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EC vulnerability

Author
Valentine King
Lone Wolf Union
#1 - 2017-01-16 10:15:53 UTC
Greetings!

OK - so I have researched this, but just want some confirmation from anyone who is more knowledgeable than myself (not difficult, really) and can give an answer without being degrading, cocky or rude......

Big smile

Our EC was attacked. Goody ho.....

First reinforced mode was reached when shield went down. Second was reached 24 hours later as Armor went down. We are now in a 6 day reinforced period.

As I understand it, no remote repairs can be undertaken to Armor or shields. So, in 6 days, peeps will be back to finish the job - or at least try to............

My question is, IF the hull of the structure can be saved through a large defensive fleet during the final vulnerable timer, can repairs then be conducted? Or does the structure re-initialise repairs itself and if so, will this ONLY be to any hull damage, as long as hull damage is not below any threshold, and not continue across to Armor and shields?

Basically, can the structure be saved, or is it that under CCP's structure mechanics, once shield and armor are lost, the structure is effectively a 'sitting duck' in space waiting for impending doom?
Valentine King
Lone Wolf Union
#2 - 2017-01-16 10:23:38 UTC
And just as an afterthought, if a merc Alliance was to wipe out the Corp who is attacking the structure, for example (ha, ha, ha) and no-one attacked the structure again for some considerable time, what would actually happen to the shields and armor on the structure? Do they just sit there forever at 0%, or is there a point at which they start to repair?

Just interesting to know............
Kiddoomer
The Red Sequence
#3 - 2017-01-16 10:32:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Kiddoomer
I think this http://wiki.eveuniversity.org/Vulnerability_States would give you a lot of answers.

Basically, when the 6 days timer ends, the citadel is vulnerable for 15 min with timer freezing when taking damages, after which it will be invulnerable again and repair itself.

In the name of Jirai 'Fatal' Laitanen : “Some capsuleers claim that ECM is 'dishonorable' and 'unfair'. Jam those ones first, and kill them last.”

Fulbert
Industriels Independants SARL
#4 - 2017-01-16 11:20:30 UTC
tl;dr version

Shield takes damage :
15 minutes repair cycle engages, and is paused as long as the citadel receives damage > 10% of its damage cap
two solutions :
- insufficient DPS : repair cycle completes, the EC/citadel reaches 100% shield, no longer attackable until the next vulnerable hour slot in the planning
- enough DPS : shield falls to 0% -> reinforced for 24hr

After the EC/citadel leaves shield reinforcement : new repair cycle (15 minutes). same rules
- dps <10% damage cap : repair timer counts down,
- dps >10% damage cap : repair timer is frozen, the armor takes damage, then 0%, then armor reinforcement timer (6 days)

After the EC/citadel leaves armor reinforcement : new repair cycle (15 minutes). same rules
- dps <10% damage cap : repair timer counts down,
- dps >10% damage cap : repair timer is frozen, the hull takes damage, then 0%, KABOOM

(tl;dr)² :
- you cannot remote repair EC/citadels, they totally rely on their repair timer
- the only way to defend them is to destroy attackers, DPS dealers in particular : if their damage output falls below 10% of the damage cap, the structure will completely recover in 15 minutes
- one successful repair cycle = the structure returns at 100% shield and resumes its normal vulnerability planning
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#5 - 2017-01-16 18:23:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Valentine King wrote:
My question is, IF the hull of the structure can be saved through a large defensive fleet during the final vulnerable timer, can repairs then be conducted? Or does the structure re-initialise repairs itself and if so, will this ONLY be to any hull damage, as long as hull damage is not below any threshold, and not continue across to Armor and shields?

When the 15 minute repair timer expires, ALL damage is repaired (shield, armor, structure) .

Hence the idea is to prevent the timer from expiring by pausing it, which requires applying a minimum amount of DPS.

You cannot rep a citadel nor engineering complex.

I just hauled all my Basilisks to Jita this morning to sell.

EDIT: I think I'd risk a hisec smartbomb run with a couple of battleships on a group attacking. Might be effective enough if they can't quickly reship. Range might be an issue though.
Valentine King
Lone Wolf Union
#6 - 2017-01-20 18:04:48 UTC
Thanks for the replies. Learned a bit more about Citadels and ECs. And interesting Uni link - thanks for that Kiddoomer
Ocean Ormand
Bagel and Lox
#7 - 2017-01-24 18:11:39 UTC
Valentine King wrote:
Greetings!

