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Request for clarification on harassment policy

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Keen Fallsword
Skyway Patrol
#101 - 2012-03-29 12:08:20 UTC
I think that all tests are not so smart. Ally leader is the best :) what was his name ? That drunk teenager from ally panel
Aethlyn
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#102 - 2012-03-29 12:08:49 UTC
Tobiaz wrote:
So if he'd had done it on Failheap or something, CCP wouldn't have cared? Or if by some chance would know someone player's homeadress and I would sent him a death-threat by post, CCP wouldn't care either?

They don't have to care what you do on some not related (owning wise) platform. They also can't confirm some entity posting on another platform is indeed that player (which wasn't the case for the stream; cause they knew who that guy talking there (using their channel) is).
Degren wrote:
I meant like uh...what's it called. "You lowsy Amarrian scum" or something equally lame

For me this would be perfectly fine, considering you're clearly addressing their character and not the person behind that avatar. In this case I'd say this is definitely role play. "You lowsy Amarrian playing scum" wouldn't be ok, as now it addresses the player, breaking from roleplay (i.e. it becomes ooc talk).

Looking for more thoughts? Follow me on Twitter.
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#103 - 2012-03-29 12:10:03 UTC
Keen Fallsword wrote:
I think that all tests are not so smart. Ally leader is the best :) what was his name ? That drunk teenager from ally panel

Yes Test has handed Michael Bolton III the keys to the alliance funhouse.....
Who's that Montolio guy I keep hearing about?
Prince Kobol
#104 - 2012-03-29 12:12:05 UTC
Tei Lin wrote:


I know you were being facetious but just to clarify, I think the correct course of action would be to report the suicidal statement to CCP (in case it's real) and continue playing the game as normal. A statement of RL bodily harm to yourself is as concerning to CCP as harassment to others.

I don't see players abusing this whole shtick though (regardless of the policy) unless CCP goes completely pants-on-head.


Shame Mittens didn't do this.

Instead he decided to mock and humiliate a person who talked about being suicidal in front of thousands of players at a official CCP Event, then you had a number of Goons and CFC Members come on the forums and claim it is fine to do this even after Mittens apologised, and then when the person who was at the centre of the attack posted on the forum, certain Goons and CFC members continued to attack and mock him.
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#105 - 2012-03-29 12:12:59 UTC
Aethlyn wrote:
Tobiaz wrote:
So if he'd had done it on Failheap or something, CCP wouldn't have cared? Or if by some chance would know someone player's homeadress and I would sent him a death-threat by post, CCP wouldn't care either?

They don't have to care what you do on some not related (owning wise) platform. They also can't confirm some entity posting on another platform is indeed that player (which wasn't the case for the stream; cause they knew who that guy talking there (using their channel) is).
Degren wrote:
I meant like uh...what's it called. "You lowsy Amarrian scum" or something equally lame

For me this would be perfectly fine, considering you're clearly addressing their character and not the person behind that avatar. In this case I'd say this is definitely role play. "You lowsy Amarrian playing scum" wouldn't be ok, as now it addresses the player, breaking from roleplay (i.e. it becomes ooc talk).

So wait if ANYONE else on that panel had made a similar/the same statement as Mittanni CCP couldn't ban them cause they would have no way to confirm that the person doing it was the character in game?
Degren
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#106 - 2012-03-29 12:15:02 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:
not paying attention to context


/facepalm

Hello, hello again.
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#107 - 2012-03-29 12:15:03 UTC
Prince Kobol wrote:


Shame Mittens didn't do this.


You can't know that. I seem to remember that discussing/posting petition communications is also bannable...
La Nariz
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#108 - 2012-03-29 12:19:25 UTC
GM Homonoia wrote:
DISCLAIMER: I will not comment in any way, shape or form on the recent events and decisions made in relation to those events. I will only clarify how customer support enforces our policies to provide clarity on the day to day application of those policies.

I am going to explain this only once; and this really should have been clear to anyone bothering to apply some common sense to the EULA/ToS.

What happens inside the The Magic Circle is allowed as long as it abides by the rules of The Magic Circle (this is why you are allowed to hit someone in a boxing match, but not outside the ring). However, as soon as any action steps outside The Magic Circle and threatens harm to anyone in real life in any way shape or form, or when you incite others to do so (or when your in game actions are specifically geared towards that, joke or no joke), you break the EULA/ToS; even if you are only stating intent.

