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CCP baiting us on a free can....Vehemently opposed to the Vehement

Author
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#1 - 2016-07-09 20:42:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Celeste Coeval
I have played this game since 2006, I have done nearly everything this game has to offer and yet I still see plenty left on the horizon to entertain myself. Lately...I feel like CCP is losing their way with regard to some of their in game developments and treating us like idiots.

I have spent an awful lot of my time in this game doing exploration content and have done since they launched the ability to probe out the old Radar/Ladar/Gravimetric/Magnetometric signatures. I enjoyed the difficulty of probing out specific sites and CCP have slowly made this particular side of the game more and more accessible to players, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it certainly has taken the punch out of it as a "profession" and it has now become more of a must have for all players. This is reflected in the price crash of nearly all deadspace and faction modules, again not necessarily a bad thing. I have nothing against increasing supply to meet demand. I can lament these changes and the death of exploration as a community and something to hold the interest of older players, but I am sure that this content is fun for newbros, even if, the for older lot, it's either a force of habit or just so familiar that it no longer feels like exploration. The channel Exploration is a shadow of it's former self, although I have to say people start gabbing in there when a new event comes out, which bring me to the main objective of this post, the Shadow of the Serpentis event (I will elaborate on more exploration content in another post).

CCP is taking advantage of it's community in ways that I feel are bordering on plain outrageous, which is ironic seeing as I have defended CCP many many times in their decisions before and supported their overall strategies for new features, not all of them but many of them. The site "Serpentis Shipyard and Research Facility" is a good case point on this issue. You warp in scramble amongst other players or solo for a "free bait can" on the undock of a Serpentis owned Fortizar. Seriously? You are baiting us on a free can?

So what's in the can? Chips to build Serp capitals, some implants whose price is inevitably falling fast as they are overseeded and some points for completing the site that contribute towards gaining one of the Bronze, Silver or Gold containers. This challenge is the only one that is persistent, meaning that it's always in your list of objectives to complete for the event, some folks have already gained the grand prize of the Vehement BPC and assorted other trivialities that are essentially worthless considering you could have made more isk and got more SP from working for a skill injector as others have already stated in other threads on these forums. All of this pushes me a little towards frustration as it just seems like tat to occupy players away from isk making activities and pushing players to buy PLEX to continue their need for new items or indeed subscriptions. The sites are boring, pathetic actually and yet on the o7 show we are addressed like kindergarten children with the marvels of what await us in this highly anticipated event, that engages and exploits those of an addictive or aspergers personality type. This "carrot on a stick" approach would be fine if the carrot at the end was worthwhile...so this bring me onto why I am actually pretty livid with CCP and before I proceed I will state, I stand nothing to gain from CCP bowing to my next line of thought, no isk benefits, no power or virtual status, I am just struggling to understand design decisions in a game I once regarded as tilting towards folks who enjoy spreadsheets in space and those who like to blow up what the spreadsheeters produce. So here goes.

The Vehement.

**** you CCP. The build costs of this thing make no sense to anyone even those with a fat in game wallet. Is this ship aimed at pilots who drop PLEX to buy capitals or what? Because it certainly isn't for the industrialists who have to build this over hyped piece of crap. In defense I have heard players say, "but pew pew", "it's great for anti-tackle", "it's just meant to be a shiny". Ok.... This isn't an aesthetic item, it's a functional one, yes it pew pew's, yes its great for anti tackle....but if you are tackled in this you can be sure supers are coming and you are about to be killmail whored, so it's just meant to be a shiny???? well then why not like every other shiny object in the game does it require 7.4 untanked freighters to ship the Capital Armor Plates? so let's look at the build materials shall we?


Moros

7 Capital Propulsion Engine
37 Capital Turret Hardpoint
6 Capital Sensor Cluster
24 Capital Armor Plates
7 Capital Capacitor Battery
13 Capital Power Generator
11 Capital Shield Emitter
9 Capital Jump Drive
6 Capital Computer System
13 Capital Construction Parts
28 Capital Siege Array
16 Capital Ship Maintenance Bay
8 Capital Corporate Hangar Bay
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#2 - 2016-07-09 20:42:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Celeste Coeval
Vehement


140 Capital Propulsion Engine
740 Capital Turret Hardpoint
120 Capital Sensor Cluster
480 Capital Armor Plates
140 Capital Capacitor Battery
260 Capital Power Generator
220 Capital Shield Emitter
180 Capital Jump Drive
120 Capital Computer System
260 Capital Construction Parts
560 Capital Siege Array
320 Capital Ship Maintenance Bay
160 Capital Corporate Hangar Bay



So people have been asking for new Capitals for years and in particular faction capitals and the best you can come up with is a Moros mesh with a new skin a couple of modified stats and putting a parts multiplier in of x20 on the parts? Are you serious? As someone who has spent time modifying values of items in games, like the Elderscrolls series I feel that you are taking the Michael out of the eve community? How much did this "project reward" cost you to make? 5 minutes on the stats and a day or two from the art department on the skin? Now you have 1000's of player duking it out in sites that require them to get deep vein thrombosis in order to achieve, to get a BPC that only an industrial alliance could take the time to build.

