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Ruined by zydrine speculation... and my own stupidity

Author
Lauren Hellfury
Super Happy Awesome Fun Times
#21 - 2012-04-05 18:37:54 UTC
Don't mention the nitrotopes!




*shudder*

Help rid New Eden of T2 BPOs: ** https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=62797 **The Full Pocket Aggro blog:  http://fullpocketaggro.blogspot.com/ **Now showing: **Margin Trading Scams

Ank Parkor
WildSpace Otters
#22 - 2012-04-05 18:39:04 UTC
I feeled the need of posting this to alleviate the weight of my error but feared the comments.
But I see nice people giving advices, it looks like there aren't only griefers in the community Big smile

Quote:
Everyone wants to know how much you lost.

It doesn't matter. Whatever is the sum, some will say that they earn more in an hour, others will tell that I didn't deserve cause of this bad fail.
Anyway no numbers can summarize the "work" of a gamer life.

Quote:
One important rule in the past has been "tab is your friend" which means to hit tab after entering a number instead of enter. Tab is supposed to (or at least used to) update the order window so things like commas (for thousands and millions) were inserted, the total amount of the order, the fees and taxes, and the % above or below average market prices were updated. Now there is often a delay between hitting tab and the window update, but it is still certainly good advice to hit tab and make sure the order window updates and is displaying the information you expect to see.

I didn't know that, awesome tip, thanks!

Quote:
That's why you need to keep the bulk of your isk in a corp wallet or banking alt.

Yes... I'll keep 1B on my corp wallet now.

Quote:
A site dedicated to this sort of thing it seems:
http://wallstfolly.typepad.com/wallstfolly/trade_errors/

"Big fat fingers", it's that Straight


But enough talked, fortune awaits!
I have a plex to farm, an Abaddon ready to pulverize Amarr ennemies and a Noctis dreaming of seeing the world outside his hangar.
See you soon, I'll be back on the market when I'll have some billions to lose Smile

[u]Short time trader, short term missionner, long term ambitions.[/u]

Bring justice to EVE: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1171333

Adunh Slavy
#23 - 2012-04-05 18:40:53 UTC
mickydees wrote:
50m lost and you felt it worthy of making a topic here?
GTFO



Bite me

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

Shar Tegral
#24 - 2012-04-05 19:40:38 UTC
50 mil or 500 mil doesn't make a difference. The code may or may not be sloppy but the solution already exists: Use Tab, not Enter.

Use TAB

Not ENTER.


PS: I say this every time one of these stories comes up. Shame it is not part of the new player experience some where.
Mookie Quantico
Doomheim
#25 - 2012-04-05 20:38:03 UTC
Ank Parkor wrote:
I just want to share this humiliation and have some feedbacks on how I could avoid this in the future Smile



Pro Tip: Friends don't let friends Drink and Trade. Blink

Look at it this way... could have been Tech you paid 10x too much for. Shocked

Mook
Herping yourDerp
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2012-04-05 20:47:05 UTC
friend of mine sold a cargo expander 2 for like 50 mil or so... we thought i was a kid doing RMT.
Aina Sasaki
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-04-05 22:44:11 UTC
Happened to me about 2 weeks ago or so. Ended up losing about 350m thanks to a typo. Thankfully I made up the loss before that day was over. :)

- Rei

Dandro Gaterau
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2012-04-05 23:40:10 UTC
Clearly a market bug by CCP.

In no way should you as buyer pay more than the best sell order which fulfils your buy order.

In RL trading on stock exchanges its impossible that by setting a too high limit you have to pay that price. You would always get the best sell price possible on the market.
Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
#29 - 2012-04-06 00:34:06 UTC
Dandro Gaterau wrote:
Clearly a market bug by CCP.

In no way should you as buyer pay more than the best sell order which fulfils your buy order.

In RL trading on stock exchanges its impossible that by setting a too high limit you have to pay that price. You would always get the best sell price possible on the market.



A buy order is an offering to purchase junk at a set price by the buyer. It's not an agreement to buy someones over priced crap at the sellers listing.

