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Why am I paying over the odds?
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Blackavar Sul
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2012-01-01 08:42:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Blackavar Sul
During my beginnings with the game I have found myself trawling the market a few times, mostly innefectively and usually in response to various disasters. Anyway each time I have bought anything I'm warned ahead of purchase that I'm paying well over the average price, usually a couple of hundred percent over. I'm going for the cheapest in station or sometimes travelling elsewhere to buy cheaper but I'm still ending up with expensive items.

I was wondering if there are some basic dos and donts that I've been missing?

Also, is there a way of seeing the average price of an item within the main market screens? I'm getting to the purchase confirmation screen before getting that info. I guess I must be missing something basic somewhere.
Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#2 - 2012-01-01 08:53:10 UTC
Blackavar Sul wrote:
During my beginnings with the game I have found myself trawling the market a few times, mostly innefectively and usually in response to various disasters. Anyway each time I have bought anything I'm warned ahead of purchase that I'm paying well over the average price, usually a couple of hundred percent over. I'm going for the cheapest in station or sometimes travelling elsewhere to buy cheaper but I'm still ending up with expensive items.

I was wondering if there are some basic dos and donts that I've been missing?

Also, is there a way of seeing the average price of an item within the main market screens? I'm getting to the purchase confirmation screen before getting that info. I guess I must be missing something basic somewhere.


NEVER use the buy button in the market browsing view, ALWAYs use the "View Details" button to pick which order to buy from

The Drake is a Lie
malaire
#3 - 2012-01-01 11:59:05 UTC
Xercodo wrote:
NEVER use the buy button in the market browsing view, ALWAYs use the "View Details" button to pick which order to buy from

And when in Details-view, sort available offers by Jumps or Price (depending whether you want to buy cheap or near), then right click order you like and select "Buy This".

Advanced note: You might not actually buy from that exact order because of market mechanics, but you will pay the price shown on that order you selected, and bought item will be at that location. (If there is better priced order at that location you will actually buy from that one and not from the one you selected, but you don't usually need to know this.)

New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else
Estella September
Maniacal Miners INC
The Legends In The Game
#4 - 2012-01-02 02:21:12 UTC
Tip: don`t buy stuff in the tutorials stations if you can help it: those are usually way overpriced.
Tas Nok
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2012-01-02 05:33:12 UTC
welcome to market pvp

a few things to note:
Major trade hubs Jita, amarr, rens (pretty much everything in the game can be had here but its not always cheapest, but will be cheaper for hard to get items and more expensive for common ones) also the vast majority of contracts in HS come and go from Jita, (its eve's Mall, complete with annoying teenagers hanging around, filling local with garbage)

the advice you got above is correct never just use the buy button it will increase your costs horribly, there are also two tracks to the market, buyers and sellers, if you need something NOW you can buy from the sellers, or if you anticipate needing something you can place a buy order sometimes for millions less. The newbie systems are generally overpriced on everything you can or would think to use because folks have helpfully bought up and re-priced anything that was reasonable (8mil isk shuttles for instance)

and finally take a look (now and then) at the price history tab when looking at items you want, it will give you a better idea if the item you want is in the range it should be. It will also highlight items sold for 1 isk or 100mil in order to distort the market average.

You will almost always be better off going a few jumps to save a few million (esp early on), there are trade hubs all over eve, the three listed above are simply the best stocked, hek, dodixie, motsu, also come to mind, but are a bit more specialized to their regions.
NightCrawler 85
Phoibe Enterprises
#6 - 2012-01-02 05:37:13 UTC
Someone please correct me if im wrong here.

Whenever someone sells an item for way below the regular price,the average price will go down and you will get the message that you are paying 50% above the normal.

Many people just rightclick and sell whatever loot and other items they have,either because they cant be bothered with the hassle of actually outting them out for a decent price,or because they dont know that they can get a lot more ISK in other ways.

So even if you get the message that its so and so much over,its a very good chanse that the price is actually really fair and decent.

