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DUST will fail miserably
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Jokerface666
Intergalactic Expeditionary Corp
#81 - 2011-09-28 14:55:36 UTC
Zey Nadar wrote:
I would love to hear from CCP exactly what kind of dependencies and connections there is between dust and eve players.. As long as there isn't any information, its easy to round those connections to "none" and declare a generic fps shooter a failure.
I wish there would be a devblog about the current situation in the development of dust. It would be a nice change to the contentless devblogs lately.

Riggs Droput wrote:

Counter Strike release date 1999, still servers running the game even with Counter Strike: Source being release. A stable platform that is 100% backwards compatible will keep a games life span around longer then the hardware lifespan.


Consoles arent necessarily backwards compatible. I had the first generation ps3 that could run ps2 games, but Sony eventually removed the backwards compatibility from its latest-generation playstation 3s.


I've got a strong feeling that the connection will be kind of a contract system already in game, you set up a contract to take over planet X or destroy player Xs equipment on planet X for X amount of ISK.
which every "corp/clan" in DUST can accept and try to accomplish.
Ana Vyr
Vyral Technologies
#82 - 2011-09-28 15:01:11 UTC
I'd have bought a copy of Dust just to see the interaction with EvE at work...if they'd released it on X-box that is. I'm not gonna buy another console to play one game.
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#83 - 2011-09-28 16:14:45 UTC
Ana Vyr wrote:
I'd have bought a copy of Dust just to see the interaction with EvE at work...if they'd released it on X-box that is. I'm not gonna buy another console to play one game.


And that is your perogative. Too bad Microsoft wouldn't allow CCP to do what they needed to on XBL huh? Otherwise it would be on XBox.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Karim alRashid
Starboard.
#84 - 2011-09-28 20:19:21 UTC
Heh, I bought my PS3 because of DUST 514 (I was shopping for a TV set and there was this bundle with a PS3 "free").

But have played several very good (some PS3 exclusive) games on it.

Pain is weakness leaving the body http://www.youtube.com/user/AlRashidKarim/videos
AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
#85 - 2011-09-28 23:21:56 UTC
Sellendis wrote:
DUST a fail project? Only time will tell, IMHO its a fail.
The idea itself is fine, but considering game market of today....its gonna be hard to get by.

How many EvE players own PS3? How many will buy PS3 just for DUST (and BR player mostly)?

Is CCP counting on big alliances to somehow motivate people to contribute to fights on planets?
Is PI still a factor in DUST and EvE, and controlling planets control PI production?
Again a good idea, but its gonna be a hassle, why go all the trouble to make and bake a loaf of bread at home and waste few hours, when you can buy one in a second? EvE has bots, bots earn money, who needs PI and your own ground army when you can buy what you want in 4-4.

Console players attention span is low. With new games on shelves almost weekly, CCP needs a goddamn good plan to keep people playing DUST.

Imagining DUST is a console MMO (MMO connected) is stupid, they cant sell that to most of EvE community, let alone console players. What happens when DUST server population drops? Servers shut down, and what about EvE? Does EvE get a emergency boost of patches to remove DUST from equation, or will EvE keep going like DUST never mattered in the first place.

Now this i am sure no one will answer , how much money did CCP spent developing DUST? How much do they expect to gain in first 6-12 months?
Now imagine all that money and man hours invested in DUST were instead put into EvE....what would be the situation in EvE today, maybe hybrids would be fixed along with a lot of balancing issues.


Sums up most of my thoughts.

We understand they are giving the game away for free as well. So the money they have spent on developing the game is going to be recouped by vanity items?

Nice one CCP, great business strategy.

That's basically saying "This game is soooo bad we cannot charge money for it. Please play it please, please, please"

Desperation is such a turn on, isn't it?

Haven't you ever heard of playing hard to get?

Confidence pwns desperation every time.

You've been very lucky with your relationship with us - you might have convinced us (somehow) that a threesome is a good idea, but you've got to introduce us to your new partner, and I sense a rocky beginning to this new level of the relationship.

Leaders of Alliances in this game have several thousand members - what stopping them from blowing the crap out of PS3 players with 1 click of a mouse?

All it takes is 1 mistake from you guys and it's *poof* no more PS3 players, because every-time they start a game, they get nuked from orbit.

