My advice, take this in stride and look at it as something interesting that doesn't happen in any other game. What will GS do tomorrow?? WHO KNOWS!? Isn't that great? All we really need now is a true super power dedicated to fighting GS.

Vexx
Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#24 - 2012-04-27 21:36:06 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:


Well they had to close jita ... disrupting gameplay , players loged off in jitta found that they couldnt log on.


Wrong. Jita is not closed. I just logged onto there. Took maybe 3 tries for a total of 15 seconds.

LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec


Wrong again. CCP states that all space is free for players to cause chaos and do whatever they want. High sec is not safe space never was and never will be. Nothing is being disrupted, travel and trade are happening per normal and people are warping and shooting and exploding per normal. It's called a sandbox, if you don't like it then the door is ------> way
Five Thirty
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#25 - 2012-04-27 21:40:21 UTC
Vaal Erit wrote:

Wrong again. CCP states that all space is free for players to cause chaos and do whatever they want. High sec is not safe space never was and never will be. Nothing is being disrupted, travel and trade are happening per normal and people are warping and shooting and exploding per normal. It's called a sandbox, if you don't like it then the door is ------> way


While I happen to wholeheartedly agree with you here, saying "it's a sandbox" isn't an excuse for everything.
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#26 - 2012-04-27 21:46:11 UTC  |  Edited by: LinearBurn Aideron
Immortis Vexx wrote:
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:

I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec



Ahh the innocence of youth. High sec is high sec, not super-max safety center. While yes, the event has disrupted a significant portion of play for a lot of people, that was the intention. It is not like this sort of thing happens every day though. If GS was going after jita traffic every day, I might take exception to that and so would CCP. There are things called exceptions to rules and they dont happen all the time which makes them okay. You should look around on the gamer sites that have advertised this event about EVE. Go read the comments from various people. Most of what you will find is people who say, "wow, EvE is different than other MMOs." It absolutely amazes me every time this happens and I am glad for it. I want more people to play EvE, I want more people to see this game and how awesome it really is. (holy fanboy rant btw)...

What EvE has is a fully dynamic environment that nothing compares to. My advice, take this in stride and look at it as something interesting that doesn't happen in any other game. What will GS do tomorrow?? WHO KNOWS!? Isn't that great? All we really need now is a true super power dedicated to fighting GS.

Vexx


Im not arguing that hisec is a super-max safety center nor is it my argument. My point is that the Players involved in the event disrupted a significant portion of play for a lot of people, that was the intention they willfuly atempted to crash the cluster and or disrupt gameplay. also in doing so caused concord to be non responcive giving them the go ahead to have a free for all this i would consider "exploting the limitations of the game machanics " and in direct violation of section 6 heading one of the END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT http://community.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp "if CCP gave the green light that i would consider playing favortisim rules should apply to everone not just a select few "

Quote:
A. Specifically Restricted Conduct

Your continued access to the System and license to play the Game is subject to proper conduct. Without limiting CCP's rights to control the Game environment, and the conduct of the players within that environment, CCP prohibits the following practices that CCP has determined detract from the overall user experience of the users playing the Game.
1.You may not take any action that imposes an unreasonable or disproportionately large load on the System.
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#27 - 2012-04-27 21:50:54 UTC
Vaal Erit wrote:
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:


Well they had to close jita ... disrupting gameplay , players loged off in jitta found that they couldnt log on.


Wrong. Jita is not closed. I just logged onto there. Took maybe 3 tries for a total of 15 seconds.

LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec


Wrong again. CCP states that all space is free for players to cause chaos and do whatever they want. High sec is not safe space never was and never will be. Nothing is being disrupted, travel and trade are happening per normal and people are warping and shooting and exploding per normal. It's called a sandbox, if you don't like it then the door is ------> way



jita was closed earlyer CCP hat to close the gates to controle palyer flood and keep the server stable it is problay open again now
Immortis Vexx
Onyx Moon Industries
#28 - 2012-04-27 21:54:42 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
Immortis Vexx wrote:
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:

I am not arguing loss or anything else just that it intentionaly disrupted player experance if they want to cause chaos there is places to do that its Called low or null sec



Im not arguing that hisec is a super-max safety center nor is it my argument. My point is that the Players involved in the event disrupted a significant portion of play for a lot of people, that was the intention they willfuly atempted to crash the cluster and or disrupt gameplay. also in doing so caused concord to be non responcive giving them the go ahead to have a free for all this i would consider "exploting the limitations of the game machanics " and in direct violation of section 6 heading one of the END USER LICENSE AGREEMENT http://community.eveonline.com/pnp/eula.asp "if CCP gave the green light that i would consider playing favortisim rules should apply to everone not just a select few "



Look. They didn't intentionally crash the server; nor did they intend to crash the server. Had they not said anything to anyone and just did it, CCP might have had words about it. As far as concord is concerned, they were just as effective as usual. There were just too many targets for them to shoot all at once. No game mechanics were broken, it was deemed not an attempt to crash the server by CCP due to excellent communication between GS and CCP. I have tried showing you why this was a cool event, I have also tried to show you the reaction the rest of the MMO world has had. So far, nothing has been able to sway you into seeing a different point of view on this. You have forced my hand to say something that I never wanted to.

