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Scammers in my EVE Online?

First post First post
Author
Lisa Eldridge
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#21 - 2011-09-26 19:14:01 UTC
Scams are scams and anyone with common sense will see that. I've never been victim to a scam in EVE, nor any game and neither should anyone else fall victim to them. Honestly, I find it ridiculous that developers of a game promote this kind of behavior and it makes my job as a recruiter and director that much harder. Your goal was to get people to trust each other and make friendships correct? Well you keep shooting yourselves in the foot every time you talk about how great it is to ruin friendships and promote paranoia and closed groups.
Feligast
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#22 - 2011-09-26 20:07:24 UTC
Lisa Eldridge wrote:
Scams are scams and anyone with common sense will see that. I've never been victim to a scam in EVE, nor any game and neither should anyone else fall victim to them. Honestly, I find it ridiculous that developers of a game promote this kind of behavior and it makes my job as a recruiter and director that much harder. Your goal was to get people to trust each other and make friendships correct? Well you keep shooting yourselves in the foot every time you talk about how great it is to ruin friendships and promote paranoia and closed groups.


You sound awfully mad. Why you so mad?
Taedrin
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2011-09-26 22:33:54 UTC
The Killer Recruit Scam


When desperate for new recruits, young CEOs and recruiters will often get lazy with their background checks. They will accept ANYONE into their corp. These scammers are depending upon this laziness. They go to the recruitment channel, say that they are looking for a new corp. They get invited to a chat channel for a quick interview by the eager CEO/recruiter. The scammer is eager to join and wants to help with your mining ops/run missions/whatever it is that you do.

They apply to join the victim's corporation, and once accepted, the carnage begins. You see, CONCORD does not interfere with fights between player corporation members. So once the scammer gets in to your corporation, they can kill whomever they like without any CONCORD interference. They may ransom you, they may look for one of your members with a faction fit navy battleship, they may just go on a rampage and kill everyone they see in your corporation.

The worst part is that once they accept your invitation - YOU CAN'T REMOVE THEM FROM THE CORPORATION UNTIL THEY DOCK OR LOG OFF.

How to avoid falling for this scam:
Always do a background check on EVERY recruit. At the very least, check their employment history and look for red flags - having left every corp they join after a very short period of time is the most important red flag to look for in this scam.
Lord Haur
Star Frontiers
Brotherhood of Spacers
#24 - 2011-09-26 22:44:20 UTC
Trimutius III wrote:

Fifth, Try to avoid courier contracts that ask you to go to low secs and zero secs (even NPC stations) if you are not 100% sure that you will be able to run from the ones who created the contract when they will try to catch and destroy your ship...


While on the topic of Courier scams, the "courier to a station you can't dock in" scam isn't the only scam possible. There are also high-volume high-collateral courier contracts with a very short completion time, and often a high reward. The idea for the scammers here is twofold: one, get the courier to cough up a large collateral for a package worth a few million ISK, typically POS modules or low value components for capitals/stations. Secondly, they ensure that the package must be carried by a ship with a large cargohold. This makes it a much easier target to suicide gank, thus ensuring the contract can never be completed.

If you ARE going to risk these kind of contracts, always use an alt character to accept the contract, preferably in a NPC corp, and then trade the package to your main for hauling. However, check out the route required, and be extra vigilant if it leads into a small pocket with only one entrance, or if the only route passes through an area off the major trade lanes. The scammers may/will be watching these locations and using Cargo Scanners to check the contents of any passing hauler/freighter, for one that matches their courier contents.
Spiritualhawk
Cosmos Industrial
Cosmos Origins
#25 - 2011-09-27 00:05:21 UTC
goonswarm has tried to scam me, as i am a industrial/mining pilot. more than three or four offers have been thrown my way from time to time.
and if any goonswarm tries to lie about it, i have the chat logs to prove it.
the trick is to remember one thing
goon, and their allies, cannot be trusted for even recruitment.
kelly mcgill tried to take me for all i was worth. got the chat logs to prove it too.
if you see her in recruitment, dont ever answer her. its a setup. they will go to seroius lengths to make you believe that its legit, but on goons own webpage it says if someone asked you for any money at all, its a scam.

dont ever believe anything you see in local.
your best bet is just to remember that REAL corps will not ask you to move your items thru lowsec, or into nullsec. they will work with you, and not give you a deadline. a real corp wont promise the moon, with no investment of time, or isk.
if it seems too good to be true, it is. dont forget even if they let you into the corp, they now have the ability to pop you no matter what, and no concord interference.

