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[Reminder] Balancing Mining Barges

Author
Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#1 - 2012-04-17 20:15:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Sutha Moliko
Please, do not forget to remove tier for Mining Barges in your balancing project !

Few exemples of role for Mining barges
* The Procurer could be the "Industrial" Mining Barge (low yield, high cargohold but less than a rigged Hulk of course)
* The Retriever could be the "Combat" Mining barge (medium yield, good EHP, low cargo)
* The Covetor remains the T1 mining barge of choice, the "Mining Ship T1" (high yield, medium cargo)

Few exemples of role for industrials
* Wreathe the "attack" industrial (very fast and agile, low cargo)
* Hoarder the "support" industrial (bonus with shield transfer, energy transfer, bonus with scanner, etc, medium cargo) could be use to support mining barge in belt or even in a combat fleet. (The battlebadger can be used as reference for "support" Industrial).
* Mammoth the "combat" industrial (good tank, high cargo)

About the survability of Exhumers and Mining Barges, I think a little buff in EHP could be nice to compensate the increase of ganking capability introduced with Crucible (-> Destroyer).

[Proposal]
What a mining barge need is an active tank especially in 0.0 and not a super buffer to protect them from Gankers.
Using Deadspace Shield booster should not be mandatory. So, they need a buff to their capacitor and more PG even if it might open the door for a LSE II. That could be the way to provide them more EHP. Balance between Tank or Yield will be limited by the CPU.
A full tank "Combat" retriever able to survive in a 0.0 belt against NPC should be the reference. The Hulk will be the better version, more expansive but with a better yield.

[edit] Btw more PG is also the ability to fit a Propulsion mod instead of a Tank
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2012-04-17 23:50:13 UTC
I'm sorry....but I can't help but laugh at this proposal.

I dont know what to say...but something is horribly wrong here.

Maybe someone else could take a crack at this. Lol


But not supporting. X)


PS: Battle-Procuror anyone? *smirk*

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Ayla Hanaya
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#3 - 2012-04-18 02:51:14 UTC
Sutha Moliko wrote:
Please, do not forget to remove tier for Mining Barges in your balancing project !

Few exemples of role for Mining barges
* The Procurer could be the "Industrial" Mining Barge (low yield, high cargohold but less than a rigged Hulk of course)
* The Retriever could be the "Combat" Mining barge (medium yield, good EHP, low cargo)
* The Covetor remains the T1 mining barge of choice, the "Mining Ship T1" (high yield, medium cargo)

Few exemples of role for industrials
* Wreathe the "attack" industrial (very fast and agile, low cargo)
* Hoarder the "support" industrial (bonus with shield transfer, energy transfer, bonus with scanner, etc, medium cargo) could be use to support mining barge in belt or even in a combat fleet. (The battlebadger can be used as reference for "support" Industrial).
* Mammoth the "combat" industrial (good tank, high cargo)

About the survability of Exhumers and Mining Barges, I think a little buff in EHP could be nice to compensate the increase of ganking capability introduced with Crucible (-> Destroyer).

[Proposal]
What a mining barge need is an active tank especially in 0.0 and not a super buffer to protect them from Gankers.
Using Deadspace Shield booster should not be mandatory. So, they need a buff to their capacitor and more PG even if it might open the door for a LSE II. That could be the way to provide them more EHP. Balance between Tank or Yield will be limited by the CPU.
A full tank "Combat" retriever able to survive in a 0.0 belt against NPC should be the reference. The Hulk will be the better version, more expansive but with a better yield.

[edit] Btw more PG is also the ability to fit a Propulsion mod instead of a Tank


Nope, not supported, Mining Barges are working as intended. Simple, don't AFK mine, dummy. If you see red in your overview, GTFO.
Wolodymyr
Breaking Ambitions
#4 - 2012-04-18 07:24:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Wolodymyr
I could see giving mining bargest a bit more ehp. The hulk is basically a 300 million isk money piniata that takes 4 T1 fit destroyers in highsec to kill, or one random dude in null / lowsec.

However I'd do it by moving them to an armor tank, take away some of the midslots, give em more lowslots, maybe a little more powergrid and cpu for the extra tank.

Now with armor tanking they have to choose between fitting a proper tank and fitting mining yield boosting mods.. Risk vs Reward! Because you just know there will be some dude in highsec with half as much EHP as everyone else and mining laser upgrades in all his lowslots, And he'll explode spectacularly.


As for the rest of this guy's post, it just sounds weird and unnecessary.

I honestly think PoCo based sov is a good idea https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1417544

Rimase
#5 - 2012-04-18 09:22:06 UTC
Not supported sorry. Shocked



If anything:

  • Rorqual becomes the 'Mining Barge';
  • and all previous Mining Barges become 'Exhumers'.

Looking to join Caldari Faction Warfare corporation!