HTFU - This is a dynamic game with player generated content. If you can't deal with that, go elsewhere. Please.

PS: Not favoritism, If you can organize this kind of event and communicate it as well as GS has, CCP will indeed give you the full go-ahead.

PSS: I hate you for making me look like the very people that I despise.

Vexx
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#29 - 2012-04-27 21:58:53 UTC  |  Edited by: LinearBurn Aideron
Quote:
Wrong again. CCP states that all space is free for players to cause chaos and do whatever they want. High sec is not safe space never was and never will be. Nothing is being disrupted, travel and trade are happening per normal and people are warping and shooting and exploding per normal. It's called a sandbox, if you don't like it then the door is ------> way


[/quote]

Please .link were you got this from in what part of the EULA are you refering or the offical rules of conduct,

Quote:
Nothing is being disrupted,
just because you can enter the system now does not mean it was not happening earlyer.

Quote:
[quote] High sec is not safe space never was and never will be
Not the argument im making
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#30 - 2012-04-27 22:00:35 UTC
I'll just drop this in here.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-04-27-ccp-players-attempt-to-destroy-eve-online-economy-is-f-ing-brilliant


The most relevant quote is:

"I tell you what, it's going to be f***ing brilliant," Jon Lander, senior producer of Eve Online, told Eurogamer this morning. "Absolutely brilliant. "

Or how about this, from CCP Explorer:
'Absolutely! This is the first *high sec* activity that triggers TiDi for a sustained period. This is technical gold mine :-)'

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

Twitter: @fuzzysteve on Twitter

LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#31 - 2012-04-27 22:03:49 UTC  |  Edited by: LinearBurn Aideron
If that is the point then the "EULA" needs to be modified As it stands it is in direct violation of the curent EULA and is favortisim sanctioned or not it still is not in compliance , and no news or anoucment was made in advanced in game ...

Quote:
CCP's duty to sit back and watch.
If they want to burn jita that no big deal the thing is they can gank and kill all they want with out concord action. not to mention it realy screwes witht he game playability factor Anyways this is still not my point I want to know why certan players are given the blessing to completly tromp on the EULA and Gank disrupt harase and other wise make a lot of players misiberal repercusion free. If there going to sanction it needs to be in a offical event not some half assed gank fest there needs to be a notce in game when you long in and maby a gate notice when you enter the system like in lowsec

My arguement still stands this is a violation of the EULA It has disruped gameplay and made a lot of pleple realy misiberal "honistly iv been watching it my self " however im not argumenting the enterment factor of this im simply argumenting that is is not in complienc with the rules and swarming so concord failes to respond can be considered a exploit and could posable be used as such in this manor goon or any other large aliance can at will gank pillage and take over any system they want repercusion free hell why even go to low sec why not just clame jita and goon prime lol maby CCP will rename the system that they conquired . hell if they want to make it a fair even send the NAVy after them to run them off
Immortis Vexx
Onyx Moon Industries
#32 - 2012-04-27 22:09:26 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
If that is the point then the "EULA" needs to be modified As it stands it is in direct violation of the curent EULA and is favortisim sanctioned or not it still is not in compliance , and no news or anoucment was made in advanced in game ...


I have already debunked your favoritism theory, its nonsense, give it up. Also, I have previously stated that you live under a rock. Just because YOU didn't know doesn't mean CCP didn't. Guess what? CCP does not need to consult you every time something happens in THEIR game.

Jita/New Eden (contrary to your popular belief) does not revolve around you.

Vexx
Fuujin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#33 - 2012-04-27 22:14:53 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
If that is the point then the "EULA" needs to be modified As it stands it is in direct violation of the curent EULA and is favortisim sanctioned or not it still is not in compliance , and no news or anoucment was made in advanced in game ...



Yessssss.....


