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New dev blog: Team Security RMT Update - 3 Weeks in Numbers (YAY)

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Bruce Blacky
Blacky Invention Research Development YinYang
#161 - 2012-04-27 05:43:50 UTC
Hello,

GOOD STUFF...thumbs up

keep doing this and don stop.

CCP waited too long to get this started, but i am very happy and pleased that you finally got on this problem and I believe you will succeed in removing this problem from EVE completly.

sincerly a very happy customer
Bruce Blacky
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#162 - 2012-04-27 07:30:39 UTC
Impressive - thumbs up to Sreegs and Team Security!

A few ideas for taking it to the next step:

  • Make a list of all known Internet RMT sites (you've probably done this already).

  • Contact the various Eve fansites, as well as general MMO and gaming sites, and ask them (politely, ofc) to delete and refuse to accept ads, articles, or forum postings promoting these sites. They won't all agree, but a surprising number of them will do so.

  • Contact the ISPs of the RMT sites and ask them to remove the sites. Again, they won't all agree, but some will, if asked politely. Sure, the RMTers will just move the site, but it does send them a clear notice that you are out to harass and shut them down.

  • Do some interviews with the various Eve news sites and popular fansites, to get the word out more widely and clearly to the player base (some of whom obvously can't read the EULA).

  • Ask the CCP video team to make you a very cool 3D CG video, showing what happens to folks who break the rules. Most of the Eve player base watches the 3D CG videos, even if they don't read the EULA, the dev blogs or the forums.

  • Contact the leaders of the largest corps and alliances in the game, and ask them to spread the word to their members. As we've seen in the past, a large corp/alliance can be severely impacted by the poorly considered actions of just a few members - and it doesn't hurt to remind them.


And, keep up the most excellent work!
Seloena
Mighty Orca Inc
#163 - 2012-04-27 09:41:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Seloena
Good job guys.
Kick all the f*ckin bots! I hate when hulks come out and suck same ore i do.


I think you should do one more thing. Exactly the same thing you did for England. Prices for game time (not plex, but game time) should be compared to the country we live in (CCP than you for that move! For me game time in GBP will be much cheaper :] )
What exactly I mean? I did some researches and calculated some numbers:

- average pay for job here is 1800 (some units)
- price of new hot game title on the store shelf is 80-120 (some units)
- cost of 1 € is 4.1
- EVE cost per month when taking 3 months is 12.95 €

4.1 * 12.95 = 53 per moth.

I earn much much more than the average, so I can afford that, but for most people here its much too much when you compare to what they earn. Most box titles after few months are available as "gold editions" or something like that in price like 40-50 (some units). So monthly EvE fee is like buying a new game every month. LOL

After some more research i found plex on black market. WOW & SHOCK!!!. This is not "few bucks"! Average price for 1 plex in different sellers was 32 (some units). This is 60% off the oryginal price - its almost like 5 months for free.

Im pretty sure that for many people not buying "cheap plex" mean "not playing eve" just because +20bucks per month is just too much. This is why they take "wrong way".

This why i think you should add more currencies based on country average earnings (like you did for GBP).


Cool job, keep it going!
Ken Kyoukan
#164 - 2012-04-27 11:15:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Ken Kyoukan
Jita spam should be easy to clear up,

Just add an internal timer, messages outside this timer are free,
inside the timer would give a cspa isk cost warning and charge
as well as starting a second timer, this second timer is used to
double the isk cost/message.

Continual spam...spam...spam...
Would (per spammer) become:
Spam... Priced Spam, Double Priced Spam, Expensive Spam,
Extortionate Spam, Minimal Spam.

Always worth a try, and CSPA charges are in game supposedly
for spam prevention, so lets use it in spam heavy systems like
Jita.