The argument could be made that this ship is a status symbol for those who has the isk to flash around to buy one, but my argument isn’t really focused on these people, it’s the builders of this ship. This ship is too much work for its retail value. But this isn’t even really the thing that annoys me most about it, it’s about the same ******* size as a Moros, with x20 parts of everything shouldn’t it occupy x20 the space, have x20 the HP, x20 the everything it has? Instead it’s just 20 times the work to build the stupid thing, this is cheap CCP and you know it, this ship will already be in excess in price of the Moros if it has the SAME BUILD COST, simply due to the rarity of the BPC, this feels like you are sucking the life out of the mineral producers for the sake of it, to absorb more player time towards objectives and keep people playing, when in fact you aren’t keeping them playing you are disenchanting them.

Simply from the point of view of someone who likes things that add up, I’ve overlooked, as has the player base, facts and figures that don’t make sense in eve, it’s part of the rights of passage of playing, some little quirks you just accept. This ship makes no physical sense whatsoever (IBT internet spaceships are more like submarines crowd). Is the factory that produces a Serpentis Faction Capital just ill equipped to produce these hulls, does 19 in every 20 parts get written off in the production cycle? If so why? What’s the point? Why make this thing hard to build considering the boring hell grind of collecting “free bait can” on Serpentis undocks or later the LP store?

CCP this is just plain lazy. Sort it out!
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#3 - 2016-07-09 20:50:29 UTC
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?
Evi Polevhia
Phoenix Naval Operations
Phoenix Naval Systems
#4 - 2016-07-09 20:57:28 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?


I'll try.

"Sites are boring. New caps are too expensive and too hard to make. It's only a reskin anyways with not enough improvements in stats to be worth the massive increase in build costs. Wah."
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#5 - 2016-07-09 21:01:21 UTC
Evi Polevhia wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?


I'll try.

"Sites are boring. New caps are too expensive and too hard to make. It's only a reskin anyways with not enough improvements in stats to be worth the massive increase in build costs. Wah."



You get a cookie.
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#6 - 2016-07-09 21:02:24 UTC
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?



New events, re-balances (dumbing-down) and new shinies are aimed at players who are more willing/likely to buy PLEX.



There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#7 - 2016-07-09 21:03:46 UTC  |  Edited by: ShahFluffers
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?

Something something...

... the Serpentis event is boring...

... something...

... you can make more ISK per hour doing something else for the same amount of effort...

... rabble rabble hiss spit...

... some numbers...

... INDIGNATION...

... Faction Capitals should not have material costs higher than a regular dred because it is unreasonable for anyone but the wealthiest to build them...

... Fudge you CCP.


Did I get it right?
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#8 - 2016-07-09 21:04:47 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?



New events, re-balances (dumbing-down) and new shinies are aimed at players who are more willing/likely to buy PLEX.





Which is not what built this games community originally, I don't mind the micro transactions, I don't mind the pointless shiny things, I do mind the enforced grind, the lazy design and I expect so much more from this games studio.
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#9 - 2016-07-09 21:06:22 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?

Something something...

... the Serpentis event is boring...

... something...

... you can make more ISK per hour doing something else for the same amount of effort...

... rabble rabble hiss spit...

... some numbers...

... INDIGNATION...

... Faction Capitals should not have material costs higher than a regular dred because it is unreasonable for anyone but the wealthiest to build them...

... Fudge you CCP.


Did I get it right?


No. You clearly skim read.
Evi Polevhia
Phoenix Naval Operations
Phoenix Naval Systems
#10 - 2016-07-09 21:07:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Evi Polevhia
Look, seriously. If you have better ideas, hash it out with the CSM reps. While some good could possibly come out of this thread, talking to people who can actually do things is going to be better. This is EVE. Complaining in the wrong place will simply get you mocked more often than not.
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#11 - 2016-07-09 21:08:02 UTC
ShahFluffers wrote:
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Can we get a tl;dr before this gets locked?

Something something...

... the Serpentis event is boring...

... something...

... you can make more ISK per hour doing something else for the same amount of effort...

... rabble rabble hiss spit...

... some numbers...

... INDIGNATION...

... Faction Capitals should not have material costs higher than a regular dred because it is unreasonable for anyone but the wealthiest to build them...

... Fudge you CCP.


Did I get it right?

