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Why is anyone using a Hulk over a Covetor.

Author
Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#41 - 2012-04-12 03:21:40 UTC
Jessie-A Tassik wrote:
If you put Damage Control II and Reinforced Bulkhead II on a Covetor then you have 11,586 EHP and about 90% the mining rate of a Hulk.

For something like a tenth the price? (Last time I looked, ship prices are all over the place.)

Plus the Covetor pays out semi-decent insurance.

WHY are people using Hulks?

They are next to worthless unless you only lose one for every, well, more than 1 billion ISK mined.


Because like anything you play the odds.
Most players beat the odds, some do not.


Nedes Betternaem
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#42 - 2012-04-12 03:25:37 UTC
Simetraz wrote:
Jessie-A Tassik wrote:
If you put Damage Control II and Reinforced Bulkhead II on a Covetor then you have 11,586 EHP and about 90% the mining rate of a Hulk.

For something like a tenth the price? (Last time I looked, ship prices are all over the place.)

Plus the Covetor pays out semi-decent insurance.

WHY are people using Hulks?

They are next to worthless unless you only lose one for every, well, more than 1 billion ISK mined.


Because like anything you play the odds.
Most players beat the odds, some do not.




With hulkageddon coming up anyone mining with a hulk is no longer playing the odds, but rather just a moron (unless your in null sec or W-space).

Your Covetor is gonna get blown up as well, but at least you can possibly make back the money lost before your next Covetor gets blown up. Not gonna happen in a hulk.
Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#43 - 2012-04-12 03:27:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Kengutsi Akira
(yeah I dont mine on the guy I use on forums so locators dont help with that track record lol)

DONT sit AFK
BE ALIGNED
DONT BE STUPID

and you dont lose them is what Ive learned from my time in EVE lol

look around first, not just plopping youself into the first belt you come across
dont be stupid about it

Doing your homework, scout the system, use the resources you have available... dotlan for one. See how many people are in the system regularly before you even GO to the system.

OR Talking to friends/corp and getting a freighter/Orca in system.
WE usually get freighters in system and run them weekly/monthly to a hub.
OR I use my hauler alt to bring the ore to a hub WHILE Im mining in my untanked max yield Hulk lol
That way youre in a deserted system AND have access to a hub

Ive never even HAD a gank attempt on me
(knock on wood)

Funnily, my friend, the day he got his hulk, undocked it and someone tried (and failed) to gank his untanked Hulk right at the station

Nedes Betternaem wrote:


With hulkageddon coming up anyone mining with a hulk is no longer playing the odds, but rather just a moron (unless your in null sec or W-space).

Your Covetor is gonna get blown up as well, but at least you can possibly make back the money lost before your next Covetor gets blown up. Not gonna happen in a hulk.



I have a friend thats mined straight through hulkageddon the last three/four times in a hulk and never had an issue.
Mine where people arent

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes

Nedes Betternaem
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#44 - 2012-04-12 03:53:43 UTC
Kengutsi Akira wrote:



I have a friend thats mined straight through hulkageddon the last three/four times in a hulk and never had an issue.
Mine where people arent

One time a friend of mine t-boned hit by a dump truck while on a motorcycle and survived without a scratch, that must mean that getting hit by a truck is completely risk free.

The smart hulkegeddon gankers will search low population systems rather than competing with other gankers in high population systems, your friend just got lucky or was in one of the two places that I mentioned.
Kengutsi Akira
Doomheim
#45 - 2012-04-12 03:58:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Kengutsi Akira
Nedes Betternaem wrote:
Kengutsi Akira wrote:



I have a friend thats mined straight through hulkageddon the last three/four times in a hulk and never had an issue.
Mine where people arent

One time a friend of mine t-boned hit by a dump truck while on a motorcycle and survived without a scratch, that must mean that getting hit by a truck is completely risk free.

The smart hulkegeddon gankers will search low population systems rather than competing with other gankers in high population systems, your friend just got lucky or was in one of the two places that I mentioned.



see this hulkageddon thing is waaaaaay overblown as to how dangerous it is to mine in and thats really the only way they have an effect as far as an impact on mineral prices during it. Ppl like the above perpetuate the stereotype its more dangerous than it normally is (lol its really not, you ALWAYS have people out gunning for you when youre mining so its not THAT different). When DONT you have gankers looking for you in this game when you mine?

and yes, your argument will be valid when it happens 4 times in a row.