P.S.
CCP Sreegs, Just so you are aware, I'm still waiting for a reply
from my earlier post, evemail and email.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#165 - 2012-04-27 11:37:59 UTC
Ken Kyoukan wrote:
Jita spam should be easy to clear up,

Just add an internal timer, messages outside this timer are free,
inside the timer would give a cspa isk cost warning and charge
as well as starting a second timer, this second timer is used to
double the isk cost/message.

Continual spam...spam...spam...
Would (per spammer) become:
Spam... Priced Spam, Double Priced Spam, Expensive Spam,
Extortionate Spam, Minimal Spam.

Always worth a try, and CSPA charges are in game supposedly
for spam prevention, so lets use it in spam heavy systems like
Jita.

P.S.
CCP Sreegs, Just so you are aware, I'm still waiting for a reply
from my earlier post, evemail and email.


Neither of your evemails requested a response. You gave me information. We may or may not use it. I appreciate it and read it but there was nothing in them that seemed to require a response of any kind.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
#166 - 2012-04-27 18:33:52 UTC
CCP Sreegs wrote:
Ken Kyoukan wrote:
Jita spam should be easy to clear up,

Just add an internal timer, messages outside this timer are free,
inside the timer would give a cspa isk cost warning and charge
as well as starting a second timer, this second timer is used to
double the isk cost/message.

Continual spam...spam...spam...
Would (per spammer) become:
Spam... Priced Spam, Double Priced Spam, Expensive Spam,
Extortionate Spam, Minimal Spam.

Always worth a try, and CSPA charges are in game supposedly
for spam prevention, so lets use it in spam heavy systems like
Jita.

P.S.
CCP Sreegs, Just so you are aware, I'm still waiting for a reply
from my earlier post, evemail and email.


Neither of your evemails requested a response. You gave me information. We may or may not use it. I appreciate it and read it but there was nothing in them that seemed to require a response of any kind.


I make this mistake sometimes when I recieve a compliment in an email or a FYI something.

A one line "thanks for the support" or "I'lll read it, thanks" brings a good finality while still showing that you appreciated their time they took to share something. Of course we don't have time to enter conversations with hundreds of people each day but a one line "thanks" probably is possible. Making it really really short.. like two or three words does convey you're too busy to do justice to any further conversation while a the same time not ignoring them.

.
elitatwo
Zansha Expansion
#167 - 2012-04-27 19:00:06 UTC
A virtual high five from me on your work here! Well done and keep going!

Eve Minions is recruiting.

This is the law of ship progression!

Aura sound-clips: Aura forever
Rob Crowley
State War Academy
#168 - 2012-04-27 19:58:14 UTC
Diomedes Calypso wrote:
I make this mistake sometimes when I recieve a compliment in an email or a FYI something.

A one line "thanks for the support" or "I'lll read it, thanks" brings a good finality while still showing that you appreciated their time they took to share something. Of course we don't have time to enter conversations with hundreds of people each day but a one line "thanks" probably is possible. Making it really really short.. like two or three words does convey you're too busy to do justice to any further conversation while a the same time not ignoring them.


Thanks for your forum post, I'll read it later.
Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#169 - 2012-04-27 20:05:43 UTC
corestwo wrote:


Taking a good long while to properly investigate is fine and we'd be okay with that, if not for the whole lack of any contact at all. A month without so much as a "We're looking at it and will keep you updated."




The previous similar thread I was just saying the same concepts.


CCP Sreegs is really REALLY commendable in his job, it's really going to finally kick those RMTers in the ass.

BUT

The "customer care" department following the applied bans it's slow as hell.

He can tell "it's not my job don't tell me" all day long but this is the very only place where we can post something that will not be completely ignored by CCP employees.

The times are BIBLICAL, 2 months is right the average.

I have 2 petitions stuck in the same queue since 1.5 months now (just asking for clarifications about EULA and asking for CCP to investigate on a suspicious guy).

I NEVER got a single "we are working on it" message. Just nothing, full ignore.

I filed a simple petition on another account about a skill question and that too took 3 weeks to reply.

