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INCURSION NEEDS TO BE TONED DOWN, SOMEONE WHO HAS HIS OWN TENGU FLEET IS MAKING 15 BILLION ISK A DAY
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Pelleas IV
I like space and spaceships
xXPlease Pandemic Citizens Reloaded Alliance.Xx
#81 - 2012-04-10 17:44:31 UTC
Fearless M0F0 wrote:
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:
Fearless M0F0 wrote:
Tarryn Nightstorm wrote:

Because l4 missions aren't the completely out-of-whack ISK-faucet that's been driving the price of damned near everything into the stratosphere of late.


Roll

This argument has been beaten to death already thanks to the stats CCP Diagoras has been posting to his twitter account: In average, all incursion runners receive about twice as much isk as lvl 4 runners but only 1/3 of the isk received by bounties (ratting/plex).


Disingenuous, mate (please don't insult my intelligence, thank you):

That's an extra 30-odd percent of new ISK created that wasn't there prior to the Incursion-farming craze,


Your arguments blaming isk inflation to incursions are based in nothing more than pure speculation while mine are based in FACTS, cold hard numbers straight from CCP databases.

Also, there is no 30% new isk as you state, some of us were running lvl 4 missions in Tengus before incursions were introduced so we were making isk anyways... I'll give you 15% ?



It is actually closer 20% of all new isk entering the game
(http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7MZD6-vGQms -Fanfest 2012 economics report)

Normally this wouldn't be a problem, but only 5% of eve players run incursions. Also no new isk sinks (bar concord LP, but afaik this is not a large enough sink to offset the incursion isk) were introduced with incursion to offset this injection.

Sure, rat bounties as a whole are much higher, but that category encompasses both high (mission bounties are counted in this figure) Low and null sec and it likely has many (many) more players collecting isk.

Personally i do i like incursions more than most other forms of pve though; you actually have a reason to group up and fly with other people even if they're a cakewalk at this point.
Fractal Muse
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#82 - 2012-04-10 18:30:52 UTC
Bootleg Jack wrote:
I have not done incursions, are they that easy that one person can manage the whole fight?

Is there no complexity or is it just pure numbers?

At this time there is no complexity.

Incursion sites are extremely predictable and there is really no variance in how they operate.

Because of this, I could see a single player multiboxing an incursion site.

I'm not sure how he handles logistics.. if he does. Maybe he puts a rep on each tengu and does a rep chain. Who knows.

The ISK values per day are something that I question and I'd like to see how he does this plus the set up but given how simple incursion mechanisms are - it is definitely feasible.

After the coming patch I don't think it'll be that doable since there is supposed to be an element of random introduced to Incursions. This, hopefully, means that players will have to react to changes in a dynamic environment. As such, a single player trying to control 10-12 ships won't be able to react quick enough all the time to avoid ship losses.

That's my hope at least.

Incursion vanguard sites as they are now are boring and mindless.
Sunviking
Doomheim
#83 - 2012-04-10 18:33:16 UTC
I'm not too up on multi-boxing, but I do not see how a single human can run Incursions with that many characters simultaneously unless he has some kind of botting program running.

Just a thought.
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#84 - 2012-04-10 18:48:07 UTC
Sunviking wrote:
I'm not too up on multi-boxing, but I do not see how a single human can run Incursions with that many characters simultaneously unless he has some kind of botting program running.

Just a thought.


There is a program called ISBoxer that makes multiboxing on one PC really, really easy.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#85 - 2012-04-10 19:45:13 UTC
Patient 2428190 wrote:
You realize this guy is CCP's ideal customer right?


so wheres that multi client support?

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Asuka Solo
I N E X T R E M I S
Tactical Narcotics Team
#86 - 2012-04-10 19:55:41 UTC
Sunviking wrote:
I'm not too up on multi-boxing, but I do not see how a single human can run Incursions with that many characters simultaneously unless he has some kind of botting program running.

Just a thought.


I dunno about that being the only way.

I can see my 3 screens just fine... control input suffers from a 2-3 second delay trying to find the right mouse for the right machine.

Add another 2-5 second delay for each client you have to alt tab to get to.