He's got 3 more tries at it to go

"Is it fair that CCP can get away with..." :: checks ownership on the box ::

Yes

Dyniss
KarmaFleet University
#46 - 2012-04-12 04:27:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Dyniss
Mine in a 0.0 sov alliance. Better ore better security better everything! Seriously I don't understand mining in empire with griefers just waiting to pop your ships. In 0.0 you NEVER see griefers I have never once lost a hulk while mining in 0.0.

Covetor vs Hulk? Hmm.. It's Hulk all the way. Stronger tank more CPU for mining upgrades and T2 strips bigger cargo hold HUGE resist difference over a Covetor (80+ omni tank) and way more cap then a Covetor you cannot run T2 strips with T2 crystals on a Covetor plus you will lose ore because of the yield.

In 0.0 you get all the good ore Arkonor, Bistot, Crokite and Mercoxit to name a few plus huge amounts of the basic stuff too. The Hulk towers over the Covetor. Training into a HAC over a cruiser is very similar to training to a Hulk from a Covetor In all respects.

The costs are similar too. For example a Vexor will run you around 7mil minus fittings. A Ishtar minus the fittings is around 150-160 mil. Now let's look at the Covetor vs Hulk. 10mil (roughly) for a Covetor and around 250mil for the Hulk see the similartys?
Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#47 - 2012-04-12 04:35:27 UTC
Nedes Betternaem wrote:


With hulkageddon coming up anyone mining with a hulk is no longer playing the odds, but rather just a moron (unless your in null sec or W-space).

Your Covetor is gonna get blown up as well, but at least you can possibly make back the money lost before your next Covetor gets blown up. Not gonna happen in a hulk.


Not True.

If you ever mined in 0.0 and carry over the same basic rules to high-sec you will have very little to no Issues.

The problem is there are too many complacent miners out there,
Dr Silkworth
#48 - 2012-04-12 04:52:57 UTC
Covetors have no epeen quotient.

And you don't afk roids like ice. they pop. Last time I afked a roid I was in a bestower with a t1 mining laser in orbit making 200000 an hour and thinking I was the smartest pilot in eve.
Nedes Betternaem
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#49 - 2012-04-12 04:54:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Nedes Betternaem
Simetraz wrote:
Nedes Betternaem wrote:


With hulkageddon coming up anyone mining with a hulk is no longer playing the odds, but rather just a moron (unless your in null sec or W-space).

Your Covetor is gonna get blown up as well, but at least you can possibly make back the money lost before your next Covetor gets blown up. Not gonna happen in a hulk.


Not True.

If you ever mined in 0.0 and carry over the same basic rules to high-sec you will have very little to no Issues.

The problem is there are too many complacent miners out there,

0.0 rules exist for a reason, the ore is worth 100% of your attention. In high sec the ore is not worth 100% of your attention, you can make more money running L4s.

I mine with alts, mostly covetors (to cut down gank losses) as I do more profitable things with my main as my full fledged attention is worth so much isk per hour. In order to keep my covetors aligned to an insta warp bookmark, I have to constantly be targeting new asteroids and un-targeting old as I move up and down the belt and this requires me moving back and forth between screens.

Its not profitable to split my attention like that and its risky to my main's ship (usually I am doing something combat intensive with my main and with a much more expensive ship). If my mining ops were in null or w-space where the ore has a lot of value, sure it might be worth it to stay aligned to an escape point, but not in highsec.
Skorpynekomimi
#50 - 2012-04-12 07:54:13 UTC
Bonuses, slots, and because I already HAVE the hulk is why I use it.

Anywhere risky, I will just buy a couple of covetors and some T1 strips, and write them off as lost already. No hassle about getting them back from null, either; they may have been lost in the hassle of evacuation a few times, but I don't care. 70-odd mil is chump change compared to what I've lost on bad investments overall.

Economic PVP

Zarere
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2012-04-12 08:00:08 UTC
My favourite hulk setup mines 1650 m3/minute.

My favorite covetor setup mines 1600 m3/minute.
Nirnias Stirrum
UberWTFBBQ and Battle Technologies
#52 - 2012-04-12 08:12:52 UTC
Hulk is better by far, that and you can get up to 20k EHP on a hulk, not to mention the bonuses you get with a hulk:

Mining Barge Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level.
7.5% bonus to all shield resistances per level

Exhumers Skill Bonus:
3% better yield for Strip Miners per level
3% reduction in Ice Harvester duration per level

Role Bonus:
Able to equip Strip Miner and Ice Harvester turrets.