Can CCP hire some more people?

If CCP Sreegs creates 1000 bans a months CCP cannot keep the same GMs they hired when they banned 10 people a month, their queues EXPLODE.


Once again, CCP Sreegs is doing RIGHT GOOD and deserves all the applauses but please pass on your CCP colleagues the big, big discomfort the months long petition queues take just for the first reply.

EvE Online portal | EvE markets tutorials
Diomedes Calypso
Aetolian Armada
#170 - 2012-04-27 20:12:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Diomedes Calypso
Rob Crowley wrote:
Diomedes Calypso wrote:
I make this mistake sometimes when I recieve a compliment in an email or a FYI something.

A one line "thanks for the support" or "I'lll read it, thanks" brings a good finality while still showing that you appreciated their time they took to share something. Of course we don't have time to enter conversations with hundreds of people each day but a one line "thanks" probably is possible. Making it really really short.. like two or three words does convey you're too busy to do justice to any further conversation while a the same time not ignoring them.


Thanks for your forum post, I'll read it later.


LMAO.. well, I'm happy someone saw it at least

.
Golden Gnu
Lobach Inc.
#171 - 2012-04-27 21:58:09 UTC
*Hi Five* Team Security!

Creator of jEveAssets - the asset manager

"Download is the meaning of life, upload is the meaning of intelligent life"
Lemming Alpha1dash1
Lemmings Online
#172 - 2012-04-27 22:35:35 UTC
Do you start your day by punching plush toys and thinking they are RMT ppl ?


gratz team on the RMT kill reportsBear

Information is Ammunition,

War does not tolerate Ambiguities.

May you live in an interesting Empyrean age !

http://eve-radio.com/
Ken Kyoukan
#173 - 2012-04-27 23:04:03 UTC
Many thanks for the receipt acknowledgement CCP Sreegs.

Sorry that I have an AS Condition, if you were offended in any way sir.
Benteen
Atra Mortis Industries
#174 - 2012-04-28 05:23:24 UTC
Hi Five security guys... keep up the good work! Bear
Tazuki Falorn
Eighty Joule Brewery
Goonswarm Federation
#175 - 2012-04-28 08:21:40 UTC
Hi. I'm the person mentioned by Kazanir et al. earlier in the thread. Obviously I'm now unbanned but I can't say the process was in any way a good experience. Tickets were ignored or closed without comment, e-mails to security@ went unanswered - after 2 weeks of trying and failing to get anyone to reply I gave up. It's very difficult to get unbanned when your protestations of innocence disappear into a black hole.

Luckily, my CEO and another director spent a bunch of their time pestering people at CCP via various sources, eventually getting a reply to the effect of "If he is innocent, please explain Dodgy Character's actions". Dodgy Character (not his name) being a freighter/industry guy I legitimately bought and transferred to one of my accounts. Apparently it had something to do with RMT before I bought it and the character transfer wasn't taken into account when bans were handed out :(

I'm all for getting rid of bots and RMTers but there really needs to be a system in place to deal with ban appeals in a reasonable timeframe, especially with the way skill training works. My lost game time got reimbursed but I'm still out a month of training on multiple accounts.
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#176 - 2012-04-28 12:12:19 UTC
Tazuki Falorn wrote:
Apparently it had something to do with RMT before I bought it and the character transfer wasn't taken into account when bans were handed out :(

Shocked

.
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#177 - 2012-04-28 12:52:02 UTC
Ken Kyoukan wrote:
Many thanks for the receipt acknowledgement CCP Sreegs.

Sorry that I have an AS Condition, if you were offended in any way sir.


No no not offended in any way, we just get a lot of email so if the email doesn't require a response I generally don't send one. :)

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#178 - 2012-04-28 12:57:25 UTC
Tazuki Falorn wrote:
Hi. I'm the person mentioned by Kazanir et al. earlier in the thread. Obviously I'm now unbanned but I can't say the process was in any way a good experience. Tickets were ignored or closed without comment, e-mails to security@ went unanswered - after 2 weeks of trying and failing to get anyone to reply I gave up. It's very difficult to get unbanned when your protestations of innocence disappear into a black hole.