Rel'k Bloodlor
Guldan Age Stories
Federation Front Line
#6 - 2012-04-18 09:46:18 UTC
well I think ORE indy's should just lose there tank altogether and be even stronger at just mining. Then each empire should get a T2 cruiser based off the logi hull that dose combat resource gathering. The you have your strait indy ships that use strip[ miners and eat rock super fats and you have your tanky ships with some DPS for hostile areas. You devalue no mods as T2 and meta regular mining lasers would be wanted for the T2's and strips for the ORE ships.

I wanted to paint my space ship red, but I couldn't find enough goats. 

Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#7 - 2012-04-18 17:40:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Sutha Moliko
Read the subject (Reminder means reminder)

CCP want to get rid of tier, they have to work on all ships Mining Barge, Industrial included.

Sure Mining Barge work as intented.
Who fly a Procurer (aka tier1 Mining Barge) ?
Who fly tier 1-2 Frigate and Cruiser again ?
Who fly a tier 1 Industrial again ?

What is important is to apply the same balancing philosophy to all ships in EvE.

The truth : I really don't give a **** of what CCP will do to balance ships. I really don't care about my own proposal. It is just funny to see the immediate NO i was expecting.

Do you realise that CCP might change all the ships we know in this process ?
Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#8 - 2012-04-18 18:11:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Sutha Moliko
Drake Draconis wrote:
I'm sorry....but I can't help but laugh at this proposal.

I dont know what to say...but something is horribly wrong here.

Maybe someone else could take a crack at this. Lol

But not supporting. X)

PS: Battle-Procuror anyone? *smirk*


I will crack for you my friend.

The "Role" we can found in the dev blog about ship balancing are only for combat ships.
Now, try to find terms to designate a role for each Industrial and Mining Barge. You cannot because they forgot them, using Industrial ships as the basic trash.

Two main thing in balancing ship : removal of Tier & Roles for ship.
I'm happy to remind you the basic of the incoming changes.Lol
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2012-04-18 19:32:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Drake Draconis
Sutha Moliko wrote:
Read the subject (Reminder means reminder)

CCP want to get rid of tier, they have to work on all ships Mining Barge, Industrial included.

Sure Mining Barge work as intented.
Who fly a Procurer (aka tier1 Mining Barge) ?
Who fly tier 1-2 Frigate and Cruiser again ?
Who fly a tier 1 Industrial again ?

What is important is to apply the same balancing philosophy to all ships in EvE.

The truth : I really don't give a **** of what CCP will do to balance ships. I really don't care about my own proposal. It is just funny to see the immediate NO i was expecting.

Do you realise that CCP might change all the ships we know in this process ?



First off...I'm not your friend Mr. nooblet carebear.

Secondly...I'm not laughing anymore....you have serious issues.

Thirdly: Don't give a #### what CCP will do? Well gee golly whiz... Guess thats /thread! CCP will change what is necessary and I'm pretty damn sure it will have nothing to do with you.

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Corina Jarr
en Welle Shipping Inc.
#10 - 2012-04-18 20:50:25 UTC
I'd like something like this (more thought out and planned). Just not this specifically.


Mostly though, I just want a reason to fly the little Proc. Its so cute but completely useless.Sad
Sutha Moliko
Giza'Msafara
#11 - 2012-04-18 21:24:51 UTC
Let me rephrase

CCP will make mistake when balancing ships and I don't care because they are taking the right direction. We will see a lot of iteration before the release of the extension (in winter probably). A Nooblet carebear like me will have nothing to say about it and i won't. I will gladly accept all the change, good or bad.

If I post in the Assembly Hall, it is because I want to draw attention on Industrial and Mining barges as spaceships.
No one pay attention to them in term of balance because they are not combat ships.

Many voices are coming from the highest noble forum spacefighter, rejecting anything related to industry. Internet spaceship is a serious business and Industrial and Mining barges are spaceships.

EvE is a living creature.
PVP is the body.
ISK is the blood.
Industry is the heart.
Drake Draconis
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-04-19 22:03:49 UTC
Sutha Moliko wrote:
Let me rephrase

CCP will make mistake when balancing ships and I don't care because they are taking the right direction. We will see a lot of iteration before the release of the extension (in winter probably). A Nooblet carebear like me will have nothing to say about it and i won't. I will gladly accept all the change, good or bad.

If I post in the Assembly Hall, it is because I want to draw attention on Industrial and Mining barges as spaceships.
No one pay attention to them in term of balance because they are not combat ships.

Many voices are coming from the highest noble forum spacefighter, rejecting anything related to industry. Internet spaceship is a serious business and Industrial and Mining barges are spaceships.

EvE is a living creature.
PVP is the body.
ISK is the blood.
Industry is the heart.


Guess again.... I AM An industrialist...and you are full of #### if you think you have any experince...at least enough to make such crazy proposals.

Period.

Some of us wear all hats...some more than others..some more loudly the others...

Stop assuming we don't care about indies or PVP'ers....fact of the matter is...everyone is doing everything in some shape form or manner.

We get it bugs you...and your concenred...but you are completely out of the ball park of rationality here.

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