Ships & Modules

Double, sorry

Ben Booley and I talked this over and we have an alternate solution.

Stop people from refitting their ships when they have an aggression timer. This will stop aggressive Titans and Dreads from refitting while still allowing bait / cyno / triage carriers not being aggressive to do so.

You need to write a post about this ... being on page ∞ of this thread, it likely is not going to get read. One of your posts is likely to catch the eye of someone at CCP and it should/could get passed onto to CCP Carebear Greyscale.

I'd be in favor of modifying in-space fitting so that it comes with some sort of timer. Instant fitting should only be an option when docked. Armor plates shouldn't be able to magically and instantly appear on your ship just because you're sitting next to a carrier (or a Tender, which is a great idea!)

I'd say that being immobilized for the duration of the fitting operation (say, one minute? 30 seconds? 5 minutes? open for debate?) would be a good compromise. The farther we can take this concept away from "push / to switch weapons" while still keeping this cool emergent tactic in the game the better.

EDIT: You could think of it as having a pit crew. How quickly they can change out a ship's modules. Could be based on ship sizes, it being easier (faster) to change fittings with smaller ships, or few modules changed out. Could even be a skill for it, if that sounds reasonable. Carriers could have faster refit times than Tenders (assuming CCP adds in Tenders.) And so on, so forth.

This might well work better, and since the intention is to make supercap refitting less practical without neccessarily impacting smaller classes to the same extent, the refit timer could even scale according to the ship size (it takes longer to move those modules into place when the fitting slot is 10km away at the other end of the hull).

Makes sense. Considering how fast a carrier can move, and the size of a titan, replacing it's armor membrane or something would take a while.

Is there any way that we can get CCP to reconsider their position on removing combat refitting as an option for pilots?

I really dont think such a sweeping change should be made in a "quick, surgical adjustment to solve a specific issue"

Im of the same opinion on the XL gun damage scaling because this is a totally unprecedented change, but that, i can live with. (can we at least get the siege module tracking penalty removed?)

Im just not sure that you guys fully understand the ramifications of what is going on here, or just how critical the ability to refit is to a triage carrier or a dread in siege. I think you many unintentionally be nerfing small gang warfare; i understand the need to balance for the masses, but does that necessitate screwing over the minorities? isnt there a middle ground we can find?

Check calendar. Its easter holiday. Greyscale should be back on Tuesday at the latest.

Yes; this would at least slightly handicap supercaps when refitting in a large battle. I say slightly because with a decent triage fleet supporting you, the energy RRs can cap you up fairly fast. it will depend on the neuting pressure your fleet is under as to how effective this is; if you are under no neuting then you will be able to refit fairly regularly (every few minutes?) but if you are being neuted to hell and back, you will have to choose wisely.

I think that refitting, targeted or not, should dump your cap and any shield extenders you have, just like we w-space denizens suffer when faffing about in w-space.

Since we are on mid-battle logistics, you should not be able to swap ships when targeted; this would eliminate the cowardly orca on the lowsec gate farce which Heretics get into from time to time. Just sayin'

How did a Titan balancing thread get de-railed to a combat re-fitting discussion? So what if supers can refit .. the main problems with supers have nothing to do with that. And before that the discussion got side-tracked into nerfing the titan's guns through tracking/sig res reductions, etc. Seriously, the guns on a titan are nothing compared to the dps and the alpha of the 1 DD alone, which unlike the dread, does NOT require Siege.

Every way I look at it, the problem with the Titan is the DD, specifically the alpha and the dps. The problem with the MOMs is the dps. Hence the term, Supers Online. Flying any other ship, esp. non-super caps, is foolish with the threat of supers, which is everywhere thanks to cynos. Nerfs to super EHP and to log-off escapes certainly helped things a little, but let's look at the real problem. DD is so OP that MOMs can barely afford to be fielded, if it wasn't for their dps. So, I say, DD to structures only and boost dps to main guns to match the dread with the Titan in Siege. Siege enables DD and high gun dps. Similarly for MOMs, make fighter bombers only able to attack/hit structures. When hitting other caps, they must also use fighters. That would reduce the dps a bit while preserving the high dps FBs for strategic sov use in a manner similar to my proposed Titan change above. Both changes would probably be quite simple to make and easy to follow.