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CCP, are you going to do anything about the Ghost Training exploit?

First post
Author
Keno Skir
#1 - 2017-06-11 15:34:27 UTC
Throughout all the carrier nerf stuff, one aspect has stung especially. I'm concerned about CCP's lack of action on this Ghost Training issue.

People assume now that using exploits is ok, because CCP are fine with people using this exploit. It is an exploit regardless if CCP have yet admitted it.

So, here's another GD thread CCP Pirate

Are you going to punish the people who used this exploit or not?

Serious question... it's a bit like some exploits are ok and some aren't.. huh CCP?

Lel Roll
Keno Skir
#2 - 2017-06-11 15:46:41 UTC
For context this is kind of a joke thread..

I am a bit serious tho, i'm just pretty sure an answer isn't forthcoming especially on GD.
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#3 - 2017-06-11 15:57:09 UTC
I follow the forums, twitter, reddit and only recently leaned of ghost training, probably ~1 month ago.

I'm assuming this will be like the time FW lp payouts were based on market cost of ship so someone did a 1% implant pump and blew up haulers full of worthless implants that were highly valued on the market and made a ton of isk. So it will take some time to check the logs and go after the people that heavily abused it. I feel like there is a ton of grey area for all the people that let their subs lapse for some period of time and unknowingly benefited, or even knowingly abused it for a short while.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Clockwork Robot
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#4 - 2017-06-11 16:05:01 UTC
I don't know about the ghost training exploit, but I'll bet they'll do something about this rule-breaking post.
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#5 - 2017-06-11 16:05:14 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
I follow the forums, twitter, reddit and only recently leaned of ghost training, probably ~1 month ago.

I'm assuming this will be like the time FW lp payouts were based on market cost of ship so someone did a 1% implant pump and blew up haulers full of worthless implants that were highly valued on the market and made a ton of isk. So it will take some time to check the logs and go after the people that heavily abused it. I feel like there is a ton of grey area for all the people that let their subs lapse for some period of time and unknowingly benefited, or even knowingly abused it for a short while.

1% of 1% carrier ratting - lets nerf carriers.
1% of 1% doing SP exploit - nah lets leave it...
why do I expect logic from CCP?

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville

Eternus8lux8lucis
Primus Inc.
LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM
#6 - 2017-06-11 16:14:07 UTC
Quote:
So Ghost training came back from the dead once again. Last time this, and ghost RP collecting, ghost manufacturing and ghost R&D was around, ghost market orders are still a thing though and always have been, CCP never punished anyone just fixed their mistakes. In fact the only thing, other than EULA breaking mistakes, CCP has taken things away from players for was the FW farming where certain players made trillions of isk in a few days or weeks. Again, something CCP overlooked, and left open to players to exploit and abuse.

In fact CCP has many times actually commended us for being very ingenuitive in how we break features or things in unexpected ways, and some are even considered "emergent gameplay" when they occur from such coding or unforseen balancing issues. I think even Falcon has said as much before iirc.

So for all of you crying foul. You really need to read up on a few things in Eves past before you do.


That being said. It was good to go back to the old days for a while again, had to end sometime.BlinkTwisted


https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=6968735#post6968735

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.

Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#7 - 2017-06-11 17:17:59 UTC
I think it's unlikely CCP will talk about it. They'll simply fix it and people with omega skills in their queue will simply stop training when their omega time expires. You'll learn that it's fixed when people using the exploit start crying about it.

I gather it's very difficult to prove intent so making it a bannable offence is problematic. Best to simply fix it quietly.
Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#8 - 2017-06-11 17:46:17 UTC
Do Little wrote:
I think it's unlikely CCP will talk about it. They'll simply fix it and people with omega skills in their queue will simply stop training when their omega time expires. You'll learn that it's fixed when people using the exploit start crying about it.

I gather it's very difficult to prove intent so making it a bannable offence is problematic. Best to simply fix it quietly.


Yeah thats one thing I think a lot of the 'ban them all and take their money' crowd havent considered, that it is most likely extremely difficult to tell the difference between someone using ghost training and someone doing normal unsub/resub activities when you only have logs to go off. And if there isnt a way to reliably spot it then you cant just ban the people who said they used it, Globby being a good example here, because then you open yourself up to accusations of unfairness.

its better to just fix the issue and move on.