You didn't think this through very well, did you?

All you needed to do was put it on PC's and flog it on Steam for $25, with a Drum n Bass infused trailer. Are you really that disconnected with gamers?

I own a PS3, btw, so meh.

This space for rent.
Cypermethren
Perkone
Caldari State
#86 - 2011-09-29 08:13:48 UTC
speaking as someone whom has alot of console gamer friends, who like to mock me for my MMO choices....



They are all hyped up and eager for Dust.



Go figure?



the FPS industry has screwd itself over by being lazy and just making new maps and tweaking existing models/guns slightly and re-releasing it as a new game. This has been the trend since Call of Duty 3 and onwards, which is an incredibly long time.



CCP stepping up and putting Dust on the plate realy does have Battlefield 3 and the new Modern Warfare weary. You can expect the next in the series that they release to have alot of ideas stolen from Dust and other games, then incorporated into it.


If they do not, they will loose the market, its that simple, and they know it.



Dust can and will take the FPS market by storm, you do not "NEED" to buy the in game cash, it will be like eve - **** easy to make if you sit down and play - but moreso a convenience for the average joe that isnt on government benefits and has work/family committments, and has restricted playing time - but wants in early on stuff that would take him alot longer to achieve.



Wether it can keep the market, after the other games pilfer ideas and modify their own games to compete on the same level, is another story.
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#87 - 2011-09-29 09:05:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Aston Bradley
Tippia wrote:
Ladie Scarlet wrote:
Anybody who's not a mouthbreathing idiot can see the future when it comes to Dust. A console shooter (a market that is glutted with titles) exclusive to the console with the smallest audience is doomed to fail.
Yes. The PS3-exclusive shooters have all been such abysmal failures that they're only into their third or fourth sequel by now…


True but than again, they were a succes as a Single player shooter. Usually multiplayer elements in console shooter keep players interested for a few months at best untill they move to either a sequel or an other game. Despite how much i love Killzone games, i am not going to keep playing it months later. I will move on to other games.

Dust being an MMOFPS, it will need more than nice graphics, a cool story line, and good gameplay (The basics for a good shooter). You need MMO elements, and a strong community to keep such a game alive over the years.

I have no doubt that as a strict console shooter, Dust will succed. As a MMO-shooter however, that's an other story.

Making DUST a PS3 game is not a good idea, since most console players don't dedicate to a single game as new titles hit the platform every month. The console market is saturated. If you want players to keep playing the game for years, the PC market is the way to go. There is a reason why succesfull MMo's tend to be PC exclusives.

As you said yourself, popular console games get sequels... And sadly that's not what a MMOFPS needs.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#88 - 2011-09-29 11:37:02 UTC
I was talking about DUST among my co-workers yesterday. Most of them had never heard of it yet all of them because of myself and a few others I work with know what EvE is. The ones that knew of DUST admitted that they would be playing it at some point at least to give it a try and see how it goes. The others after reading about it and seeing what DUST offers that is new to console FPS are now on board to try it as well.

Most FPS gamers are going to at least try to play DUST just because of the new elements such as interacting with a persistent PC MMO will bring. This is all CCP needs. People to just try it. After that the ball is back in CCP's court to make the game good enough to keep people playing. Look at MAG. Still alive and kicking. I logged in the other day to see thousands of people on and playing. Wasn't expecting that. Look at HALO. Completely unheard of game on a new console with no advertising. Blockbuster hit and many sequels made to this day.

To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...

"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"

That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2011-09-29 12:27:40 UTC
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:

To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...

"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"

That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor.



The fact that you get paid by player from a PC MMO game and that your actions have impact on this MMo is cool but :

- Most of Dust players that don't play or care about eve won't see this change, so it hardly a cool factor for Dust player unless they are also Eve player. Most forums that talk about Dust show that fans are PS3 players, not Eve players. What's the point of the butterfly-effect that you can't see?

- It's not enough to keep players in. Sure MAG is still live, but your gonna need more than what they are currently offering to keep playing DUST.

As said, i believe many PS3 owner will try the game, and it might even be a succes as a shooter. I am still not convinced that players will keep the game alive months after release however, and the fact that eve players can pay bots rather than players shows that CCP is already prepared with the possibility that DUST will not have enough players on the long run to make the hiring mercenaries option in eve a viable option.

