Player Features and Ideas Discussion

I am a victim of PvP combat in a game of economy.

Why must I PvP in a game where anyone would focus their training on desired skills for efficiency?
As a trader, hauler, miner, or PvE'r I am not granted the skills, real life experience, or desire to fight a corp of PvP fighters looking for easy kills in "high security". I have to quit a corp to avoid losing ships to idiots. Missions are tougher when my targeting range and number of slots are cut by core stabilizers.


This is the type of reply I get from officials of EVE:

"The gameplay in EVE is not designed to grant an advantage to any particular player or playstyle. While a combat-focused character would have more means at their disposal for attacking others, they would still need industrialists to build that equipment they fit and use in their fights. If you are in a player-run corporation one of the aspects of the organization is that it can declare war and have war declared on it, while NPC corporations cannot be involved in wars."


I do not know of market restrictions that allow you to deny a sale to a certain corp that might be on a list. A list of corps that prey on those that are strictly industrialists. If not running missions, I would have to sell a product to a group that may end up declaring war on my own corp. Why can't industrialists put the PvP corps (those with wardecs that are not mutual) on a trade embargo? Those corps get to choose who they wardec, why must we sell to all parties? This is the future. They should be too busy to fight with a mining laser in their slot.


I also do not see a safe place for a player corp. I would like to see player corps join an NPC corp alliance, obviously while not at war. Most NPC alliances would include CONCORD's support. This may prevent pirates from visiting high security if they declare war on a NPC-allied corp. It would also limit station access in high security for those PvP'rs. I've heard of decshield. Its a loophole that requires post-wardec action.


ISK penalties or fees are a poor & unrealistic way to limit wardecs. Wardec prices would change for inflation if prices were the limiting factor. Some new corps with little ISK may have a valid reason to wardec a non-NPC-allied corp. Some very strong players in a corp of small numbers should be wardec'd by a larger corp to make it equal. Player count does not determine equality.


You will tell me to join an NPC corp. I made friends and they are in a player corp. There are more corps in the sea that like PvP. Go find one.

You WILL complain about my casual attitude to this game. I don't see why I can't have all the benifits of a player corp and make my own decision on when I play PvP. Is this game really that prejudice against casual players? Is CCP going to let PvP'rs run me off of CCPs subscription?



Summary - What EVE is missing:

• The skills, real life experience, or desire to fight players.
• Blacklists for sales - any entity should be able to create a blacklist for denying sales to certain corps/players. It could be a corp requirement for members. Lists could be publicized and gain popularity. Corps on the list could be categorized as repeat offenders and their listing never expiring. Spamcop does something similar with email.
• Player corps joining faction alliances - Primarily the main 4 factions but maybe more. They may have multiple NPC corps in the alliance, like CONCORD.

If you don't like this maybe you will be able to join a whitelist for PvP. Then you know who to wardec.

While I do understand your viewpoint, everyone in Eve is entitled to play the way they want to. This includes both industrialists like yourself and "PvP"ers like you describe. They are just as entitled to attack you as you are to not be attacked and finding a proper balance between the two is very tricky.

I completely agree that the current wardec system strongly favors the aggressors, and I don't think the proposed new system fixes it, but I believe that it will be extremely hard to find the perfect balance in the system (and I think that the perfect balance will leave everyone mildly unhappy, but no one raging about it).

By definition any conflict like this, where two groups of players have directly conflicting things that they want to do in the game, will be extremely tricky to resolve in a way that everyone can live with.

Edit: and to the original suggestion, I don't think that denying them your market orders would actually hurt them any, there's just so much stuff out there they could buy.

Proposing a way to limit or edge out competition in nullsec owned stations is an interesting idea, knowing who is selling and their allegiances before you give them isk is a good thing, in npc 0.0 denying your enemies materiel would also mean they have to rely on their own logistics more, meaning more cynos, more jf and more industrials. but only if you chose not to sell to current reds.

it does annoy me when i have enemies play market wars in sov 0.0 when i put up cheap ammo before a cta for my corp/alliance and a red buys it and relists it at 300%
sure i could do it through corp hanger, but i cant track whos buying for cta and whos just taking it for whenever.

in hisec, its a much harder issue as npc alts do a lot of the buying, but to a certain extent, marking off friends and enemies for buying rights would mean that industralist groups would get courted slightly more by pvp intensive corps.as they would need someone to supply them. (who likes them)

If i could make my market orders unbuyable to my enemies my corp/alliance would be better equipped as reds wouldnt buy my stuff and relist it. there is no reason why i shouldnt have a good tracker for my internal corp sales, and no reason why i should have to supply my enemies.