Eve is about Capital ships, WiS, Boobs, PI and Isk!
Rath Kelbore
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#87 - 2012-04-10 20:00:21 UTC
Jalmari Huitsikko wrote:
Ursula LeGuinn wrote:
The number of players running those nine accounts is completely irrelevant. CCP has allowed and even encouraged multiplay in EVE for years. Balancing the game around the very rare player who runs many accounts simultaneously would be silly, as would punishing such players. Also: They're paying for nine accounts.

In before "They pay for their accounts with ISK...."


Newsflash: No one gives a **** about sasquatch!

When you look at the income per character you can make with 1 and 10 there's great difference and it doesn't scale well with number fo accounts.

It's not a players fault though, reward mechanics just suck ass.


FYP you're welcome

I plan on living forever.......so far, so good.
Ch3244
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#88 - 2012-04-10 20:05:55 UTC
Nick Bison wrote:
Looks to me it's the Tengu that needs toning down.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

Cool
Welsige
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#89 - 2012-04-10 20:15:57 UTC
Angry Brother wrote:
Electric Shoe is claiming he makes 15 billion day from incursion with his own tengu fleet alts without any risk. This needs to be addressed as it is an example of the imbalance regarding risk/reward.

here are his alts:

Tengu Tabby
Tengu Talia
Tengu Tasha
Tengu Teagan
Tengu Tequila
Tengu Tex
Tengu Tiffany
Tengu Tomiko
Tengu Tracy
Tengu Trianna

Corporation: Dynamic Space Industries


Because, of course, who dosent have a fleet of Tengus?

Seriously, one cant take 1 example and extrapolate it to the entire comunity of people that run incursions, especially a case outside "the curve".

And last i checked, incursions arent risk free.

Your post is full of fail.

[b]~ 10.058 ~

Free The Mittani[/b]
Welsige
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#90 - 2012-04-10 20:21:15 UTC
Fractal Muse wrote:


Incursion vanguard sites as they are now are boring and mindless.


This holds true to each and every pve content in this game. Incursions, anomalies, complexes, belts, mining....

[b]~ 10.058 ~

Free The Mittani[/b]
Richard Hammond II
Doomheim
#91 - 2012-04-10 20:51:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Richard Hammond II
Welsige wrote:
Fractal Muse wrote:


Incursion vanguard sites as they are now are boring and mindless.


This holds true to each and every pve content in this game. Incursions, anomalies, complexes, belts, mining....


guess what gets nerfed next :D

Holds true to many PVP activities too. Gate camping for example.

Goons; infiltration at its best - first bob... now ccp itself. They dont realize you guys dot take this as "just a game". Bring it down guys, we're rooting for you.
Minabunny
Bogus Brothers Corporation
#92 - 2012-04-10 21:00:09 UTC
Give me a break - Good on him. It takes him ten aged accounts to do this. You're just crying because you don't have this type of setup. He's paying good $$ to keeps these accounts and he should be able to make money with them. Just like people in null sec running multiple accounts can make just as much.
Leisen
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#93 - 2012-04-10 22:36:14 UTC
That's...not a problem with incursions. That's a problem with someone being allowed to have his own fleet. People had been doing this in L4s long before incursions came along.
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#94 - 2012-04-11 06:35:07 UTC
Also, to all the people crying about him running his own fleet in highsec. I'm pretty sure he's only in lowsec.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Ironwomen
Uber Awesome Fantastico Awesomeness Group
#95 - 2012-04-11 06:43:11 UTC
So 15bill / 10 chars...

means 1.5bill/char

at 100misk/h guys playing 15H/day

OR your saying he is making over 100misk/h

Fail to see the issue here...

Op just sounds mad that he/she can not run 10 accounts / play 15H/day.

Station trading needs to be nerfed as people can make more than 1.5 bill a day.

What about moon mining

And yes I know that is isk being moved not made...

Who cares... people getting rich OH NOZ...

And no I do not run them... do not want to.