So your yield intake is much more than a covetor. Fit your ship properly and you wont get ganked iv been mining for years and never been sui ganked in a hulk.
Prince Kobol
#53 - 2012-04-12 08:59:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Prince Kobol
Zarere wrote:
My favourite hulk setup mines 1650 m3/minute.

My favorite covetor setup mines 1600 m3/minute.


What is the tank of your Hulk v Covetor?

With my current Hulk setup I get 1600m3 every 146 seconds with a tank of EHP 27K.

Show me a Covetor fit that can do that and I will use it
Hedge bets
Doomheim
#54 - 2012-04-12 09:20:33 UTC
[quote=Lapine Davion]I have an interesting suggestion. Why don't you whiny Hulk miners move out to nullsec? The mining there is much more profitable, you don't get harassed anywhere near as much, and you don't have total shitheels flying around being ********.[/quote

This

Hulks were designed for low sec, not high sec noobs and greedy lazy players. As to the OP, why even bother a fitting like that. Cargo rigs and cargo expanders and away you go. T1 mining ships are throw away ships, all thou
Digital Messiah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#55 - 2012-04-12 09:21:19 UTC
Darth Gustav wrote:
Whitehound wrote:
The training needed for a Hulk only needs a few extra days after one has trained for a Covetor. People think of it as a major gain when they can get from a T1 ship into a T2 ship with such a short amount of training and it becomes one of the major incentives for doing it. The Hulk not only mines a little better, but it can be rigged and fitted to hold a significantly larger amount of ore then the Covetor. It means one can stay longer in the belt and also longer away from the keyboard.

And there it is.

There it ******* is.

Miners want to engage in riskless activity to grow their wallets while they are AFK.

This does not come down to personal playstyle choices. It comes down to laziness, greed, and risk aversion of sickening proportions.

I'm sure combat ships would never do this... Level 4 drone boats must not count because combat is waaaayyyy coolllah than mining.

Something clever

Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#56 - 2012-04-12 15:41:22 UTC
Digital Messiah wrote:
Darth Gustav wrote:
Whitehound wrote:
The training needed for a Hulk only needs a few extra days after one has trained for a Covetor. People think of it as a major gain when they can get from a T1 ship into a T2 ship with such a short amount of training and it becomes one of the major incentives for doing it. The Hulk not only mines a little better, but it can be rigged and fitted to hold a significantly larger amount of ore then the Covetor. It means one can stay longer in the belt and also longer away from the keyboard.

And there it is.

There it ******* is.

Miners want to engage in riskless activity to grow their wallets while they are AFK.

This does not come down to personal playstyle choices. It comes down to laziness, greed, and risk aversion of sickening proportions.

I'm sure combat ships would never do this... Level 4 drone boats must not count because combat is waaaayyyy coolllah than mining.

No level 4 mission runner is bleating through a megaphone for buffs to the Dominix on this thread, however.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom

Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#57 - 2012-04-12 15:41:40 UTC
Thus making this a strawman argument.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom

Darth Gustav
Sith Interstellar Tech Harvesting
#58 - 2012-04-12 15:41:52 UTC
Thus meaning I think I just won the interwebs.

He who trolls trolls best when he who is trolled trolls the troller. -Darth Gustav's Axiom

Vaerah Vahrokha
Vahrokh Consulting
#59 - 2012-04-12 16:13:38 UTC
Jiska Ensa wrote:
As a miner myself, I can honestly say most miners are stupid. There's nothing wrong with hulks at all. I could go on and on about how my 6 bilion isk jump freighter should be able to tank 12 tornados.

Fact of the matter is I've only ever been ganked once, and it was because I choose to mine somewhere other people go. Go to empty systems, mine to your heart's content. Even if you have to sell your minerals at reduced prices to get people with freighters to come get them, you'll still come out ahead because you'll be pulling in more isk/hour than a Covetor would 2 jumps from Jita.


Waiting for you to try ice mine.

You know, the thing where you have nowhere to go but with other 40 guys.
Steel Wraith
#60 - 2012-04-12 16:59:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Steel Wraith
Min/max dictates mining in a max yield hulk while minimizing the risks by being where gankers are less likely to roam. So far I get the most utility from this approach. If one of these hulkageddons actually has an impact on me beyond the forums then I'll reevaluate.

If I were mining with an army of alts like some players do (guh) then yeah the hulk might not be worth the risk because of the cost of paying attention. Besides, I know I'm not the only one who hates alt armies and even I'd be tempted to start ganking several zombie hulks in the same belt.