EVE General Discussion

(repost)

Anything that is going to massively increase travel time with little increase in play is not worth doing. While it would help with 'PVP' from a certain point of view you need to take in to account the 'dead air' time for all the other travel it would affect.

Amarr to Jita would add 23 minutes of dead travel time to a freighter or Orca. A L4 mission three jumps out in a battleship (200m/s) would add over six minutes of staring at the screen (for what?) in added travel time. You then need to add another five minutes of travel time to go salvage it. Add that to your selling point and see how many people would want to back it then.

On the bookmark issue there is also the point that they will be made again. Even with the 'you can't jump within 15km of the gate' you will still have people making extra bookmarks to approach the gate from directions other that the straightest one to reduce interception time by aggressors.

People are complaining enough about blob warfare and you want to introduce a system where not only will the largest blob win, but it would effectively take forever for reinforcements to arrive making them king of the gate. Some people envision clashing of large fleets, but I believe it would be more missing of fleets.

You make the mistake of viewing the increase of traveltimes within the parameters of the current situation. But if the travel-times and related systems are changed, then so do the parameters.

Instead of having to fly to Jita from Amarr, you wouldn't have to, because not everyone is going to Jita anymore to shop and prefers to shop in Amarr instead, even if the prices are a bit higher. Instead of one giant Wall-Mart at Jita where only you make very little but compensate by selling a lot,, you'd get a lot more smaller hubs where you will sell less, but for better profits.

Ah yes. I agree that in the vastness of space, being able to force your opponent into a pitched battle is a good thing. Especially for the stronger parties.

As for shooting POSses in battleships, I think CCP should give the players some new BC-sized mini-dread (or BS-size but fitting in C1 would be nice), 1-2 XL guns (structure- dps between sieged dread and gankageddon), and a spidertank bonus instead of siege mode to withstand POS guns. Also to be used as non-cap anti-cap.

At the same time people don't like spawn campers, so blow it out your ass.

If the only impediment to getting rid of warp to zero was time traveling, that could be handeled. Speed up the acceleration to warp the AU/sec while in warp, and for some ships increase the normal space speed. The result would be about the same time per system as we got now.

The real issue: Why do we want all ships to drop out at 15 km? So they can be killed more easily. Except people will change their behavior.

Industry ships in low sec: if they do not have WTZ, they will stop going into low sec. Then you cannot shoot them.

Catching roaming fleets in gate camps: As gate camps will be more effective, gangs will do that instead of roam. No roaming gangs, nothing to catch in the camp.

High sec wars: As warping will become so much more dangerous, those at war will minimize doing it. Wars will become waiting games for the other side to make the mistake of travel.

TL,DR: Eve works because people travel. Make travel dangerous, people stop moving and all the kills you hope to get from travelers cannot happen.

Seeing repeat threads is just as annoying as a CD that skips on every song, possibly more annoying as having to slowboat 15km at every gate.

It did cause major lag on the server... that's for sure. Man I hated that... the bookmarks thing was just so bunk. I used to sell bookmark sets for almost nothing but the bookmarks they contained had one or two systems I would camp where the BMs were way off just to make a kill easier. It was so lame... all around.

Still... I'm starting to change my opinion on it. Maybe it would be better of WTZ was removed. ...but for that to even be consitered you would have to do something about bookmarking. You would have to make it impossible to bookmark w/i a certain distance from the gate... say 120 km. That would also eliminate the ability to BM wrecks and cans around gates, and that in turn would dramatically change the tactics involved with fighting around gates.

Also: you would have to do something about jumping/teleportation.

I think it's too much work. I just don't think CCP will even consider this idea.

I mean what is this... like the zillionth thread now where someone is harping on WTZ? The devs have probably read at least a few, and have declined to comment. They probably aren't taking it seriously at all. If someone were to even bring it up at one of their meetings it would probably go: "So removing WTZ..." (Laughter fills meeting room) "No." ...and that's assuming they even brought it up. It's not even on the radar.

If you really want to remove WTZ (and as a pirate it's allright with me but it's to your detriment) I would say take it to the CSM and try to get some support there. Nobody is going to even think about this until you get some real support... and I just don't see you getting it in GD.

(Also think about how WTZ changed the economy.... min prices outside of the trade hubs were a LOT more varied before the removal of WT15. Hell I recall noxium dropping in price by a quarter almost overnight in further flung empire systems alone. Prices fluctuate very little now regardless of where you go b/c logistics is such an afterthought / non-existent today)

Also: There might be another way to fix the bookmark problem... instead of removing bookmarks or even messing with them, create a 20km sphere around a jumpgate with a rule that reads sorta like "if ship destination at time of warp = 'inside sphere' then randomize ship landing position to coordinate X within sphere". That might negate the need to even touch the bookmarking system. I mean, if you have a bookmark to certain items in secondary or later rooms in deadspace complexes it still takes you to the acceleration gate if you try to warp to it. That's not so far off from my idea there...

I still think CCP will ignore it b/c it's too much work and too many tears would be shed.

tl;dr; Your cause is pointless and you should abandon all hope.

Something nobody seems to be mentioning is, you don't just warp to gate. You warp to stations too. Yes, when we had no WTZ we also had to bookmark any station we wanted to warp to. Alternative, warp a freighter 15km off the station and slowboat it in.

Maybe in your infinite wisdom, you will explain how the hell CCP can enforce a Bookmark Ban?