Any GM will always take immediate action when this is done.

And for those who think they can force an in game situation out of The Magic Circle to avoid in game consequences by threatening with suicide; the GM department has a strict policy of informing local and international law enforcement agencies of any suicide threats issued NO MATTER THE CONTEXT. In other words, do NOT joke about that. When a RL life is threatened we do not take any risks, ever.


So does this mean you guys will actually start doing something about the people who give out death threats after being scammed?

This post was loving crafted by a member of the Official GoonWaffe recruitment team. Improve the forums, support this idea: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&find=unread&t=345133
Tei Lin
Bit Ninjas
#109 - 2012-03-29 12:19:28 UTC
Ohgod Townsend is shitting all over my thread. I guess it was a good run.

Thanks GM Homonia for answering rather pointed questions and alleviating any fears of policy changes while clarifying things.

I shall now let this devolve in to people making judgements about others based on their spaceship associations.
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#110 - 2012-03-29 12:21:08 UTC
Tei Lin wrote:
Ohgod Townsend is shitting all over my thread. I guess it was a good run.

Thanks GM Homonia for answering rather pointed questions and alleviating any fears of policy changes while clarifying things.

I shall now let this devolve in to people making judgements about others based on their spaceship associations.

Hey I'm not pooping on it THAT hard. I'm not even trying hard really.
Doddy
Excidium.
#111 - 2012-03-29 12:27:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Doddy
Townsend Harris wrote:

So wait if ANYONE else on that panel had made a similar/the same statement as Mittanni CCP couldn't ban them cause they would have no way to confirm that the person doing it was the character in game?


You are not very bright are you. CCP know MIttani said it cos it was on tv. All the other people on the panel are also on tv. Also proof of identity and account ownership is required to even stand for csm. If he had posted the equivelant on Kugu or goon forums they have no way to confirm that the person making the post is actually in any way related to the character "the mittani". In that case they could not act unless he fessed up.
Doddy
Excidium.
#112 - 2012-03-29 12:28:19 UTC
La Nariz wrote:


So does this mean you guys will actually start doing something about the people who give out death threats after being scammed?


This time 9000
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#113 - 2012-03-29 12:35:21 UTC
Doddy wrote:
Townsend Harris wrote:

So wait if ANYONE else on that panel had made a similar/the same statement as Mittanni CCP couldn't ban them cause they would have no way to confirm that the person doing it was the character in game?


You are not very bright are you. CCP know MIttani said it cos it was on tv. All the other people on the panel are also on tv. Also proof of identity and account ownership is required to even stand for csm. If he had posted the equivelant on Kugu or goon forums they have no way to confirm that the person making the post is actually in any way related to the character "the mittani". In that case they could not act unless he fessed up.

Please tell me how CCP could know that the guy claiming to be Kesper North from Gents was in fact the person who logged in as Kesper North?
CCP only knew that the Mitanni was the same person as the one speaking at the alliance panel because he was required to give them personal information to be on the CSM. Think about it for a second, if I want to REALLY meta game things up I could record a youtube video, claim to be, for example, Doddy, and urge players in eve to harass someone in game and say something along the lines of 'maybe he'll off himself'. Then I just shoot that video link around, post it on these forums every chance I get and etc.
Tei Lin
Bit Ninjas
#114 - 2012-03-29 12:39:40 UTC
Townsend Harris wrote:
Doddy wrote:
Townsend Harris wrote:

So wait if ANYONE else on that panel had made a similar/the same statement as Mittanni CCP couldn't ban them cause they would have no way to confirm that the person doing it was the character in game?


You are not very bright are you. CCP know MIttani said it cos it was on tv. All the other people on the panel are also on tv. Also proof of identity and account ownership is required to even stand for csm. If he had posted the equivelant on Kugu or goon forums they have no way to confirm that the person making the post is actually in any way related to the character "the mittani". In that case they could not act unless he fessed up.

Please tell me how CCP could know that the guy claiming to be Kesper North from Gents was in fact the person who logged in as Kesper North?
CCP only knew that the Mitanni was the same person as the one speaking at the alliance panel because he was required to give them personal information to be on the CSM. Think about it for a second, if I want to REALLY meta game things up I could record a youtube video, claim to be, for example, Doddy, and urge players in eve to harass someone in game and say something along the lines of 'maybe he'll off himself'. Then I just shoot that video link around, post it on these forums every chance I get and etc.