Please, tell us more about how this is making your life difficult.
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#34 - 2012-04-27 22:20:56 UTC
I dont live in jita and visit it rarely none of this is my point im argueing the Rules and pore excution of the enforcement of the rules and how the machanics are being exploited
LinearBurn Aideron
Hells legion
#35 - 2012-04-27 22:24:37 UTC  |  Edited by: LinearBurn Aideron
Immortis Vexx wrote:
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
If that is the point then the "EULA" needs to be modified As it stands it is in direct violation of the curent EULA and is favortisim sanctioned or not it still is not in compliance , and no news or anoucment was made in advanced in game ...


I have already debunked your favoritism theory, its nonsense, give it up. Also, I have previously stated that you live under a rock. Just because YOU didn't know doesn't mean CCP didn't. Guess what? CCP does not need to consult you every time something happens in THEIR game.

Jita/New Eden (contrary to your popular belief) does not revolve around you.

Vexx


You have debunked Squat dont atack me for pointing out the rules"CCP does not need to consult you every time something happens in THEIR game." nore should they what im saying is if its sanctioned then there should be provisions in it it should happen like every other empire gank if you pop some one not war deced and they dont fire on you concord should open fire on them and they die end of story. if one concord ship can contain it more and more concord ships show up till the thret is contained end of story If they over welm the system and concord cant respond that is exploiting a limitation fo the game machanics!
Angry Onions
Fast Eddy's X-ploding Diner
#36 - 2012-04-27 22:25:39 UTC
My anti-stupid devices just got over whelmed. :(

S H I T P O S T I N G

Fuujin
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#37 - 2012-04-27 22:32:07 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
Immortis Vexx wrote:
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:
If that is the point then the "EULA" needs to be modified As it stands it is in direct violation of the curent EULA and is favortisim sanctioned or not it still is not in compliance , and no news or anoucment was made in advanced in game ...


I have already debunked your favoritism theory, its nonsense, give it up. Also, I have previously stated that you live under a rock. Just because YOU didn't know doesn't mean CCP didn't. Guess what? CCP does not need to consult you every time something happens in THEIR game.

Jita/New Eden (contrary to your popular belief) does not revolve around you.

Vexx


You have debunked Squat dont atack me for pointing out the rules"CCP does not need to consult you every time something happens in THEIR game." nore should they what im saying is if its sanctioned then there should be provisions in it it should happen like every other empire gank if you pop some one not war deced and they dont fire on you concord should open fire on you you die end of story. if one concord ship can contain it more and mor concord ships show up till the thret is contained end of story



Your argument assumes that the system is perfect and that there are no consequences.
Lag is a factor already accounted for, sweetling. It's a game condition that they deal with through reinforcement, time dilation, and various other methods. To avoid making the system unplayable, CCP will often "traffic control" a system if it reaches dangerous levels of activity. This happens frequently in nulsec where massive fleet warfare is the rule. It ALSO (and far more frequently) happens to Jita itself...usually due to sheer numbers of people over actual open warfare.

So that argument is just so much whining over a technological limitation that has only been a recognized issue since the beginning of online gaming.

In regards to the Concord issue: there was a bug that was unknown until now. It was squashed, and those unduly affected will probably get their ships back. Every single ship that has suicide attacked another ship has been destroyed. Our K/D ratio is terrible. Our tear collectors, however, have been overflowing--so we muster onwards!
Boomhaur
#38 - 2012-04-27 22:43:24 UTC
I say keep it up goons your good for busniness, I had no competion today in nabbing some things after breaking through to jita. Just wish I had supplied Jita with Tornados for all of you I couldve made a killing.

Not to mention this is the first time I believe I have ever had to think twice about what I was going to do in hi sec instead of hitting autopilot, so quite nice seeing something different.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Daemon Ceed
Ice Fire Warriors
Infinite Pew
#39 - 2012-04-27 22:46:15 UTC
LinearBurn Aideron wrote:



jita was closed earlyer CCP hat to close the gates to controle palyer flood and keep the server stable it is problay open again now


CCP doesn't "close" Jita. There is a max user cap put in place on this system due to it's market presence to keep lag at a minimum. If anything, the Goons are doing a good job at halting commerce by jamming as many people in the system as they can. Gf, I say!
Arathella
Corpus Hermeticum Inc
#40 - 2012-04-27 23:02:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Arathella
Immortis Vexx wrote:
Couple things...
B) Griefing does not equal harassment


Until somebody is pissed (and rich) enough to challenge it in the court. Based on recent rulings in the internet harassment cases all you need to do is to demonstrate "certain minimum contact" (e.g. intent to inflict emotional harm to the person behind the in-game character) in order for court to assert special personal jurisdiction upon the defendant based on his or her internet activity. What it means in practical terms is that the harassment lawsuit will not be thrown out by the judge and the griefer will face significant legal expenses and plenty of other unpleasant challenges regardless of the outcome.