OK - so I have researched this, but just want some confirmation from anyone who is more knowledgeable than myself (not difficult, really) and can give an answer without being degrading, cocky or rude......

Big smile

Our EC was attacked. Goody ho.....

First reinforced mode was reached when shield went down. Second was reached 24 hours later as Armor went down. We are now in a 6 day reinforced period.

As I understand it, no remote repairs can be undertaken to Armor or shields. So, in 6 days, peeps will be back to finish the job - or at least try to............

My question is, IF the hull of the structure can be saved through a large defensive fleet during the final vulnerable timer, can repairs then be conducted? Or does the structure re-initialise repairs itself and if so, will this ONLY be to any hull damage, as long as hull damage is not below any threshold, and not continue across to Armor and shields?

Basically, can the structure be saved, or is it that under CCP's structure mechanics, once shield and armor are lost, the structure is effectively a 'sitting duck' in space waiting for impending doom?


Once the structure is vulnerable there will be a 15 min window in which to attack. If that timer runs out the entire structure is repaired including armor and shield. The timer can be halted indefinitely by applying enough dps.
Rapscallion Jones
Omnibus Solutions
#8 - 2017-01-31 18:02:08 UTC
Griffons, Kitsunes, Falcons. If they can't lock they can't lock it they can't shoot it.
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#9 - 2017-01-31 23:25:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Rapscallion Jones wrote:
Griffons, Kitsunes, Falcons. If they can't lock they can't lock it they can't shoot it.

Problem is, for that strategy to be effective, you have to prevent all the DPS you cannot tank from locking you.

I'd probably go for Scorpions instead. They are cheap being T1, have better insurance, don't require level 5 ship skill, have long range, LOTS of mids, can tank more, and fit a MJD. They also have a unique burst bonus.
Ocean Ormand
Bagel and Lox
#10 - 2017-02-01 22:06:02 UTC
The best deterrence is that they dont drop much of anything and they are extremely common and cheap - combined that with the fixed vulnerability schedule and that you have to come back 3 times for at least a half hour each means that they just are not worth shooting.
Valentine King
Lone Wolf Union
#11 - 2017-02-05 09:52:26 UTC
Thanks for all the info - but we lost the EC

Hey - another day in the game of EvE!!

They hit us hard with Drones - and lots of them - whilst taking the structure down

Lessons learnt shared - be an active PvP player before starting/joining an Indy Corp/Alliance, especially if putting structures like EC in place, and either have a really big Corp/Alliance, or LOTS of friends! You will have to defend the structure at some point and a decent sized fleet, with experienced PvPers, will be needed........
Dracones
Tarsis Inc
#12 - 2017-02-05 18:32:34 UTC
Yeah, don't feel bad. The reality is that the attackers get to pick the target and that puts the defenders at a pretty big disadvantage. You're about a 100 man alliance, so a medium EC should be right up your alley, but you really don't have a chance vs even a smaller PvP corp who can just look at your killboard and see a soft target.

I'd say that your only real options are to either put a EC in the middle of nowhere and hope a PvP corp doesn't think driving by and popping it would be fun or a nice add to their killboard. Or to hire a merc corp that'll defend it for you.
Chris Noir
Noir Construction Solutions
The Belt of Iron
#13 - 2017-04-04 22:11:18 UTC
I am going through the same thing but I was wondering if the Vulnerable time's mean anything during a war? As I was attacked when there was 20 mins left on my vunerable timer and it continued for almost any hour after my vulnerable time had ended?

FYI I was wardecd by 1 guy because my Wife made me a joke BEST CEO award and now my Shields are down!
Shiloh Templeton
Cheyenne HET Co
#14 - 2017-04-04 23:58:21 UTC
Chris Noir wrote:
I was wondering if the Vulnerable time's mean anything during a war? As I was attacked when there was 20 mins left on my vunerable timer and it continued for almost any hour after my vulnerable time had ended!

Vulnerability window limits when an attack can begin - not how long it can last.