Luckily, my CEO and another director spent a bunch of their time pestering people at CCP via various sources, eventually getting a reply to the effect of "If he is innocent, please explain Dodgy Character's actions". Dodgy Character (not his name) being a freighter/industry guy I legitimately bought and transferred to one of my accounts. Apparently it had something to do with RMT before I bought it and the character transfer wasn't taken into account when bans were handed out :(

I'm all for getting rid of bots and RMTers but there really needs to be a system in place to deal with ban appeals in a reasonable timeframe, especially with the way skill training works. My lost game time got reimbursed but I'm still out a month of training on multiple accounts.


We're working on improving this but I will say that everyone appeals which floods the system. We didn't have anything in place to check for character transfers and that'll be rectified. CS doesn't have insight into our investigations and we don't have the people to be handling petitions so we're working on creative ways to get around that.

In this particular case the evidence was there of wrongdoing but we didn't note the transfer of character. We made a mistake in that regard and for that we apologize. We also compensated you for more than your time lost.

Ultimately it's easy to say "answer petitions faster" and as a customer that's really where your concerns end. Unfortunately for us the solution just isn't that simple.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
CCP Sreegs
CCP Retirement Home
#179 - 2012-04-28 13:03:23 UTC
Vaerah Vahrokha wrote:
corestwo wrote:


Taking a good long while to properly investigate is fine and we'd be okay with that, if not for the whole lack of any contact at all. A month without so much as a "We're looking at it and will keep you updated."




The previous similar thread I was just saying the same concepts.


CCP Sreegs is really REALLY commendable in his job, it's really going to finally kick those RMTers in the ass.

BUT

The "customer care" department following the applied bans it's slow as hell.

He can tell "it's not my job don't tell me" all day long but this is the very only place where we can post something that will not be completely ignored by CCP employees.

The times are BIBLICAL, 2 months is right the average.

I have 2 petitions stuck in the same queue since 1.5 months now (just asking for clarifications about EULA and asking for CCP to investigate on a suspicious guy).

I NEVER got a single "we are working on it" message. Just nothing, full ignore.

I filed a simple petition on another account about a skill question and that too took 3 weeks to reply.

Can CCP hire some more people?

If CCP Sreegs creates 1000 bans a months CCP cannot keep the same GMs they hired when they banned 10 people a month, their queues EXPLODE.


Once again, CCP Sreegs is doing RIGHT GOOD and deserves all the applauses but please pass on your CCP colleagues the big, big discomfort the months long petition queues take just for the first reply.


Neither one of those petitions has anything to do with my team or this thread. I thank you for the kind words and understand your frustration but I have to point out that your feeling that this thread is the proper place to air those concerns because you don't feel anyone is listening anywhere else is misplaced. This isn't a CS thread and those are CS issues. You really need to voice your displeasure to them in the form of a petition.

I'm sympathetic to your plight but I also find it a bit offputting to have my thread sullied with complaints about another department. When the queues are long they know they're long and put a lot of effort into reducing them. That's really not your problem at all but there's also not much I'm going to be able to respond to.

"Sreegs has juuust edged out Soundwave as my favourite dev." - Meita Way 2012
fantazmythe
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#180 - 2012-04-28 14:14:21 UTC  |  Edited by: fantazmythe
absolutely epicsauce job your doing guys, *^5's team security*

just out of curiosity, what's the plan for you guys after you have effectively stamped out RTM. will team security be disbanded and you guys reassigned or will you stick around to make sure it doesn't flair up again?


just curious is all, your doing an excellent job and would be interested to see your awesomeness put to great use after the RMT problem is fixed.


P.S i realise that you still have a long way to go to stamp out RMT