Pirates - The Invisible Fist of Darwin

you're welcome

Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#9 - 2017-06-11 18:14:36 UTC
Darek Castigatus wrote:
Yeah thats one thing I think a lot of the 'ban them all and take their money' crowd havent considered, that it is most likely extremely difficult to tell the difference between someone using ghost training and someone doing normal unsub/resub activities when you only have logs to go off. And if there isnt a way to reliably spot it then you cant just ban the people who said they used it, Globby being a good example here, because then you open yourself up to accusations of unfairness.

its better to just fix the issue and move on.

sure it will be hard to see on small scales, but the people with massive skill farms should be far easier to spot. Talking 100s of billions to trillions of isk.

@ChainsawPlankto on twitter

Max Deveron
Deveron Shipyards and Technology
#10 - 2017-06-11 18:28:54 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
Darek Castigatus wrote:
Yeah thats one thing I think a lot of the 'ban them all and take their money' crowd havent considered, that it is most likely extremely difficult to tell the difference between someone using ghost training and someone doing normal unsub/resub activities when you only have logs to go off. And if there isnt a way to reliably spot it then you cant just ban the people who said they used it, Globby being a good example here, because then you open yourself up to accusations of unfairness.

its better to just fix the issue and move on.

sure it will be hard to see on small scales, but the people with massive skill farms should be far easier to spot. Talking 100s of billions to trillions of isk.



even then if i was in charge of CCP, i would fix it quietly.....and if i was going to do something....just remove the isk from their wallets, or every time they made an injector make it dissappear if they already cashed in on this in that way until the theft of goods was recovered.

I mean dont ban them...just make them feel naughty for being naughty.....oh and and send them an email informing of their punishement(s), include they cant repost it or part of without incurring a ban for doing so.

Keno Skir
#11 - 2017-06-11 19:31:54 UTC
Chainsaw Plankton wrote:
I follow the forums, twitter, reddit and only recently leaned of ghost training, probably ~1 month ago.

I'm assuming this will be like the time FW lp payouts were based on market cost of ship so someone did a 1% implant pump and blew up haulers full of worthless implants that were highly valued on the market and made a ton of isk. So it will take some time to check the logs and go after the people that heavily abused it. I feel like there is a ton of grey area for all the people that let their subs lapse for some period of time and unknowingly benefited, or even knowingly abused it for a short while.

Reddit's been thick with threads about it for months. Yeah would be too hard to ban everyone, was really just thinking about obvious "10+ new accts all in cycle" deals. I mean ban or no ban either way, i'm merely interested is all.

Clockwork Robot wrote:
I don't know about the ghost training exploit, but I'll bet they'll do something about this rule-breaking post.

And yet Pirate

Darek Castigatus wrote:
Do Little wrote:
Yeah thats one thing I think a lot of the 'ban them all and take their money' crowd havent considered, that it is most likely extremely difficult to tell the difference between someone using ghost training and someone doing normal unsub/resub activities when you only have logs to go off. And if there isnt a way to reliably spot it then you cant just ban the people who said they used it, Globby being a good example here, because then you open yourself up to accusations of unfairness.

its better to just fix the issue and move on.

Yeah that's a fair point tbh. Guess IP matching is going a bit far over space bucks but they could just track the transfer of ISK for the larger entities.

[quote=Eternus8lux8lucis]So for all of you crying foul.

I wasn't crying foul, emergant gameplay is fine. I'm really just morbidly curious about what's going on behind the scenes.

Either way cheers for the input, maybe i'm salty about all the free cash but i realise where i am Cool
ISD Max Trix
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
#12 - 2017-06-11 20:00:31 UTC
Quote:
16. Posting about bugs and exploits is prohibited.

Bugs and exploits should be reported through the proper channels. Bugs should be brought to the attention of CCP by filing a bug report for our Quality Assurance department. More information on filing bug reports can be found here. Discussions about unverified issues in game can cause unnecessary panic in the community. When there is an issue that the EVE Online community needs to be aware of, it will be communicated via an official statement from CCP after thorough investigation.


If you read the Skill point issue thread. CCP is aware and they have already begun or completed the necessary patches to end this practice.

ISD Max Trix

Lieutenant

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

I do not respond to EVE mails about forum moderation.