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Being a former hi-sec warmonger for a few years myself I got the best out of the current system engaging corporations and alliances outnumbering ourselves in numbers, but not in skils and assets. It was a blast and until people started training their falcon alts into logistic alts it was a good time...

Buying and a ship or their gains from PVP on the market isn't market pvp. It's the raw material for market PVP. It isn't .01 wars on price. It isn't going out and contracting ore from small corps. It isn't shipping large bulk orders to out of the way locations to open up new markets and feeding the combat player. It isn't anything that is actual market PvP. Combat PVP are the people we sell to, but it isn't the people we're competing against. Combat PVP players are simply the people who feed market PVP players money to keep score of who's winning and losing.

Hey guys, thanks for good comments, I'll try to answer a few of your questions here. I'm paraphrasing many of the questions.


Q: Tiny entities deccing large entities?
A: The fact this makes this harder is a conscious decision. We don't want to ban this activity of course, but see no reason to support it.

I'll be continue monitoring this thread and will try to answer further questions.

The game was about 1 year old and most of the members in the attacker corp (who claimed to be hired) where a more then 2 month old. That bittervet talk was correct. A million ISK was a lot of money back then. There where pretty much no T2 mods or ships there (IIRC interceptors where about to get released). Back then folk avoided to fly BS if they could because it required corp mining ops to get a member into a new BS. That's what the talk about fighting in frigs is about. Working together to get members into ships was quite common. Not doing so didn't pay out well when a war hit.

The differences between noobs and one year old players was much lower because nobody tanked their ships and remote repping simply didn't happen. Two frigs could take any BS down, no loltanks back then. Station games didn't work either.

ok CCP likes sweeping change, heres 1 ... PLEASE COMMENT :

lets change the war dec name to ... CORP wars (borrowed from faction wars)

and we also change the dec-ing format from affecting entire alliances to ONLY affect at corp wide level.

acronym CC = concord

the war system (or CC bribery spree) becomes fixed price 100m, 24hr CD to start of conflict, and will only last a fixed 5 days without a ending 24hr CD.

a corp can only express to attack 1 war target corp per 50 corp members (ie if you have 101 pilots in your corp, you can goto war with 3 target corps) up to a max of 10 wars (much like a research slot). big alliances can launch multiple strategic wars and will have to be more brainy about it. a corp expressing war as an attacker will no longer be able to use recruitment/expel-member option as per normal (individuals with combat involvement in war will not be able to leave corp via being marked IN-WAR after being involved in any conflict, individuals who have not participated in the attacking war can leave corp by paying 20m ISK to CC during the 6 days)

there will also be a POST WAR CD of 30days in place, so that after completing 1 war expression, that particular CORP war expression ability slot will be on CD of 30days.

so if a attacker corp has 250 pilots that can do 5 simulataneous war fronts uses up all 5 at 5 different war target corps and ends all 5 wars on the same day. the attacker corp will have to wait 30days for all 5 warring expression ability to CD. so it is therefore possible to rotate such warring expression ability to constantly put a target corp at war.

a TARGETTED corp of expressed WAR will not be CC mailed about who is going to attack them, they will have to BRIBE CC 10m ISK to tell them who is the attacker. CC will only inform of impending WAR that will start at bla bla bla date/time.

a ATTACKING corp after BRIBING for WAR expression on target corp will be able to access CC npc agent for free locator services once per day per pilot only on TARGET corp pilots.

an attacker corp cant recruit/expel pilot at anytime of war expressed (individuals may choose to leave if they have not fought). TARGETTED corp pilots can leave war at anytime by paying CC fee 10m ISK and can recruit pilots in at 10m ISK per head. these incoming/outgoing pilots will have to go thru a 24hr CD to shed / take on the WARing status.

a TARGETTED corp cannot reject a WAR, however he can further BRIBE CC to shorten the WAR. pay 40m isk to CC and reduce in WAR time by 48hrs, 80m to reduce by 4 days. in the event of TARGETTED corp war shortening BRIBEs, the time bought over by TARGGETED corp during a WAR becomes unusable for ATTACKER to re-express a new WAR until the time bought by them is expired. attacker cannot end war, once a war starts it will run 6 days for the attacker in full.

a TARGETTED corp can disband CORP to ultimately end ALL EXPRESSED WARS on them. the maximum number of WARS a corp can recieve is 5. ALL disbanded corp members will be marked unable to join other corp/establish new corp for 60days.

a TARGETED CORP whose CEO having a CC sec Status of 5+ and having less than 10 pilots in corp have automatic CC WAR protection scheme. CEO of such CORP will only need to pay 20% of fee to shorten WAR times.

