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Why isn't Eve more successful?
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Matrix Operator
#1 - 2012-04-17 06:38:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Matrix Operator
I don't get it. The most beautiful graphics in the industry, a great storyline with great lore, and the lure of space, and Eve only gets 300k subscribers even after 10 tens of work. Some company makes an MMOPG with dancing Elves and ponies and it peaks at 9mil subscribers...

It can't be that wizard/fantasy is more popular than space-sci-fi. Aren't Star Wars and Star Trek proof that space-fiction has the larger following (as opposed to say, Lord of the Rings). And if so, why would 9mil players play with Elves, but only 1/30th of that choose sexy spacegraphics.

I don't get it. Can someone explain it to me?
St Mio
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2012-04-17 06:43:33 UTC
Because the masses a) want instant gratification and b) are creatively inept and incapable of building sandcastles.
Brooks Puuntai
Solar Nexus.
#3 - 2012-04-17 06:45:34 UTC
You act as if its a bad thing Eve isn't as popular as WoW or SWTOR. Could you imagine 5 million PCU and watching the servers explode. Eve's major design flaw is the fact it doesn't scale well with high numbers.

CCP's Motto: If it isn't broken, break it. If it is broken, ignore it. Improving NPE / Dynamic New Eden
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#4 - 2012-04-17 06:45:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Mr Epeen
It might be because EVE is a niche product.

It's designed to attract the worst lowlife scum of the internet. Those that have been banned from every other MMO for various offenses.

There are only so many people that can handle being around such a concentrated grouping of total sociopaths and actually enjoy it.

The real question in my mind, is how has EVE managed to attract as many players as they have?

Mr Epeen Cool
Serge Bastana
GWA Corp
#5 - 2012-04-17 06:46:25 UTC
St Mio wrote:
Because the masses a) want instant gratification and b) are creatively inept and incapable of building sandcastles.


This. Too many people brought up wanting it now, now, now and having it fed to them via TV or other media. I've seen people posting that they're bored in the game not realising that it's up to them to create their own stories in EVE.

WoW holds your hand until end game, and gives you a cookie whether you win or lose. EVE not only takes your cookie, but laughs at you for bringing one in the first place...

Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#6 - 2012-04-17 06:51:29 UTC
St Mio wrote:
Because the masses a) want instant gratification and b) are creatively inept and incapable of building sandcastles.


And c), that in EVE you are allowed to kick over those sandcastles build under b). Lol
D Program
#7 - 2012-04-17 06:53:27 UTC
Most people are puppets, they need a caretaker to show them where to go and what to do. In EVE players have to make their own choices and opinions. That is difficult for majority of the population.

What is this sorcery?

http://www.eve-cost.eu
Vetorept Fera
Doomheim
#8 - 2012-04-17 06:53:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Vetorept Fera
I would imagine it's because you can't be powerleveled or "ran through" anything. You can't buy "loot rights" there's no group finder, no instance finder, no fight finder and no raid finder and no dungeon finder. You can't queue for an instant fleet fight. It's a sandbox. 50% of the content is player created. There's no linear progression path, you choose your own destiny based upon what you consider fun or enjoyable.

Most MMO players aren't used to this experience. They're used to "endgame" and "being uber," which usually consists of standing around a market hub with their endgame gear on hoping that everyone will see their "phat lewtz" and envy them.

In pace requiescat
Bully Hedro
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#9 - 2012-04-17 07:04:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Bully Hedro
Could only be one of two differences. 1) Either Eve doesn't attract the same number of players or 2) Eve does attract high numbers but then they quit.

What would be interesting to see is the number of players that initially played Eve and then quit. Wonder if the devs would be so kind as to share these numbers.

The reputation at being a troll invested, griefers club probably has a lot to do with it as well. Just look at the forums. Probably the most poorly moderated prepubescent troll invested game forum in the industry. Gives a clue to what the in-game has in store.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#10 - 2012-04-17 07:11:33 UTC
Matrix Operator wrote:
I don't get it. The most beautiful graphics in the industry, a great storyline with great lore, and the lure of space, and Eve only gets 300k subscribers even after 10 tens of work. Some company makes an MMOPG with dancing Elves and ponies and it peaks at 9mil subscribers...

It can't be that wizard/fantasy is more popular than space-sci-fi. Aren't Star Wars and Star Trek proof that space-fiction has the larger following (as opposed to say, Lord of the Rings). And if so, why would 9mil players play with Elves, but only 1/30th of that choose sexy spacegraphics.

I don't get it. Can someone explain it to me?


