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Hitting the higher marks.
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Ricky Pickering
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-04-24 21:55:39 UTC
So, I finally feel like I've become a successful trader/manufacturer. My wallet is in the billions, and I'm not having trouble affording my PvP habits anymore. Now, though, I feel as if I'm somewhat jaded. That 50-100mil that I could make in a trade of profit, just doesn't seem worth it anymore. I'm only looking for the big deals. I hate dealing with anything that costs less than 4-5 mil to sell on the market. Now, to the big question...

Am I doing it wrong?

Do all of you BIG trading gurus still trade the low cost stuff? I'm finding myself completely uninterested in even browsing Ship Equipment anymore. I stick to mainly to ships, implants, and manufacturing rigs because they are higher costs items, but lately I feel as if I've been niched into the rig market more and more as it's the only thing I can seem to produce high quantities of and turn over for that billions total I want. What higher cost items do many of you deal in? Do you just diversify so much that all of the little profits eventually turn into hundreds of million and billions?
Darth Tickles
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-04-24 22:06:30 UTC
At around 20b capital I stopped "trading" altogether and started speculating instead. Now I just buy 10s of billions of stuff, then resell it later, hopefully at a profit.

If you try to fight that growing disinterest in making money, you will only burn yourself out. I don't get out of bed for less than 2-3b projected profit, and there's nothing wrong with that.
Nub Sauce
State War Academy
Caldari State
#3 - 2012-04-24 22:21:02 UTC
Darth Tickles wrote:
At around 20b capital I stopped "trading" altogether and started speculating instead. Now I just buy 10s of billions of stuff, then resell it later, hopefully at a profit.

If you try to fight that growing disinterest in making money, you will only burn yourself out. I don't get out of bed for less than 2-3b projected profit, and there's nothing wrong with that.


This is pretty much what I do, as well. Small time trading just isn't worth my time anymore. Buy a ton of something at a low price, hold it, then sell when the market goes up later. In the interim, I still have billions of isk to float on and do whatever I like.

As my fortune grows, I just speculate on more things at a time.
Prophet Avater
Imperium Technologies
Sigma Grindset
#4 - 2012-04-25 21:37:38 UTC
It's natural to want more over time, if your doing things right.
cuoredipietra famedoro
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#5 - 2012-04-25 22:10:14 UTC
Congrats on having Billions, really. However higher marks in EVE are measured in tens of trillions, give a look at this post: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=83918&find=unread

As you can see, Tornsoul has your same problem, just scaled up a hundred times, and there is no single /or simple) answer to your question.

You could start differentiating your investments: High volume PI, Capital Production, Market Speculation, Market Manipulation, Cross-regional high-value trading, Low and Nullsec trading... these are just a few things you could do that could land you good margins.

Some of these things might involve low value items bough/sold/moved at incredible volumes (example, mineral/ice speculations, technetium market manipulation etc).

Whatever you do, don't drop your trader habits, just do trading to a level that don't burns you out and enjoy the added share of margin.

/my two cents

Caeci caecos ducentes 
Ricky Pickering
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-04-26 04:48:05 UTC
Hmmm, plenty of good stuff in that post. It seems speculation may just be the way to go. I've also thought about dabbling in Capital Production, but I'll have to wet my feet a bit before I fully commit. To be honest, I LIKE the thrill of trading, updating orders, moving materials, putting in manufacturing jobs, so speculation just seems so boring in comparison. I wish I would have got in on the Tech boom, though.

I wonder how well I would do with PI materials. I don't have much experience in the different chains and processes that go into making the higher tier materials. I only barely messed around with it when it first came out.

How well can one do in T3 production I wonder? With the increase in price within the T1 and T2 ship market, T3 seems that much more accessible to pilots who don't have billions of ISK. I'll have to consider this, too.
cuoredipietra famedoro
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-04-26 06:55:36 UTC
Ricky Pickering wrote:
Hmmm, plenty of good stuff in that post. It seems speculation may just be the way to go. I've also thought about dabbling in Capital Production, but I'll have to wet my feet a bit before I fully commit. To be honest, I LIKE the thrill of trading, updating orders, moving materials, putting in manufacturing jobs, so speculation just seems so boring in comparison. I wish I would have got in on the Tech boom, though.

I wonder how well I would do with PI materials. I don't have much experience in the different chains and processes that go into making the higher tier materials. I only barely messed around with it when it first came out.

How well can one do in T3 production I wonder? With the increase in price within the T1 and T2 ship market, T3 seems that much more accessible to pilots who don't have billions of ISK. I'll have to consider this, too.



You see, there is a lot you can do but you have to 'wet your feet' in your own words.

Wetting your feet in Cap/T3 production always require a significative commitment ISK-wise as Cap BPOs are quite expensive in the first case, BPCs are difficult to acquire in the latter case.

You will burn a fraction of your liquidity before you're able to proficently manage a production endevour.

My suggestion is to try sooner than later.



Caeci caecos ducentes 
clixor
Celluloid Gurus
#8 - 2012-04-26 10:31:30 UTC
Ricky Pickering wrote:
Hmmm, plenty of good stuff in that post. It seems speculation may just be the way to go. I've also thought about dabbling in Capital Production, but I'll have to wet my feet a bit before I fully commit. To be honest, I LIKE the thrill of trading, updating orders, moving materials, putting in manufacturing jobs, so speculation just seems so boring in comparison. I wish I would have got in on the Tech boom, though.


Speculating isn't a real profession. You buy stuff, wait, wait some more, and sell it If you actually play EVE all the other activities you mention are viable. To diversify activities is the way to keep things interesting imo but in the end it all come down what you like.

Casius Omega
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#9 - 2012-04-26 14:27:50 UTC
speculate isk best isk
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#10 - 2012-04-26 14:33:22 UTC
clixor wrote:
Speculating isn't a real profession.


Shocked

Didn't we find out otherwise about 4 years ago concerning Wall Street ?????

Are you living on another planet or something ?

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Barakach
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#11 - 2012-04-26 14:48:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Barakach
I have a short-term goal to reach 250m/day avg over 30 days, station trading in a non-Jita station(s). I also don't want to freighter haul more than a few times per week.

I'm only ~12b right now, but I find the more I grow, the faster I make money, as a percentage. This means I am learning to better make use of my money.

My mid-term goal is this
1) Update orders twice per day or less
2) Have a few trader alts covering a few stations
3) Make at least 500m/day avg
4) Very little freighter hauling

Trading can be very thought intensive. I want to find my limit.
Asura07
Dark Matter Investments
#12 - 2012-04-26 15:41:12 UTC
Pretty much what some of these guys have said already: If you're good at it/like it keep doing it, just make it bigger as your wallet increases. Turn those orders of 5 ships into 10, 20 etc.

Also switching it up a little can help keep you interested. I started up bond recently (after a friend suggested it) and got some people to lend me isk to play with for a couple months, thus helping to increase my own wallet as well as theirs.

So good luck with your isk-making endeavors!
Ricky Pickering
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2012-04-26 16:02:32 UTC
Tons of good advice here. Thanks a lot guys, and good luck with your endeavors.