I would also advice you to go to trade hubs like Rens,Jita,Hek or similar when buying new ships and mods since they tend to have a better price.

Phoibe Enterprises

The Eve Reader -  Audio Recordings of Eve Chronicles
Blackavar Sul
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-01-02 10:34:48 UTC
Tas Nok wrote:


the advice you got above is correct never just use the buy button it will increase your costs horribly, there are also two tracks to the market, buyers and sellers, if you need something NOW you can buy from the sellers, or if you anticipate needing something you can place a buy order sometimes for millions less.


Cheers, but I am still confused by this. When I go to the market and browse for an item there is a details tab that shows sellers and buyers. I assume that buyers are people who have put out an order for that item? I don't know how that works yet so I'll ignore that for now. The sellers at the top window are I assume those with the item for sale at different set prices. I can sort them by price or by distance and choose whether it's worth travelling for a better deal. There is also a groups tab (group in what context?) That page gives me some details about the item and shows the lowest price in that station with a buy button. Is that what you mean by not using the buy button - in that the lowest price in that station may well be an expensive option when compared to travelling further for a better deal?

If I set a buy order am I basically advertising that I want to purchase one? and if so how does the transaction take place?

Thanks guys.
Pak Narhoo
Splinter Foundation
#8 - 2012-01-02 15:09:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Pak Narhoo
Blackavar Sul wrote:
Tas Nok wrote:


the advice you got above is correct never just use the buy button it will increase your costs horribly, there are also two tracks to the market, buyers and sellers, if you need something NOW you can buy from the sellers, or if you anticipate needing something you can place a buy order sometimes for millions less.


Cheers, but I am still confused by this. When I go to the market and browse for an item there is a details tab that shows sellers and buyers. I assume that buyers are people who have put out an order for that item? I don't know how that works yet so I'll ignore that for now. The sellers at the top window are I assume those with the item for sale at different set prices. I can sort them by price or by distance and choose whether it's worth travelling for a better deal. There is also a groups tab (group in what context?) That page gives me some details about the item and shows the lowest price in that station with a buy button. Is that what you mean by not using the buy button - in that the lowest price in that station may well be an expensive option when compared to travelling further for a better deal?

If I set a buy order am I basically advertising that I want to purchase one? and if so how does the transaction take place?

Thanks guys.


Lets see if I can make this a little bit easier. :3

Ok, the market data details tab, top sellers, bottom buyers. You got that right.

Say you want to buy Antimatter Charge S and have found it.
In the market details tab you see the cheapest price.
You right-click on that sell order and go to 'buy this' in the drop down menu and a new window pops-up.
Now you can buy that straight away after filling in the quantity you need and hit 'buy' in the pop-up window.

Or, if you think you can get it cheaper, you hit in the same pop-up window the 'advanced' button, bottom right.
Here you can set your own price at which you want to buy 'Antimatter Charge S', (you are now placing a buy order).

Here you can also set:
-the maximum amount you need and minimum amount people should start selling at you,
-the duration for your bid
-and range in which people can sell it to you. (depends on skills)

Once you have set up everything, and checked it many, many times you didn't misplaced a digit in your price or it includes systems where you can be shot on sight, you hit the 'buy' button and almost instantly (usually) your buy order will be displayed at the bottom of the buyers window.
People who see your buy order in green can then sell their goods directly to you.
Depending on your skills (like if you can place a regional wide buy order) it means that once people sold towards your buy order you have to go and pick it up.



The groups tab shows items per, group.:) Like laser beams, salvage materials, PI products, battleships, titans etc.
In the Antimatter Charge Small case it's in the group: Ammunition & Charges / Hybrid Charges / Standard Charges / Small /

And yes that is where you do not want to hit the buy button, because you then do not see what other price/ range/ quantity options you have more.



Before you start, make sure you have looked at the settings tab and filter options in the market window.
You may want to uncheck 'display orders in low security' and 'zero security systems'. It would be a waste if you buy stuff and you cannot get to it for one or the other reason, tough you can always try to contract the bought items out as a courier job.


