EVE New Citizens Q&A

Hi there,

I just moved out to 0.0 for the first time, and I'm still learning the ropes. I haven't had the chance to move a lot of hardware out there yet. So when the call went out last night for a fleet to clear out some reds in our space, I didn't have much to offer. However, the FC did mention that scouts would be handy -- so I offered up the services of my Helios.

The FC was less than enthused. "Do you have a cloaky recon?" Can't fly one yet. "Do you have a BC?" Not down here yet. "How about an interceptor?" Sigh. Sorry, I brought what I have.

I got the distinct impression that I was a complete waste of space. I understand that one of the other ships would have been better for the fleet, but again, I simply could not bring one to the table. Surely there is some value in having a cloaky scout? Especially since the fleet ended up getting ambushed by an NC. HAC gang...

So, if its use as a scout is as limited as this FC claims, what is the role of the covert ops frigate exactly? There has to be something I can contribute, aside from AFK cloaking :\

Your FC is talking out of his ass.

Sure, a cloaky recon is excellent for grabbing a tackle on a lone ship if you're running for ganks and/or can contribute to the gang in a meaningful way (Arazu & Rapier in particular), but the Covops class of ship perform excellently as scouts. Since, you know, they can cloak and ****.

They perform BETTER than a recon for scouting for a larger gang, for the following reasons:

- Smaller and faster. They get there quicker
- Less likely to be caught
- They warp quicker
- Scan bonus. Surprise! You can actually use this. Which member of the gang is going to get a warp in to the alpha fleet sitting 90km from the gate? You.
- You can fit a little EWAR (damps / tracking dissys) and hang out at range, messing people up and staying out of danger. A single optimal range scripted TD can ruin someones day

The best FCs I know started their PVP life as scouts in Covops ships. Some of them still lead fleets from them (or they're the scout on an alt).

I don't think your FC is one of these.

See, yeah, that's what I thought too, but the FC made it clear that I was dead weight unless I could participate in combat. But it's not like space was limited, right? I wasn't denying someone else a spot...

Also, yeah, I totally could have given them a warp-in on that Dramiel sitting 300km off the gate >_< Without instructions to do so, however, I was afraid of spooking him with probes.

No, there's really nothing else to the story. I x-ed up for a home defense fleet that was calling for scouts, and the FC wanted me flying literally anything but a covops. Does the fact that it was a relatively small gang (~12 pilots) change anything?

Also, forgive my ignorance. What does "muppet" mean in this context? :P

It's funny...I was a scout in the Army. I served under several commanders (at different levels) who had a wide-range of ideas as to what scouts were supposed to do.

Some wanted us to simply be eyes. If we were seen or engaged, we essentially failed our mission. Others wanted us to take out lead elements of the enemy (their scouts). One actually assigned us a "die-in-place" mission (in training) wherein we were to engage the enemy until we were no longer able to present a fighting force.

The sneak&peek missions were what I liked. Much like what I like to do in-game in my Anathema. Unfortunately, a lot of "scout-qualified" players like that job because of the low-risk aspect of ship loss. You didn't mention...it could be that the FC had a compliment of eyes and wanted something along the lines of force-recon.

There is a fine line in combat environment (real and virtual) between knowing the "big picture" and just keeping your head down and doing your effing job. That's not meant as a slam on the OP...that's how it was explained to me.

So, while I was in 0.0, I would hop in my Anathema and go muck about in other people's space on my own...when corp/alliance ops weren't going on of course. A little extra intel never hurt, and it helped me learn my way around the territory. Also helped work on the skills.

Some FCs will take on the extra baggage of a new member in a ship he doesn't need and send him off with another scout or to some low-priority avenue in order to get the training in. Others can't be bothered or don't want to deal with the distraction.

Scouts can be pretty important and you need to know SOP for scouts and the intel channel before you go out.

KB

Thanks for sharing guys. I think for now I'm going to tool around and make a shitton of safe spots around here and in red space :)

Perhaps I'll find someone in the alliance who can help mentor me in our SOPs etc.

Heh, I don't really think they need to be harder to catch :P

This is almost certainly the case. However, at the same time they're not really losing anything, as the choice was to take the Helios or nothing at all.

From my experience Yulai is not very good at helping new players. After our recent war dec with you I found myself having to teach young yulai players (technically my wartargets) how to not autopilot and insta-warp with their pods. It was quite sad and I told many of them to find a new corp...

It's all going to come down to what the FC is willing to accept in his fleet.

Generally, the covert ops ships are seen as less than ideal. A Force Recon has the same cloaking ability and can often fit a probe launcher. An interceptor has pretty good survivability when jumping into a hostile force, can catch targets of opportunity and warps faster. Which is all very sad because Covert Ops seem like they should be a stepping stone to the Force Recons and so many new players think they are the way to go.

They kind of need a little something special (more special than a probing bonus, because good probers don't really need the bonus for most tasks).

That said, I'd take a covert ops over nothing. But I don't generally FC either.