Sounds to me if anything null sec needs to be looked at as not enough isk is being blown up.
Lapine Davion
Outer Ring Applied Logistics
#96 - 2012-04-11 07:14:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Lapine Davion
Ironwomen wrote:
So 15bill / 10 chars...

means 1.5bill/char

at 100misk/h guys playing 15H/day

OR your saying he is making over 100misk/h

Fail to see the issue here...

Op just sounds mad that he/she can not run 10 accounts / play 15H/day.

Station trading needs to be nerfed as people can make more than 1.5 bill a day.

What about moon mining

And yes I know that is isk being moved not made...

Who cares... people getting rich OH NOZ...

And no I do not run them... do not want to.

Sounds to me if anything null sec needs to be looked at as not enough isk is being blown up.


I, for one, do not want to see people getting rich, unless I can get rich too. And I can't get rich, because :effort:

Edit: If more Titans would die, then there would be plenty of isk getting blown up.

[b]Don't worry about posting with your main!  Post with your brain! "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."[/b]
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#97 - 2012-04-13 11:44:23 UTC
Plus 1 wrote:
Nerf how fast that guy presses F1!


As fast as you for a single char, that is the problem.
All you need, other than hardware of course, is a program that aloud you to control ALL the accounts with a single mouse/keyboard. Whenever you click for one the program automatically does it for ALL the accounts at the exact same time.

For me this guy is just a botter nothing else, CCP can say whatever they want because "x" guys playing "x" accounts that pay "y" cash have the right to.
Yes they have the right to waste the game and contribute to all negative sides of the game, point blanck and you don't have to enjoy my point of view or like it, I don't give a dam because I already know what it comes with over time.

So, I ask CCP, if you aloud those guys to play 20+ accounts at the same time, we should get the tools to counter it but you don't.
So now I'm asking why the main char from witch all actions come from doesn't have a tag so that we recognise it and can eventually try to do something?
They have the advantage of poser, ecm, webs and scrams even remote so why can't we identify the major threat and try to deal with it? -Once again you're doing your job half way.
BrutalButFair
Fleet of the Damned
#98 - 2012-04-13 11:50:40 UTC  |  Edited by: BrutalButFair
Angry Brother wrote:
Electric Shoe is claiming he makes 15 billion day from incursion with his own tengu fleet alts without any risk. This needs to be addressed as it is an example of the imbalance regarding risk/reward.

here are his alts:

Tengu Tabby
Tengu Talia
Tengu Tasha
Tengu Teagan
Tengu Tequila
Tengu Tex
Tengu Tiffany
Tengu Tomiko
Tengu Tracy
Tengu Trianna

Corporation: Dynamic Space Industries


Couldn't care to read all the posts but that's 1.5 bill a char. So how many hours a day is he spending on this? Let's assume 100 mil per hour. That would mean 15 hours of incursions! Ok this was said already Cool

Incursions isn't that great in making isk except for the risk/isk ratio. But enough about that. I make 250 mill an hour doing missions with 1 char. So in 6 hours i would have accumelated 1.5 bill
Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#99 - 2012-04-13 12:26:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Ciar Meara
Tarsus Zateki wrote:
Angry Brother wrote:
Electric Shoe is claiming he makes 15 billion from incursion with his own tengu fleet alts without any risk. This needs to be addressed as it is an example of the imbalance regarding risk/reward.


Then man up and do something about it. If you feel the risk vs. reward ratio lies to heavily in reward for this person, start suicide ganking him. Don't blame CCP when small minorities of players game the system. Its impossible to create a system that is entirely fool proof.

If you feel this situation is unfair, its your fault.


You are not only a handsome devil, but you make sense today (well thats stretching it, in this thread at least).

Btw, those character names look familiar...

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]
EFF ONEF1
Caldari Grand Prix Engineering
#100 - 2012-04-13 12:33:52 UTC
incurions should not be balanced against the rumour and alleged claims of 1 person running 10 accounts.

even if they are tru it shouldnt be. he is the very rare exception not the norm and no matter what CCP does with any system in this game, there will be epople like him running 10 accounts at once to use it.



on another note. I think Porsches should be nerfed. I cant afford one and they drive by me in my hatch and make me feel bad about myself. End up having to call mom to get cheered up.