Hope it helps a bit. Can be a bit overwhelming at first.
GL.
Tallianna Avenkarde
Pyre of Gods
#9 - 2012-01-02 16:31:27 UTC
Also of note that when working out the "regional price" the market takes into effect the price of buy orders. If there are a LOT of low value buy orders for the item you are buying, the sell price will APPEAR to be higher than the regional average, although it may be the cheapest sell order in region.

And a sudden plunge in the sullen swell. Ten fathoms deep on the road to hell.
Blackavar Sul
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2012-01-02 17:26:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Blackavar Sul
Thank you all for your helpful replies, I appreciate it. I think that makes much more sense now. It would be so much better if EVE had an interface that explained this to players, but I'm starting to realise that that is symptomatic of most of the game!
Cheers
Tas Nok
Hedion University
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2012-01-02 17:56:05 UTC
Blackavar Sul wrote:
Thank you all for your helpful replies, I appreciate it. I think that makes much more sense now. It would be so much better if EVE had an interface that explained this to players, but I'm starting to realise that that is symptomatic of most of the game!
Cheers


You sir have just gone a long way towards surviving in eve. half the game is explained badly, the other half not at all, and it really is a huge game, keep this in mind and you'll be fine.

(I think its CCP's subtle way of saying they don't want to suffer idiots and fools, but sadly it takes little knowledge to un-dock a rifter and shoot the first thing you see)
Blackavar Sul
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2012-01-02 19:35:34 UTC
Though that does mean that I'm spending more time in help forums than I am in game at the moment. I'll be honest with you - at the moment it's a bit 50/50 whether I decide to stick with it. Cry
malaire
#13 - 2012-01-02 19:41:33 UTC
Don't forget to read The Manual: http://www.isktheguide.com/
It's free and only a bit over 400 pages long.

New to EVE? Don't forget to read: The Manual * The Wiki * The Career Options * and everything else
My Neutral Toon
Doomheim
#14 - 2012-01-09 18:46:59 UTC
@ OP

It will help you to learn where the best trade hubs are near you, ie JITA, RENS, HEK, etc...

...Can't. Tell. If ...Troll? Or Serious....

Butt Hurt about Harrasment? Read first GM post: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=88362&find=unread
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#15 - 2012-01-12 13:07:25 UTC
Blackavar Sul wrote:
Thank you all for your helpful replies, I appreciate it. I think that makes much more sense now. It would be so much better if EVE had an interface that explained this to players, but I'm starting to realise that that is symptomatic of most of the game!
Cheers


Some of us who have been playing EVE for a long time have a deep dark suspicion that this is a deliberate design choice intended to stimulate player interaction. To play the game you have to talk to other players!

On the bright side, you don't have to know everything to play successfully. There are great swathes of the game I have very little detailed knowledge of and it doesn't bother me at all, because the aspects of the game that I do play I know well enough to thrive within. As and when I need or want to try a new aspect of the game, I can learn about it at my convenience.

PS see the link in my sig for a nice graphic showing all the major professions of EVE

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
My Neutral Toon
Doomheim
#16 - 2012-01-12 17:01:25 UTC
Blackavar Sul wrote:
Thank you all for your helpful replies, I appreciate it. I think that makes much more sense now. It would be so much better if EVE had an interface that explained this to players, but I'm starting to realise that that is symptomatic of most of the game!
Cheers



Have you tried the tutorial missions yet? I believe there may be one that has you interact with the market. On the left side of your screen, on the NeoCom, towards the bottom. You will see a picture of a woman that looks like the Female Leader of the Borgs. Click her picture. She will help you with almost everything.


If you elected to skip the tutorials when you started the game (it starts you in a tutorial), then you should go back and do them. Its much easier than hoping someone is good at explaining things on a forum.

...Can't. Tell. If ...Troll? Or Serious....

Butt Hurt about Harrasment? Read first GM post: https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=88362&find=unread
Kessiaan
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2012-01-13 03:00:48 UTC