Gotta admit I do like the idea behind blacklisting, this said the simple fact there are no systems in-place to prevent mark-up trading instead of inch trading is beyond me. This said the market while predictable is massive waves, is still a very runaway beast as the majority of players just want to be greedy with no system in-place to prevent hyper-inflation/deflation.

Mind this isn't an economic feature request so much, so all I'll say is... tough if a corp wants to wardec you, they will. I'll admit I do have a bit more respect for suicide gankers than those who are using the systems in-place to legitimately grief others, which in a way is a shame - but unfortunately it seems to be CCPs dream to destroy their own economy by giving more and more power to players who don't understand that killing more industrialists = market prices rise = PvP becomes more expensive = less people willing to risk it.

Funny that CCP can't see or understand this very simple fact.

It is surprising to read that lead game designer Kristoffer Touborg says "EVE Online is a big social game." He talks about players enjoying boring gameplay like mining an hauling.

Why must I be victim to variable pricing and contract scams in a game where I just want to shoot stuff? Market PVP should be abolished.

Also, if you're having to fit stabs to avoid getting jumped in a deadspace, you really need to learn some basics of survival in Eve.


It wouldn't work. We'd just use NPC corp alts to buy stuff and then transfer it to our main characters.


That is by design. Player corps aren't supposed to have safe places.


No, I'm going to tell you that if you CHOOSE to be in a player corp, you must accept the risk that comes with it. Don't come in here trying to change our game.


This isn't the MMO for you.

More for the OP:

To reiterate: everything in Eve is competitive. If you sell stuff, you compete with others. If you mine, there are other miners who can mine the ore right out from under you, wasting your mining cycles. If you run incursions, you have to deal with people contesting your sites. If you do exploration, you'll encounter other explorers after the same loot as you and end up in a race to hit the accel gate first or destroy the faction spawn to get the drop. Eve is NOTHING but PVP. You're trying to opt out of one part of it because *gasp* you can't be bothered to learn how to defend yourself from it.

And yet, you want to:
As I already said, blacklists would utterly fail to do what you want because people like me can get around them. I will say this, though: if you get your wish and get blacklist functionality, it should be ON YOU to maintain your own list. You can reference websites for lists of known griefers or whatever you want to do, but allowing you to simply subscribe to an automatically updating blacklist service would be like me being able to subscribe to a list of corps that won't defend themselves, and automatically wardeccing each of them.

And besides all that, you're asking both to be able to prevent any attempts at combat PVP against you, yet gain new abilities of engaging in market PVP against the people who have just been told they can no longer engage you. Seriously man, this is...(I have a lot of adjectives I can say here, and all of them are insulting. I simply have no kind words with which to respond to this hypocrisy. So, I'll opt to let you fill in the blank.)


Concord is expressly neutral. It exists as an impartial enforcer of the law across all four empires. They CANNOT be a part of any other alliance, period. Asking that Concord be a party to a war you fight demonstrates just how much you don't get this game.

Alliances have always been for player corps. What would NPC alliances do for you? They don't hold sovereignty, they wouldn't be able to set up a POS, they'd just be a larger version of an NPC corp to which you would pay taxes. At this point I'm sincerely hoping you're trolling (it would be a great one) but I fear that you're serious with this.

PvP is a part of this game that is right in the description of the game when you sign up.

I'm sorry if you didn't do any research before investing a large amount of time in this game, but PvP is the only reason why you farm your space rocks and build ships. If you try to limit the amount of PvP in the game, then you are directly effecting the time you spend in this game and making it less valuable from a ISK/h standpoint.

Sorry, get used to it. Just be happy you're being wardec'd and not suicide ganked, at least you have the ability to fight back (but it seems you've already given up).