.. but thats the name of eve. no risk; no reward. think your decisions over carefully.
Toshiro GreyHawk
#26 - 2011-09-27 02:06:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Personally, the closest I've come to someone trying to scam me was when I was a few days old and doing mine & return in a Navitas @ Duripant. This guy in an industrial comes along and kindly offers to haul my ore for me. I turned him down and he couldn't seem to understand why. I told him that it was because I preferred to do everything myself - but the fact of the matter was - that I didn't trust him - as I had been playing long enough to know that once my ore was in his ship ... it wasn't my ore any more ... I didn't tell him that - as information is power and I was better off pretending that I didn't know what he was up to - than getting in some pissing contest, with him evidencing pretend outrage that I question his motives ... I had better things to do. Of course ... he actually could have been someone just trying to help a new person out ... but ... no ... I'd have been a fool to trust him.


Another scam I saw some people laughing about in Amarr local (including the victim) was a contract for a rigged hulk - including all the fittings. The only problem was ... the only thing actually there ... was the fittings ... no actual Hulk.


Now ... as to the Goons. The thing to understand about the Goons is - they are members of a comedy web site who sometimes play games together. They were calling themselves Goons before EVE existed. That's just their nickname for people who frequent that site (Something Awful) and I had heard of it before I started playing EVE. I've not been there - but I understand that it IS posted on the Goons web site - that in order to join their in game organizations - you have to ALREADY be a member in good standing of the Something Awful web site and have a reference from someone who will vouch for you. Anyone else - is fair game. This is a video of one such "recruitment":

Goon recruitment policy enforced.


For the most part, they seem to be a bunch of guys who like to have fun ... just at other peoples expense. Thus, there is no point in trying to deal with them if you aren't already one of them ...

*shrug*




.
Armtoe
Arton Yachting and Angling Club
Domain Research and Mining Inst.
#27 - 2011-09-27 02:30:10 UTC
Nobody has mentioned the really big eve scams - aka the eve bank. Anybody who says that if you give them x amount of isk and they will give you a guarenteed rate of return is running a classic ponzi scam.
Marc W2048
Clan 86
Antesignani Alliance
#28 - 2011-09-27 02:54:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Marc W2048
hmskrecik wrote:
Marc W2048 wrote:
Just like in the real world if you don't pay attention, it's your loss. File a petition in Eve for your own lack of attention and get a nice reply from a Dev saying sorry. What they should say is, " You were an idiot, not our problem."


Well... Unlike in EVE, if you scam in real world you are hunted down and if you're lucky enough that police find you before lynching mob does you are sent to the federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison. Show me actual society or non-cult religion which endorses scamming everyone around.



I am more than aware that society in general does not condone scamming and that it is illegal. However we allow idiots to dump coffee on thier laps and sue people for thier own stupidity. At least in Eve you just take your scalded balls and go sit in the station and cry. I personally feel that in the real world we protect the stupid masses too damn much and I for one enjoy the lack of protection in Eve. Oh and I have had corp mates and in game friends that fall prey to a scam that do your "lynching mob" concept and get even with the person that did the scam, so you can exact revenge in Eve.
Midori Amiiko
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2011-09-27 04:31:48 UTC
The key ingredient in any scam is the greed of the mark. Don't be greedy and you'll be immune to 90% of the scams out there. Contract scamming is a lot harder since they added numerical descriptors (like millions) to the ISK figures.
Keep your nose clean and your eyes on the details and you'll do all right.
Apollo-Moor
Omni Defense Intelligence Network
Get Off My Lawn
#30 - 2011-09-27 06:08:19 UTC
hmskrecik wrote:
Marc W2048 wrote:
Just like in the real world if you don't pay attention, it's your loss. File a petition in Eve for your own lack of attention and get a nice reply from a Dev saying sorry. What they should say is, " You were an idiot, not our problem."


Well... Unlike in EVE, if you scam in real world you are hunted down and if you're lucky enough that police find you before lynching mob does you are sent to the federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison. Show me actual society or non-cult religion which endorses scamming everyone around.


This ones funny..

Personally I don't fall for scams and if youre someone who likes to buy the shinny stuff its best to know contracting prices and scams. I myself am fairly good at catching scams and have no problem blowing them up(calling out scam and details) whenever I see them in local. Some might ***** cause I go so hard and I might get blocked just like the scammer. But at least you've been informed whether you like it or not. Plus it protects newer players I guess. But I know they gotta learn too, one way or another.