ATTACKING corp can add WAR allies to selected WAR expressions by paying CC an extra 50m isk at time of EXPRESSING WAR on the TARGET. attacker corp cannot add/change number of ally attacker corp DURING a WAR. ally attacker corps are subject to same pilot movement restrictions into/out of corp

TARGETTED corp can add WAR allies to selected WAR expressions by paying CC an extra 50m isk after establishing attacker id of expressed WAR. ally targetted corp pilots are subject to same pilot movement restrictions/schemes/war-time-line as the master corp at war.

CCP will need to make a seperate WAR panel to show WAR in progress time line and openslots avail for new WAR. each WAR slot may or may not display parties involved etc .. .depending on how the GUI programmer think it shud be. but if u ask me, i like 1 panel = 100% info, pls dun ask us to flip pages ... i dun mind scrolls up/down like a web page, every one in game can deal with panels that look like web page.

and yes, if any at war pilot wish to recieve AID from a NEUT pilot, he will have to PAY CC 10m isk. the aiding pilot will then be in the usual aggression CD 15minutes. after 15 minutes is up , if he initiates a new aid, he will need to pay CC 10m isk again. aided pilot will need to click "YES, recieve aid"

n re mutual war, if u want it ... both of u jus go losec n bash it up ... skip the clicking n isk payment process ...

everyone please comment, ESP DEVs/GM ...

TYVM for reading

I haven't had time to give it a good read over. However, i believe Inferno is too close for CCP to rework this completely. I have a feeling if it isn't going in as stated in the dev blog, then nothing is going to change at all.

Proposing massive overhauls at this stage I don't think is realistic. Though maybe worth talking about in the future. I think right now people are trying to focus their efforts on ironing out details they see as highly problematic and also plausible to fix in the time frame given.

And this upsets me to no end. Instead of a robust system with checks and balances, we get a monolithic one size fits all simplified system. It's simplicity makes it easier to game, inbalanced towards many otherwise perfectly fine types of play, and rips other types of play out of the game in their entirety.

The current system is broken, I'll fully admit that. But this new system is just as broken. It doesn't fix the underlying problem with wardecs, and just randomizes who gets hosed this time around.

Swinging the pendulum to the other extreme is just as bad as the one it's currently in.

And this upsets me to no end. Instead of a robust system with checks and balances, we get a monolithic one size fits all simplified system. It's simplicity makes it easier to game, inbalanced towards many otherwise perfectly fine types of play, and rips other types of play out of the game in their entirety.

The current system is broken, I'll fully admit that. But this new system is just as broken. It doesn't fix the underlying problem with wardecs, and just randomizes who gets hosed this time around.

Swinging the pendulum to the other extreme is just as bad as the one it's currently in.

You have a contract or did you fail to read the Devblog correctly.

The MERC corps are being contracted for the entire War... that is the contract you are signing up for.. You wanna be a MERC be a MERC, You wanna only fight when you think you can win go join a 100Man russian blob fleet and leave your balls at the door..
Really when did mercs loose all balls. You as a MERC are being paid ISK to come rescue small corps/INDY corps. because they dont feel they can properrly defend themselves and dont want to hide inside of a station till the war is over. that is why the asked for help. And now you want to just think the idea of coming to their rescue and then running with your tails between your legs is a option. it is called research and CCP is doing 90% of the work for you. It is called the WAR progression tracker. If somebody asks you to help them you can read up on the Aggressor corp and see if you think you can defeat them.