Time will tell, and as a PS3 owner i will buy and play the game. But i am not sure it will keep it's promisses.

I mean.... It's CCP.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
J Kunjeh
#90 - 2011-09-29 13:06:35 UTC
Dust definitely wont fail...

I think for one it will attract a lot of ex-Eve players who quit because they just don't have 20 hours a week to devote to a game world, but they're still hopelessly addicted to to everything Eve. They need some way to make meaningful contributions to New Eden that doesn't require a part time job.

"The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5) 
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#91 - 2011-09-29 13:43:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Aston Bradley
J Kunjeh wrote:
Dust definitely wont fail...

I think for one it will attract a lot of ex-Eve players who quit because they just don't have 20 hours a week to devote to a game world, but they're still hopelessly addicted to to everything Eve. They need some way to make meaningful contributions to New Eden that doesn't require a part time job.


Mmm... I am playing eve just 6-7 hours a week and i am doing just fine. While being the most new player unfriendly MMO it's not the most time consuming one. I guess that kinda depends on what you do in eve, but there's definitly things you can do that arn't that time consuming. I spend my time in game bounty hunting and sometimes roaming or running missions. I do it when i want, i don't need to play x hours for it unlike other MMos.

Point being. Yes they are things in eve that are time consuming but if you don't have the timefor these, there are plenty of other activities to do in eve on a casual basis.

If you like eve so badly, just find a casual Corp, go have some fun with them in lowsec from time to time. You don't need DUST for that.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
J Kunjeh
#92 - 2011-09-29 14:08:49 UTC
Aston Bradley wrote:
J Kunjeh wrote:
Dust definitely wont fail...

I think for one it will attract a lot of ex-Eve players who quit because they just don't have 20 hours a week to devote to a game world, but they're still hopelessly addicted to to everything Eve. They need some way to make meaningful contributions to New Eden that doesn't require a part time job.


Mmm... I am playing eve just 6-7 hours a week and i am doing just fine. While being the most new player unfriendly MMO it's not the most time consuming one. I guess that kinda depends on what you do in eve, but there's definitly things you can do that arn't that time consuming. I spend my time in game bounty hunting and sometimes roaming or running missions. I do it when i want, i don't need to play x hours for it unlike other MMos.

Point being. Yes they are things in eve that are time consuming but if you don't have the timefor these, there are plenty of other activities to do in eve on a casual basis.

If you like eve so badly, just find a casual Corp, go have some fun with them in lowsec from time to time. You don't need DUST for that.


6-7 hours is a hell of a lot of time for just one game...especially when you're a gamer who plays board games, all of the consoles, and PC games...there's just only so much time to devote to any one game.

And yes, I do need Dust...because it looks to me to be an amazing addition to New Eden.

"The world as we know it came about through an anomaly (anomou)" (The Gospel of Philip, 1-5) 
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#93 - 2011-09-29 15:16:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Aston Bradley
J Kunjeh wrote:


6-7 hours is a hell of a lot of time for just one game...especially when you're a gamer who plays board games, all of the consoles, and PC games...there's just only so much time to devote to any one game.

And yes, I do need Dust...because it looks to me to be an amazing addition to New Eden.


I agree it is a great new addition, but in all honesty i like playing eve for what it is. A tactical spaceship MMo sandbox. A FPS is cool and i am sure i am going to have a lot of fun with it at launch but here is the thing... DUST is a FPS.... Worse a console PS3 exclusive FPS.

That's a very bad move if you ask me. FPS are saturated with games, and consoles get new games on the table every month. It's kinda hard to dedicate yourself to just one game when it comes to consoles, with so many games to choose from.

Eve is PC exclusive, a market that is far from saturated. EvE is unique in it's genre. Sure they are some other space MMo's but you can coun't them on one hand. You get a new FPS in store every month. It's a though market and the attention span for the genre is usually very low.

Now being a MMOfps, it might keep players in for months or years, but i'll wait to see if the content is worth repeating that long. Wait and see, but surely DUST will be great in it's first months.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
Davelantor
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#94 - 2011-09-29 17:01:09 UTC
Dust 514 will be like any other page in history of console games.