I enjoy cramping a scammer bit especially then non botting ones. They're actually there to see you throw salt in their game..
Bad Bobby
Bring Me Sunshine
In Tea We Trust
#31 - 2011-09-27 07:22:43 UTC
Scamming? In my EVE?
CCP Spitfire
C C P
C C P Alliance
#32 - 2011-09-27 07:25:25 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Spitfire
Have to admit I've never fallen for a straight scam (I did lose some money in various investment schemes here and there, but it was a calculated risk, or so I was telling myself at the time).

Speaking of mistakes and not paying attention, I remember a corpmate buying a Badger off the market for 700 million ISK during a hectic redeployment... using the corporation wallet of course. Let's just say we were not happy with him. Pirate

CCP Spitfire | Marketing & Sales Team @ccp_spitfire

Sarmatiko
#33 - 2011-09-27 08:22:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Sarmatiko
In the first hours of Quafe Zero giveavay I was scammed for 12mil when accepted 5x Quafe Ultra bottles contract (they look same as Zero).
But after that I made around 400 mil scamming other players in the next few hours until got bored Bear
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2011-09-27 11:00:41 UTC

Let me add a scam i've read about.

As some of you may or may not know, even if you can't rig a ship yourself,
you can still fly it with the benefits (and penalties) it gives.

For this to happen, you have to give your ship to somebody else to rig it ...
... and he should give you the ship back.

Basically, it works like ...

Victim: "Hi, i just want to inform you that ******** is a scammer."
Victim: "I gave her my ship to rig it for me, but she didn't give it back."


I laughed so hard about this ...
... don't make the same mistake. :)
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#35 - 2011-09-27 11:06:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Oh, there's another hint.

There was this bank called Phaser Inc. and they promised 5% interest per week.

If you ever, ever see something like this ...

You CAN profit from it (as did quite a few, like me),
BUT THE GOLDEN RULE IS TO START AS SOON AS POSSIBLE !

Like ... when you hear about it and it's fresh, like a month old ... invest.
The sooner (context: runtime of the scam) you reach point of ROI, the better.

Scams of this order of magnitude will last at least a few months.
Like, the Phaser-scam lasted 8 months (i've given it a year ... close call ^^)
and i made 55 Mill Profit of it (seems not much, but hey ... i didn't lose anything... :)

So ... early adopters who know how to beat the scam usually profit,
while all the sheep who have no clue ... well. :)
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#36 - 2011-09-27 11:29:16 UTC
The most i ever lost in a scam was 900 thousand isk so no big deal really. The only time scams effect me now is when i go in to jita and people are just spamming local with their unimaginative scams that only idiots fall for. All it does is creates lag and frustrates people that are actually playing the game.
hmskrecik
TransMine Group
Gluten Free Cartel
#37 - 2011-09-27 12:30:22 UTC
Marc W2048 wrote:
hmskrecik wrote:
Marc W2048 wrote:
Just like in the real world if you don't pay attention, it's your loss. File a petition in Eve for your own lack of attention and get a nice reply from a Dev saying sorry. What they should say is, " You were an idiot, not our problem."


Well... Unlike in EVE, if you scam in real world you are hunted down and if you're lucky enough that police find you before lynching mob does you are sent to the federal pound-me-in-the-ass prison. Show me actual society or non-cult religion which endorses scamming everyone around.



I am more than aware that society in general does not condone scamming and that it is illegal. However we allow idiots to dump coffee on thier laps and sue people for thier own stupidity. At least in Eve you just take your scalded balls and go sit in the station and cry. I personally feel that in the real world we protect the stupid masses too damn much and I for one enjoy the lack of protection in Eve. Oh and I have had corp mates and in game friends that fall prey to a scam that do your "lynching mob" concept and get even with the person that did the scam, so you can exact revenge in Eve.


I might be a bit idealistic but I'm not an idiot (or so I think of myself). There's no way you can shield people from their own stupidity.

What I wanted to point is that IRL most of the scamming activities are plainly illegal, even if badly enforced. In EVE maybe there is not a "thou shall scam" commandment but still it is very welcome by devs ("hey, it's a part of the game") and so there are given some nice tools towards it (say, this market order skill), while normally such holes tend to be plugged. I can live with it, for me it's a part of the game too. I just protest against saying that EVE community emulates any real society. At least in this particular regard.