The fact that the buyer had fat fingers and offered to buy junk at inflated rates 3 to 30 times the markets selling price is always the buyers fault. He made a buy offer to the world, and the world said.... hell yea, ill sell.


SH
Towaoc
Applied Technologies Inc
Agents of Fortune
#30 - 2012-04-06 00:35:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Towaoc
Ank, I know how you feel. I suffered my single largest loss ever - 8.4 billion ISK - in just the same way. It was back in June of 2009, a busy Sunday in Jita and market order entry lag was almost unbearable. You could key in an order, leave to go get a beer, and still see the digits loading into the order entry window, one.... by.... one... when you returned. I was trying to enter an order to buy 20,000 units of Ferrogel, then trading at around 47,000 per unit. I thought I had keyed in a buy price of 47,040 per unit and hit Enter (yea, I know, stupid me for hitting Enter), but the window showed only 4704. After a reasonable pause, I keyed another 0 and hit Enter. Of course, the extra zero then finally registered along with two enters, so I never saw a warning screen. My order filled at a price of 470,400!

I petitioned this until I was blue in the face, on two grounds. First, extreme market lag had caused this order entry error. Second, on the point brought up by Dandro and others - that the order entry mechanic is grossly flawed. An order should be handled as a limit order to buy (or sell) at the stated price or better. A buy order at a price higher than currenlty listed sell orders should fill in layers, at the asked price of each outstanding sell order in queue up to the limit price. Same in reverse for sell orders. Had that mechanic been in place, my order would have filled in several increments at prices ranging from 48,000 to 49,000 per unit.

Most of you will be pleased to hear that CCP stood its ground, never giving in to my reimbursement request, despite my lengthy and (I thought) well-presented arguments, until I finally grew weary of the battle. There was no acknowledgement of extreme lag, and the mechanics were deemed to be working as intended.

Fortunately, my loss was only 8.4 billion.... Blink
Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
#31 - 2012-04-06 01:03:52 UTC
Towaoc wrote:
Ank, I know how you feel. I suffered my single largest loss ever - 8.4 billion ISK - in just the same way. It was back in June of 2009, a busy Sunday in Jita and market order entry lag was almost unbearable. You could key in an order, leave to go get a beer, and still see the digits loading into the order entry window, one.... by.... one... when you returned. I was trying to enter an order to buy 20,000 units of Ferrogel, then trading at around 47,000 per unit. I thought I had keyed in a buy price of 47,040 per unit and hit Enter (yea, I know, stupid me for hitting Enter), but the window showed only 4704. After a reasonable pause, I keyed another 0 and hit Enter. Of course, the extra zero then finally registered along with two enters, so I never saw a warning screen. My order filled at a price of 470,400!

I petitioned this until I was blue in the face, on two grounds. First, extreme market lag had caused this order entry error. Second, on the point brought up by Dandro and others - that the order entry mechanic is grossly flawed. An order should be handled as a limit order to buy (or sell) at the stated price or better. A buy order at a price higher than currenlty listed sell orders should fill in layers, at the asked price of each outstanding sell order in queue up to the limit price. Same in reverse for sell orders. Had that mechanic been in place, my order would have filled in several increments at prices ranging from 48,000 to 49,000 per unit.

Most of you will be pleased to hear that CCP stood its ground, never giving in to my reimbursement request, despite my lengthy and (I thought) well-presented arguments, until I finally grew weary of the battle. There was no acknowledgement of extreme lag, and the mechanics were deemed to be working as intended.

Fortunately, my loss was only 8.4 billion.... Blink



I disagree a bit. I think a buy offer should be just that... an offer to buy at the price set by the buyer, and filled for exactly the price submitted in the order.

SH
Dandro Gaterau
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2012-04-06 01:20:14 UTC
Stealing Honest wrote:
I disagree a bit. I think a buy offer should be just that... an offer to buy at the price set by the buyer, and filled for exactly the price submitted in the order.

