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EVE economics, care bears, pirates

Author
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#141 - 2012-04-12 13:58:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
How many players have been lost due to uncontrolled piracy. This game will NOT survive unless new players join the game and stay at a rate equal to or exceeding the rate that players retire from the game.
…except, of course, that it has done exactly that and has, in fact, done quite the opposite of what you think it should be doing — it has been constantly expanding.

So no, the game will survive with unchecked piracy. In fact, one might make a reasonable argument that it has survived because of its uncontrolled piracy.

Quote:
For the continued long term survival of the game, there must be a “safe haven” for the care bears.
No, that would ensure the instant (not long-term) death of the game, since it would completely break the economy and industry that functions as the game's engine.

Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I agree with the OP. This is what High Sec is for. At the same time this is also a game that is supposed to be hard. Perhaps there should be a small portion of space where new players can start out and learn the ropes without being insta podded the moment they log in.
The game already has this.

Andoria Thara wrote:
The only way I can ever see a "Safe Haven" working in this game is if CCP added in increased fees & taxes to the area.

The increased fees & taxes would counter-balance not losing any ships, and also provide another ISK sink.
That wouldn't really work either. If they were to introduce a no-PvP zone in EVE, they would have to make it truly no PvP in the EVE sense of the word. That would mean something along the lines of the following restrictions while in that space:

· You can obviously no longer lock any player ship.
· You can no longer activate any kind of AoE weaponry or module.
· You can no longer use the market, contracts or the trading window (in fact, the stations would have to not have any markets).
· You can no longer access or manage POSes and their services (and you obviously can't plunk any POSes down there either).
· You can no longer mine.
· You can no longer shoot rats.
· You can no longer open any kind of container in space.
· You can no longer use the on-board scanner or scan probes.
· You can no longer be in a fleet.
· You can no longer use salvagers.
· You can no longer access the industry interface (and the stations would have no industry slots).
· You can no longer access free-floating permanent sites in space.
Virgil Travis
Non Constructive Self Management
#142 - 2012-04-12 14:10:52 UTC
YuuKnow wrote:
Money talks and bulls*** walk. The most successful and profittable MMOPGs have been primarly PvE. This is true. Heck even the Eve stats show that 75% of Eve players are in Hi-Sec. The Eve Forums are so troll-infested that they are frequently dsyfunctional and don't represent the majority of the fanbase a lot of times.


First 75% is wrong, more like 60% and a good number of those are alts used by low or null sec dwellers to make money or for logistics. And comparing EVE to theme park MMO's really doesn't work. Some high sec dwellers actually accept and enjoy the fact that this game is a sandbox and not some pathetic theme park kiddies ride like you think it should be.

Unified Church of the Unobligated - madness in the method Mamma didn't raise no victims.

TheBlueMonkey
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#143 - 2012-04-12 14:20:18 UTC
Firstly,
This is a subscription based model, so, "eve won't survive" is an ambiguous expression.
There's a number of players required to keep the game running (pay for all servers, pay for all staff), aslong as we have at least that number of players, life is good.

Now you mention Sony, if you mean Starwars online, when that game started it was awesome, it was hard, becomming a jedi meant something and not everyone got to be one.
Then they nerfed the hell out of it (cateering to the carebears) and the game tanked, got dull and died... smooooth.

WoW has gone a similar way except it's aiming it's demographic lower and lower so it's getting enough new people it that it's not showing yet. Plus with only a few thousand players per server, it's easier to massage the figures if they do start to tank.

Now, businesses,

There's a world of difference between the
"we need to make enough money to keep going"
and
"lets make as much as physically possible, damn be to anythign else"

Once you start focusing on purely making money, you tend to miss why you started a company in the first place and no one out there starts an entertainment money becuase "we'll make supermoneytimes".
It's for the love of the product and the belief that if you like it then some one else probably will too.

Once you start looking at "ooo we can pay people 5p an hour instead of minimum wage if we ship out call center to derpadeprastan, damn be if the customer can't understand them" or "hey, if we use these cheap servers that'll fall over ten times a month we can save 5 grand"

There's a ballance,
Starting a company, or doing a job, PURELY for the money it pays, to me at least, has always been doomed from the start.
Ana Vyr
Vyral Technologies
#144 - 2012-04-12 14:25:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Ana Vyr
baltec1 wrote:

The bulk will quit because this would no longer be EVE.


That's a bunch of crap, IMO.

I wouldn't change EvE personally, but I really feel like this is not what would happen.
Butzewutze
Doomheim
#145 - 2012-04-12 14:34:01 UTC
Desimus Maximus wrote:
If newer (2-3 yrs old) and brand new players keep finding the game to be more and more hostile, which it is every day, they will leave. This group of young players is CCP's financial base. They typically have to pay the monthly subscription and buy PLEX just to be able to somewhat compete in-game. While the older (4+ yrs old) support their habit with PLEX and don't pay a single cent to CCP, and haven't for years.


I think u dont understand the plex-system. Where are the plexes for veterans coming from?
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#146 - 2012-04-12 14:36:28 UTC
Indahmawar Fazmarai wrote:

Nullsec is not going to grow any further. It is shrinking, actually.

Lowsec is not going to grow at all.

WH already peaked.

Now let's figure you were CCP and, out of greed, you wanted to draw new players to earn more monies. What would you do?

