Player Features and Ideas Discussion

i understand the skill has some good aplications
so i was thinking of changing it so that you need at least the isk for the min amount you put on the order

Its not the skill that is abusive, its the combination of how minimum order quantities on buy orders and the mechanic for margin trade defaults interact to create and extremely high return, low risk mechanic that makes isk at the expense of less experienced players that is abusive. Don't get me wrong, making isk at the expense of those less knowledgeable is a big part of eve, and should remain, but the current margin trade scamming mechanics are out of balance.

do you like take 30 min to type one post out ? catch up will you

Try english. It will make people take you seriously.

omglol WHAT?

You are complaining about scams, which always utilize regular gameplay mechanics to trick new players into them.
IT IS ALWAYS THAT WAY and SCAMS ARE LEGAL!
What is this thread about?? Still dont get. Skill is working as intended but utilized for scams. SO WHAT?

No, I'm not obsessively checking your thread every second, and catch up to what? Nothing happened while I was posting that.

The question remains: what problem are you trying to solve?

…yeees? That's the whole purpose of the skill. In what way is it imbalanced?

Actualy I rather like this idea...... Scammers probably don't but whatevs.

The purpose of the skill is to allow a trader who is buying goods to put up more in buy orders then they currently have isk to cover, with the expectation that by the time the margin call occurs, they will have raised enough isk to cover the order by selling other stuff.

Using minimum order quantities to scam people with the margin trading skill is a creative use of game mechanics, but I hardly think the intended use of the skill. I don't want to stop it, just make it harder/riskier to pull off.

I'm not against the MT scams, however I was a bit perturbed by the following:

I'm selling an item, someone obviously places a MT scam buy order, I'm assuming its purpose was to encourage purchasing of the item in question, maybe the person had stock of this item.

So, I'm aware of MT scams and thought to myself, Ok I'll attempt to fill the order (had the required units). I was under the impression this would just fail the order and voila it would be gone.

Ok, so the order fails, I don't remember seeing any kind of message to indicate this ...then the units I was trying to sell to the MT scam order then got listed on the market ..this was not my intented action!

Thus I then had to pay the brokers fees to list my items, which again wasn't my intented action.

So, those that say nothing is lost, are in my eyes incorrect, I paid out broker fees to list am item I didn't wish to list due to a failed MT order. This I believe needs to be fixed.

I would not be against part filling MT buy orders either, it would help to ensure the MT mechanic is used more sparingly.

There might be a rather easy fix to this scam..

We need ccp to introduce player to player billing. A system that will have many benefits..

That would serve the purpose of fixing or helping this scam.

If the margin trader is short a bill would naturally get generated..

All outstanding bills should count against the players margin trading skill. So it would basically be inactive as long as the player have creditors.

In practice that would mean that margin scams could only be done once, after that the use of the skill would only work again when the bills are paid.

This talk of negative liquidity also brings up the idea of micro corps..
If we brought in micro corps that worked as partner to the factions, and thus could not be war decced, there would be the option to further nerf npc corp straw man operations, and avoiding "legal sanctions"..

It would make it possible to limit npc available hangar space, or make the rental of that space more expensive.
When players opted to form a partnership micro corp, the assets could be seized via a lockdown when a "bankruptcy" was in effect. This mechanic would also be a potential part of issues with "neutral" participation in wars and aggression. Thus making it harder or impossible to regain access to assets in empire. A bit like once you get kicked out of null you end up with locked down assets, that you have to liquidate at a huge loss. A similar mechanic for empire would not at all be game breaking..

The current lack of such sanctions are actually a misbalance towards null entities. Its a bit ironic that null sec have so many awesome features, and most of the EVE players base dont have access to these awesome game mechanics due to the lack of interest in the politics and aggression. I think it would be interesting to see if null sec could be made easier to upgrade into high sec areas controlled by player entities. Yes I know there are alliances that try serving that purpose, but most of these have failed to gain strong hold and popularity in the rest of the player community.