I'm PRETTY sure your reaching here. Fanfest attendees, especially panelists, would need to present some form of ID along the way.
flapie 2
Malevelon Roe Industries
Convocation of Empyreans
#115 - 2012-03-29 12:42:34 UTC
7 pages later, all i read was bla bla bla.

This whole post could have been avoided using common sence, i know its rare these days but really people should learn to use it, it makes things so much easyer.
Townsend Harris
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#116 - 2012-03-29 12:46:42 UTC
Tei Lin wrote:


I'm PRETTY sure your reaching here. Fanfest attendees, especially panelists, would need to present some form of ID along the way.

I'm pretty sure I am too actually, but its this line of in/out of game but it was a CCP sponsored event using CCP systems and they can confirm that the man is the character thats making the line fuzzy.
Even then though other than providing CC information (which you don't HAVE to provide if your account uses PLEX I think) most people who play aren't required to turn over personal information to CCP.
Also keep in mind that it was the Mittanni (the in game character) who was punished by the ban, not the real life person who logs in as the Mittani.
Unless CCP is passing out secret pass phrases (the Narwhal Bacons at Midnight??) to panel attendees then there's no way to know if the actual dude speaking is the toon in the game.
Just like there would be no way to know if the person in a youtube video is in fact the toon they claim to be.
Tei Lin
Bit Ninjas
#117 - 2012-03-29 12:47:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Tei Lin
flapie 2 wrote:
7 pages later, all i read was bla bla bla.

This whole post could have been avoided using common sence, i know its rare these days but really people should learn to use it, it makes things so much easyer.


Hi. Get back to me next time people are clamoring for you to get banned because you did something deemed ~evil~.

Also, telling people to use common "sence" normally goes over better when you use an iota of care in presenting your statements. Such as not misspelling the word "sense" in "common sense".
flapie 2
Malevelon Roe Industries
Convocation of Empyreans
#118 - 2012-03-29 12:56:26 UTC  |  Edited by: flapie 2
Tei Lin wrote:
flapie 2 wrote:
7 pages later, all i read was bla bla bla.

This whole post could have been avoided using common sence, i know its rare these days but really people should learn to use it, it makes things so much easyer.


Hi. Get back to me next time people are clamoring for you to get banned because you did something deemed ~evil~.

Also, telling people to use common "sence" normally goes over better when you use an iota of care in presenting your statements. Such as not misspelling the word "sense" in "common sense".



Sorry making good statements and grammatically correct posts just isn't always my thing, it does not how ever take away the truth hidden in side my statement.

Besides English isn't my native, so i have a valid excuse for making those "typo's" :P
Alexandra Alt
Doomheim
#119 - 2012-03-29 12:56:29 UTC
The amount of people still subverting things and manipulating text and/or statements to their point of view is astonishing.

People still discussing simple common sense is really troublesome, the person at fault already admitted publicly and privately that what he did has no excuse, and it's true, in my ethical and moral principles what he did, given the context, and context is what matters here the most, place, position, posture, audience, etc, still die hard fanatics (yes because fanatics are not only connoted to religion or beliefs) attempt to manipulate all they can to change the horrible act of a man.

Well guess what, the only way for you to change that is to make a time machine and change the past, and above all, if you do not have enough common sense to be able to distinguish between right or wrong given the context (the context again, is what is the most important here) you have a serious psychological problem that should be looked upon.

In the end, he's the best figure of you all, he has gained all my utmost respect due to the way he handled all this, which is a lot better than any of you die hard fanatics unable to be objective and have a slight of common sense even still now after his state of the goonion last night.

I would say grow a pair, but this isn't really a case to grow a pair since it's not directly proportional to a brain, therefore grow a brain, man up and stop crying like those you like to make cry.
Alexandra Alt
Doomheim
#120 - 2012-03-29 12:59:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Alexandra Alt
Tei Lin wrote:
flapie 2 wrote:
7 pages later, all i read was bla bla bla.

This whole post could have been avoided using common sence, i know its rare these days but really people should learn to use it, it makes things so much easyer.


Hi. Get back to me next time people are clamoring for you to get banned because you did something deemed ~evil~.

Also, telling people to use common "sence" normally goes over better when you use an iota of care in presenting your statements. Such as not misspelling the word "sense" in "common sense".


Also normally goes over better when you do a counter argumentation over the subject at and, and not attacking the person over a completely unrelated subject trying to divert attention to the main point which is your lack of common sense clearly shown on your OP.