Pretty much, (i did read it im just poking the baby)

Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#12 - 2016-07-09 21:08:08 UTC
It's exactly the apathy towards these things displayed in the responses thus far that lead to more dumbing down.
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#13 - 2016-07-09 21:13:31 UTC
Evi Polevhia wrote:
Look, seriously. If you have better ideas, hash it out with the CSM reps. While some good could possibly come out of this thread, talking to people who can actually do things is going to be better. This is EVE. Complaining in the wrong place will simply get you mocked more often than not.


I'm an '06 player.....pretty sure I know this already, a forum is a forum. a dialogue starts somewhere and here is as good a place as any, I can take the toxic elements in the community in my stride, but please don't assume this is simply a whine or a complaint, it's a critique. As for better ideas, do I really have to point to the hundreds if not thousands of other community ideas that are better than a reskin, a quick stats edit and a tour around the graphics department. This isn't hard, CCP designed everything else we love in this game, this is damn lazy. I am someone who solves problems, I am not a designer of ships, but I am pretty sure you can't call the Vehement a designed ship, it's a reskin...
Ralph King-Griffin
Lords.Of.Midnight
The Devil's Warrior Alliance
#14 - 2016-07-09 21:13:59 UTC
Celeste Coeval wrote:
It's exactly the apathy towards these things displayed in the responses thus far that lead to more dumbing down.

Pick your battles, there are a myriad of legitimate other things you could have a go at ccp for but crying about faction caps being a rich mans toy is silly, particularly given the rarity of the only other faction cap,
This was to be expected.
Celeste Coeval
The Gosimer and Scarab
#15 - 2016-07-09 21:17:20 UTC  |  Edited by: Celeste Coeval
Ralph King-Griffin wrote:
Celeste Coeval wrote:
It's exactly the apathy towards these things displayed in the responses thus far that lead to more dumbing down.

Pick your battles, there are a myriad of legitimate other things you could have a go at ccp for but crying about faction caps being a rich mans toy is silly, particularly given the rarity of the only other faction cap,
This was to be expected.



The only other faction cap is far rarer than the Vehement in terms of BPC already and is also far easier on the build requirements, that's crazy no? A faction super (nearly said mothership bwahahaha) is easier to build and cheaper than a dread.

Just to clarify I am picking my battles, a community collectively fights all the battles, I am choosing this one, it's not your first choice, but it is mine.
Buliki
Publicly Owned Customs Offices
#16 - 2016-07-09 22:17:10 UTC
I feel your pain sister Celeste

I think they don't care about the money because in 5 minutes I could think of about 20 ways CCP could make more money. And I'm sure some of their employees can see it also... This is an international dumbing down by design. My guess is they don't have a choice to keep it/make it stupid.

That Futurama meme comes to mind... SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY! But no. We can't have nice things. We are Slaves
Zakarumit CZ
Zakarum Industries
Forgers United
#17 - 2016-07-09 22:31:12 UTC
Well, pretty much what I think.
I just dont think my opinion changes anything Big smile
I hoped the event could actually be interesting for me from all the marketing around it - but from the first look, its a waste of time for me. Nothing special, interesting or useful coming out of it.
Duke Amarrian
Tesla Aerospace Industries
#18 - 2016-07-10 06:59:37 UTC
I dont know why people are complaining. I've had to part my main account for this event because i'm finding the loot to be so god dam sweet i'm enjoying it more than my wormhole adventures.

it could possibly be time that other players dont have not sure. Let alone the BP for the gold can is awesome. I"m already seeing stupid people selling it beflow 10 bill and manufacturers are pissing themselves laughing at the cost. Come end of the event and when the BP's will be scarse I"m going to bust a few wallets open and make them pay for my time.

CCP have given you profits like mad and choices. Don't blame them if you are selling stuff dirt cheap because obviously your acting is desperate measures and are not playing the economical game of patience to reap the rewards come end of event.

Sorry but i've already made billions from this event and it hasn't been a full week. Seriously can you blame ccp for that ???
Sitting Bull Lakota
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#19 - 2016-07-10 08:36:41 UTC
Evi Polevhia wrote:
Look, seriously. If you have better ideas, hash it out with the CSM reps. While some good could possibly come out of this thread, talking to people who can actually do things is going to be better. This is EVE. Complaining in the wrong place will simply get you mocked more often than not.

Going to the CSM can't hurt, but we have plenty of cases where player recommendations fell on deaf ears.
I'd include the 118.6 carrier "rebalance" with that.

On the one hand, I am put off by what appears to be shoddy releases and knee-jerk balancing. On the other hand, I see the painstaking effort and clear player involvement in other releases.
But that's what I get for subscribing to an indie-cult mmo like the vegan foodtruck loving hipster that I am.
Sustrai Aditua
Intandofisa
#20 - 2016-07-10 10:35:37 UTC
I feel your pain. I usually get carpal tunnel after that much typing.

If we get chased by zombies, I'm tripping you.

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