Statistically, Console gamers are faster on letting games go and starting on new once.
PC gamers often are more loyal to the game as they will keep going for longer periods of times.

What will happen is that even with the new expansions people will go and say "ow yeah, i played that game" ... thats it.
We are talking about PS3 here ... compared to PC audiance the age average is significantly lower. They want fast paste action and get bored easily.

Dust 514 needs to have a continious stream of players ... otherwise it cant function ...
Other games are not like that ... they get released and then they make profit with the first sales. Then they dont give a crap as the game gets older.

WIth all these massive titles rushing in PS3 ... DUST 514 will be F.U.B.A.R.
Aston Bradley
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#95 - 2011-09-30 07:32:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Aston Bradley
Davelantor wrote:
Dust 514 will be like any other page in history of console games.

Statistically, Console gamers are faster on letting games go and starting on new once.
PC gamers often are more loyal to the game as they will keep going for longer periods of times.

What will happen is that even with the new expansions people will go and say "ow yeah, i played that game" ... thats it.
We are talking about PS3 here ... compared to PC audiance the age average is significantly lower. They want fast paste action and get bored easily.


Exactly. Not to say that as a PS3 game it can't succed at keeping players in, but PS3 players will see in this a very cool FPS. Since most of these young players don't even know or care about eve, i doubt it will be much more than a regular multiplayer console FPS to them. They'll play it for sure untill an other call od duty or GoW game comes out. They might play it again when no good games come out, but that is very unlikely to happen. Usually each month would offer you one very interesting game to purchase at the very least.

On PC, you get about 2-3 good games a year. So once you get a good one, you dedicate to it. I like the dust concept but making it a PS3 exclusive is not a good move. And that's a PS3 owner talking.

[i]FiS should be the priority, but WiS should not be burried!

Don't encourage CCP to make empty promises or Incarna will happen again![/i]
AlleyKat
The Unwanted.
#96 - 2011-09-30 12:15:31 UTC
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I was talking about DUST among my co-workers yesterday. Most of them had never heard of it yet all of them because of myself and a few others I work with know what EvE is. The ones that knew of DUST admitted that they would be playing it at some point at least to give it a try and see how it goes. The others after reading about it and seeing what DUST offers that is new to console FPS are now on board to try it as well.

Most FPS gamers are going to at least try to play DUST just because of the new elements such as interacting with a persistent PC MMO will bring. This is all CCP needs. People to just try it. After that the ball is back in CCP's court to make the game good enough to keep people playing. Look at MAG. Still alive and kicking. I logged in the other day to see thousands of people on and playing. Wasn't expecting that. Look at HALO. Completely unheard of game on a new console with no advertising. Blockbuster hit and many sequels made to this day.

To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...

"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"

That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor.

It's not going to hit the shelves

This space for rent.
Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#97 - 2011-09-30 18:51:54 UTC
AlleyKat wrote:
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I was talking about DUST among my co-workers yesterday. Most of them had never heard of it yet all of them because of myself and a few others I work with know what EvE is. The ones that knew of DUST admitted that they would be playing it at some point at least to give it a try and see how it goes. The others after reading about it and seeing what DUST offers that is new to console FPS are now on board to try it as well.

Most FPS gamers are going to at least try to play DUST just because of the new elements such as interacting with a persistent PC MMO will bring. This is all CCP needs. People to just try it. After that the ball is back in CCP's court to make the game good enough to keep people playing. Look at MAG. Still alive and kicking. I logged in the other day to see thousands of people on and playing. Wasn't expecting that. Look at HALO. Completely unheard of game on a new console with no advertising. Blockbuster hit and many sequels made to this day.

To say that DUST will fail without giving it a try is foolish at best. Nobody knows right now what the reaction to DUST will be when it hits shelves. To quote one of my co-workers yesterday after I explained DUST to them...

"So you are saying that there will be players in another game flying in space who will pay people in DUST to do ground combat for them? And these actions will impact the PC gamers flying in space? That's ******* awesome!"

That's the kind of reaction that gets new games attention and makes them successful. No matter what it is from...the wow factor.

It's not going to hit the shelves


Huh?...

I am not sure where that comment came from or what you even really mean by it.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821