Yes, you guessed it. Fack everyone to keep nullseccers amused and free from the threat of hisec wardecs. Roll


Add more systems / regions to null / w-space - start a new land-rush. Plus the larger, more spread out, map would make force projection harder.
Butzewutze
Doomheim
#147 - 2012-04-12 14:39:31 UTC
Vertisce Soritenshi wrote:
I agree with the OP. This is what High Sec is for. At the same time this is also a game that is supposed to be hard. Perhaps there should be a small portion of space where new players can start out and learn the ropes without being insta podded the moment they log in.


Where does that happen in EVE?
Butzewutze
Doomheim
#148 - 2012-04-12 14:40:24 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Gunrunner1775 wrote:
present a logical counter argument then, im more then willing to listen to all sides


People who join a football club and then complain that they prefer non-contact sports should be mocked and ignored regardless of whether they've paid a subscription or not.


THIS!
Zyress
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#149 - 2012-04-12 15:35:43 UTC
Danger is what draws people to eve. Noobs are protected well in noob systems but no one is ever 100% safe and thats what most eve players are drawn to. Its not mission running, its not accumulating isk, its not manufacturing or mining. There are the megalomaniacs out there that want to build large empires in null-sec and the market guys who get a thrill out of playing the eve market, but I would not call them the a very large portion of the subscriber base. Most of us are here to survive and thrive despite the constant danger. Adds a little excitement to life.
Asuri Kinnes
Perkone
Caldari State
#150 - 2012-04-12 17:04:42 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
Those who know don't have to say, those who don't say "Huh? Wha?"

Hi / Lo / Null There's plenty of people doing what you like to do. Go do it with them and put some real challenge in your life. OR, pick on defenseless n00bs and be seen as the Beavis and Buttheads you are. We all make choices in life.

CCP needs to choose either money, or sophomoric behavior. So far, they've proven to be pretty sophmoric themselves.

Posts like yours make me want to go back to piracy...

You don't fight, that much is obvious. "my other toon drives a Mercedes" is probably older than you......Roll


You might be surprised to learn that Eve Online started out because two guys couldn't grief people enough . . .


Go figure......

Bob is the god of Wormholes.

That's all you need to know.

Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#151 - 2012-04-12 17:19:57 UTC
counter argument is a huge number of people would quit if CCP makes a super safe highsec and thus go out of business.
Malamber
Venomous Cloud
Scorned Syndicate
#152 - 2012-04-12 20:23:47 UTC
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.
Tallian Saotome
Nuclear Arms Exchange Inc.
#153 - 2012-04-12 20:24:52 UTC
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.

Because EVE is about beng able to do just about anything you want.

Moron. Roll

Inappropriate signature removed, CCP Phantom.

Malamber
Venomous Cloud
Scorned Syndicate
#154 - 2012-04-12 21:08:51 UTC  |  Edited by: Malamber
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.

Because EVE is about beng able to do just about anything you want.

Moron. Roll

Just about anything, huh? That infers an exception. Anywho, beside the point; reitterating, everyone that believes taking away the ability to gank in high-sec automatically means the death of EVE (or the essence of EVE if you will). If this miraculously happened (not saying it will, or even should), how would it affect more than a slight minority in-game? Oh noes, life ends... somehow? ...for some reason?
Virgil Travis
Non Constructive Self Management
#155 - 2012-04-12 21:34:14 UTC
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.


Sandbox not theme park, moron

Unified Church of the Unobligated - madness in the method Mamma didn't raise no victims.

Malamber
Venomous Cloud
Scorned Syndicate
#156 - 2012-04-12 21:39:02 UTC
Virgil Travis wrote:
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.


Sandbox not theme park, moron

Because some people think glass in the kids end of the sandbox doesn't belong, it's suddenly going to assplode the whole play area? Stop regurgitating rhetoric and grow an opinion.
Adunh Slavy
#157 - 2012-04-12 21:40:44 UTC
Tallian Saotome wrote:
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.

Because EVE is about beng able to do just about anything you want.

Moron. Roll



Except shoot those on the wrong side of "the law"

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#158 - 2012-04-12 21:42:45 UTC
Malamber wrote:
Why do people keep assuming the death of EVE would be caused by stopping high-sec gankers? Morons.
For the same reason other morons assume that the death of EVE would be caused by the removal of missions from highsec.
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#159 - 2012-04-12 21:49:54 UTC
I'd rather have EVE populated by 1000 great players willing to take risk than 1 million players who's most intense moment in the game was being locked on by a tutorial mission NPC.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Mathias Hex
#160 - 2012-04-12 21:51:19 UTC
Vyl Vit wrote:
Like anywhere else, they'd be no loss. Like they have to be, they'll be making themselves look BIGGER than they really are, too!
wooo hoooo

baltec1 wrote:
The bulk will quit because this would no longer be EVE.

And Other Urban Myths...let me know when your book comes out.

Darth Tickles wrote:
I think 500% would quit and -3.2% would join.

yay

"numbers pulled from my *******" is a fun game that everyone can play
Oh boy. yaaAAWWWWwwnnn another Darth.


There does seem to be alot of people here who wish swtor didnt suck ass lol. Star wars is dead to me, and no I didnt buy that pos game.

I recall one night in a nightclub called the matrix, there I was... Mother of god there I am! Holy f**k.