To stay slightly on topic, the closest to be scammed I was in my early days while still learning my ropes in NPC corp. There was one dude who contacted me that he needs a help with mission and proposed we do it together. The catch was that the mission was in the nearby lowsec system. By this time I knew already what it meant and replied that mom told me not to go to lowsec and that was the end of the story. In hindsight I think I should have gone thru. The loss of cheap frig and even of a pod would be modest price for having interesting experience.
malaire
#38 - 2011-09-27 12:55:12 UTC
hmskrecik wrote:
What I wanted to point is that IRL most of the scamming activities are plainly illegal, even if badly enforced. In EVE maybe there is not a "thou shall scam" commandment but still it is very welcome by devs ("hey, it's a part of the game") and so there are given some nice tools towards it (say, this market order skill), while normally such holes tend to be plugged. I can live with it, for me it's a part of the game too. I just protest against saying that EVE community emulates any real society. At least in this particular regard.

I don't think Margin Trading skill was specifically meant for scammers as you seem to suggest. It is really usefull for real traders also.

If I expect to buy certain item 10 units per day and I make buy order for 100 items, I don't really need ISK at hand to cover all 100 items. If I check my wallet daily, it is enough to make sure I can cover one day forward + some extra just in case.

Or if I am buying 30 different items, each of which sells maybe once per week, I only need enough ISK to cover what I expect to be able to buy in near future, before I get more ISK to cover rest.

And in these cases it's also not a problem for seller if I do happen to run out of ISK, since in real trading there allmost allways is another buy order from another trader.

New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else

hmskrecik
TransMine Group
Gluten Free Cartel
#39 - 2011-09-27 13:48:54 UTC
malaire wrote:
hmskrecik wrote:
What I wanted to point is that IRL most of the scamming activities are plainly illegal, even if badly enforced. In EVE maybe there is not a "thou shall scam" commandment but still it is very welcome by devs ("hey, it's a part of the game") and so there are given some nice tools towards it (say, this market order skill), while normally such holes tend to be plugged. I can live with it, for me it's a part of the game too. I just protest against saying that EVE community emulates any real society. At least in this particular regard.

I don't think Margin Trading skill was specifically meant for scammers as you seem to suggest. It is really usefull for real traders also.

If I expect to buy certain item 10 units per day and I make buy order for 100 items, I don't really need ISK at hand to cover all 100 items. If I check my wallet daily, it is enough to make sure I can cover one day forward + some extra just in case.

Or if I am buying 30 different items, each of which sells maybe once per week, I only need enough ISK to cover what I expect to be able to buy in near future, before I get more ISK to cover rest.

And in these cases it's also not a problem for seller if I do happen to run out of ISK, since in real trading there allmost allways is another buy order from another trader.


Allright, I went here a bit too far. I didn't want to suggest that this particular skill was introduced in order to facilitate scams. But what I want to say is that the skill probably will stay despite being such nice tool for shaving suckers.

Look, when there is certain rule and it happens that this rule is abused in a way that breaks the game, the rule is changed. Like it happened with nano nerf. And so IRL scamming tends to break "the game" in the long run, that's why there are measures being put to prevent it. In EVE scamming doesn't break the game, not in big picture and not in the long run as it seems, and that's one of differences between EVE and RL and that's why I don't expect it to be fixed in any meaningful way.

The Margin Trading is just an example. I have no personal grudge against this skill.
Alejan Gerakh
Scourge Wolf Syndicate
#40 - 2011-09-27 14:50:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Alejan Gerakh
Funny thing about my experiences in EVE: I've never fallen prey to scams, mostly because they're generally obvious enough, to me at least, that I think nobody could ever fall for such a fail-scam.

I'm probably not one to fall for any ever, since I generally prefer to put effort into my progress, even if it's the generally-considered mind-numbing experiences of mining or missioning. It's just busy work- often relaxing after a day at real work which pays for my hobby.

So, ultimately, I guess I think, "Oh, hey, you're supposedly giving away money. Whatever. I'll keep doing things the way I know will work. You keep trying to trick people into paying you money for such a transparent ruse."

EDIT: One last thing, though, is the 'never trust anyone in EVE' ... In my case, I came into this game with a group of friends who are still in it, and we have been relying on eachother as a Corporation for the past three years. Speaking of that, you can sometimes trust those you fly with in a Corporation or Alliance. Just *shock* get to know them! Wow, you've never had to do that in another MMO, really, right? Game mechanics don't force you to socialize in other games. In this, if you don't actually socialize with people, get to trust them like you would people in real life, then you aren't probably going to get much of anywhere of importance. At the very least, have real-life friends join you in-game. Maybe if one of your group is a good judge of character (our leader's generally pretty good with it), they can lead things or interview people to join you, and make your circle of friends and confidants larger. Expand a strong, tight-knit Corporation. Become a force to be reckoned with. You won't have any reason to look at questionable deals that may be scams, then.

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