SH

Nope. I disagree and submitted a bugreport about that problem.
Mr Blueberry
#33 - 2012-04-06 01:33:39 UTC
Had this happen to me a couple years ago.

Modified a buy order for megacyte to be over 10 times larger. I realized I did it the second I pressed enter...couldn't do anything about it until the 5 minute modify timer expired but the order was filled in a few seconds.

It was only 700m but back then that was like half my total Isk.
Kandreath
De Re Metallica
#34 - 2012-04-06 01:43:38 UTC
Raven Ether wrote:
Proof that market UI is a JOKE and needs updating by CCP, functionality and performance wise.


Seriously??!!??

I don't think that Ank Parkor was saying anything other than, "Yeah I messed up, but what can I do to avoid this later on?". (And in the process provide some light entertainment Lol).

Now you are going to turn this into a CCP market interface rage thing? - Seriously?

IMO - if CCP were going to touch this part of the game I would prefer they look at something more interesting.

The fact that you can [TAB] and get the pricing formatted with thousands separators and decimal points plus as Brock points out there should've been a warning about being xx% percent above market average, should be enough. (Actually I'm unclear if you can turn this warning off, but I keep it on and it has saved my wallet at least 10 times).

In any case, not every mistake you make is someone else's (like CCP's) fault.
Stealing Honest
Stealing Honest Speculation Group LLC
#35 - 2012-04-06 01:52:37 UTC
Dandro Gaterau wrote:
Stealing Honest wrote:
I disagree a bit. I think a buy offer should be just that... an offer to buy at the price set by the buyer, and filled for exactly the price submitted in the order.

SH

Nope. I disagree and submitted a bugreport about that problem.




What exactly are you bug reporting?

"Dear CCP, your Buy orders have been working as intended for 9 years...please stop." ?!??



SH
Adunh Slavy
#36 - 2012-04-06 02:39:37 UTC
Kandreath wrote:
In any case, not every mistake you make is someone else's (like CCP's) fault.



Poor bullet proofing is always the developer's fault, always.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

snake pies
Dixon Cox Butte Preservation Society
#37 - 2012-04-06 03:34:22 UTC
I feel ya. The stupid market warnings don't make any sense, except that one time this happens.

Sometimes I edit an order 1 isk and it tells me 1500% kljdfkljdasklfjaklsjflkasjkldasjdklasjkldjaskld? yes no?


needs overhaul badly
Boomhaur
#38 - 2012-04-06 04:45:22 UTC
I remember years ago when I was flying a Drake when I was a noob and was a few days away from flying the Nighthawk, I just randomly checked the contracts and what do I see a Nighthawk with T2 Shield Purgers for only 200mil, I sold both my Drakes and various other ships/modules just to buy it. As back than the Nighthawk cost 200mil and EACH T2 rig cost over 400mil, so it was a 1bil ship for 1/5 of the cost. Needless to say I was jumping for joy over that transaction.

The name of the ship was Punishment, suiting name considering how much the pilot lost on that sell. That ship served me admirably for about 3-4years till it met it's untimely demise last year due to random acts of stupidity.

Welcome to Eve. Everyone here is an Evil Sick Sadistic Bastard who is out to get you. Anyone who tells you otherwise is either trying to scam you or use you.

Jejju
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#39 - 2012-04-06 09:41:27 UTC  |  Edited by: Jejju
(Almost) all traders have made this mistake to some degree. When I lost 200m making this mistake I evemailed the people I had 'given' money to, explained the situation and asked for some of the money back. I think I got about 80m back.

Your milage may vary and I'm sure that some people would consider sending the mails as pathetic begging - your call.

I would almost always give such money back, given a polite request.
Shar Tegral
#40 - 2012-04-06 10:47:36 UTC
Shar Tegral wrote:
50 mil or 500 mil doesn't make a difference. The code may or may not be sloppy but the solution already exists: Use Tab, not Enter.

Use TAB

Not ENTER.


Just in case you missed it the first time around.

if (Use TAB);

joy;

else;

tears;