Because the actual gameplay itself (point-and-click to move) isn't all that much fun. It's slow, frustrating and unintuitive. Pretty much everything about EVE is great except the way you have to do things in it.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Jackson Steely
Doomheim
#11 - 2012-04-17 07:11:47 UTC
Inb4 mass amounts of "we're better than other mmo players"
Jim Malderan
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-04-17 07:14:58 UTC
People are scared of the learning curve, although I feel that I've gotten the hang of the basics quite fast now since I started a week ago. EVE has such a hardcore reputation, and it is really hardcore compared to other games out there. The main problem is that people can't see that higher risks means higher rewards.
Matrix Operator
#13 - 2012-04-17 07:15:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Matrix Operator
Malcanis wrote:
Because the actual gameplay itself (point-and-click to move) isn't all that much fun. It's slow, frustrating and unintuitive. Pretty much everything about EVE is great except the way you have to do things in it.


Most MMOPGs have a point and click format as well however. Not much difference here.

Jim Malderan wrote:
People are scared of the learning curve, although I feel that I've gotten the hang of the basics quite fast now since I started a week ago. EVE has such a hardcore reputation, and it is really hardcore compared to other games out there. The main problem is that people can't see that higher risks means higher rewards.


I dunno. A lot of MMOPGs have learning curves just as steep. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kbs1tW6w8R0
Kuehnelt
Devoid Privateering
#14 - 2012-04-17 07:24:07 UTC
Based on watching Rookie Help, the reason is that the New Player Experience does not include any alternative to the trio of

1. reading,

2. actively exploring the interface, and, redundantly,

3. right-clicking everything.

#1 already quarters your potential user base. CCP, you can simulate a realistic view of humanity by pretending that many of your potential users have recently received a severe head injury, and only want to play EVE after taking too many pain relievers.

Have that user in mind, and then add 100MB of animated GIFs to the client, with thick red boxes and big red arrows. On first run, play one video (per supported language) that introduces the interface, how you're meant to move around, and how to get help.

That's it. Think of the doped-up head injury patients --> always have 100k active pilots.
Dr Silkworth
#15 - 2012-04-17 07:24:34 UTC
I'd really like to see more stuff for creating corps with a plan.

I'm talking project management widgets, more flexible corps hierarchies and roles,with better internal security and goal setting and measurement tools.

To me its first and foremost a sandbox for experimenting with business models. All business models must incorporate risk management and be flexible enough to incorporate the gamut of human behaviors. We need PVP to provide the risk but thats only about 1/6 of the story.

In my vision it would be a niche but not for sociopaths. It would be so credible as a sandbox that our niche would be real innovators in the world o f business and finance with the innovativeness of silicon valley start ups. We really have some of this in EVE but we need more and I think we should have more internal tools so even fools can learn how to do it.

The sociopath path were on just proves what nobody wants to accept, that a pure capitalist military structure tears itself apart and stagnates without outside input such as CCP.

Do We fail as a society and community? It sure looks like it. But we could use a better framework. We keep fiddling with rules of engagement and encourage mutual destruction but it just doesn't work and people know it. They come here and just know it can't work like this or even imagining it could work like this enough to invest their time into trying will be fruitless.

We need more toys in the sandbox.
Sasha Azala
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-04-17 07:24:47 UTC
In part, because you don't have a character as such (ok, we do now but CQ does not count for much).

Because it's a game just in space with no character socialisation.

Because EVE has a bad reputation and the players have a reputation for griefing and griefing seems to be encouraged by the game mechanics.

Because not everyone wants to buy PLEX on top of their monthly subscription just to play (casual players).

Because PvP is far too costly to engage in ISK wise and you could find yourself in a position that you can't PvP due to lack of funds.

Because corps are too paranoid about who they recruit and put restrictions on who they will recruit and this usually excludes newer players.

Because there's little actual ingame interaction in NPC corps other than the corp chat.

Because training your character is very slow and most gamers want to be able to get into the action quicker.

Because ...
Sri Nova
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-04-17 07:27:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Sri Nova
Eve is successful for its market. it is a targeted game looking to fufill a certin segment of the mmo market.

This Niche market has kept, eve running for 9 years soon to be 10 !!

Im not sure why fantasy trumps scifi but im sure there is marketing data out there that shows fantasy out sells scifi by what ever %

thats why we see more fantasy based media rather than scifi .

but you really cannot compare Blizzards game to CCP's as they are to very different beasts aimed at two very different markets .

Basically eve is successfull it may not be freaking huge but its not intended to appeal to the masses.
Ai Shun
#18 - 2012-04-17 07:33:03 UTC
Matrix Operator wrote:
I don't get it. Can someone explain it to me?


The game style appeals to different demographics. Same reason that Justin Bieber is more popular (currently) than say ... Queen. (Why did I say that, I love Queen - but they're the best example I can think of)
Babar Baboli
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2012-04-17 07:41:00 UTC
Eve is really bad at keeping their new players.
Otherwise; Sci-fi > Gay elves
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#20 - 2012-04-17 07:45:08 UTC
:effort:

.
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