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Should exploration ships get the mining ship treatment?

Author
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2015-12-18 22:46:15 UTC
Right now every empire has an exploration frigate and t2 version of it.

What I'm wondering is if it'd be better if the SoE ships get turned into "navy" or T2 versions of some new SoE exploration ships, make them the main ship an explorer would want, and then turn the emipre's exploration frigates into something else.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2015-12-18 23:05:16 UTC
Why?
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#3 - 2015-12-18 23:36:20 UTC
SoE are pirate ships already?
Celthric Kanerian
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2015-12-18 23:37:59 UTC
Linna Excel wrote:
the emipre's exploration frigates into something else.


None of the empires have any mining ships of their own anymore. All current mining ships come from the organisation known as ORE ( Outer Rim Excavations)
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2015-12-19 00:06:24 UTC
Celthric Kanerian wrote:
Linna Excel wrote:
the emipre's exploration frigates into something else.


None of the empires have any mining ships of their own anymore. All current mining ships come from the organisation known as ORE ( Outer Rim Excavations)


Yeah. That's what I'm wondering if CCP should do. Repurpose the empires ships and make SoE ships the only options for explorers.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#6 - 2015-12-19 00:17:39 UTC
Linna Excel wrote:

Yeah. That's what I'm wondering if CCP should do. Repurpose the empires ships and make SoE ships the only options for explorers.

So where is the T1 exploration ship?
ORE ships are not pirate ships, ORE are a sub faction with a limited ship line but T1 & T2 ships.
SoE are a pirate faction.

Totally different.
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2015-12-19 00:43:15 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Why?


Why not? :P


Let me ask this, why should ORE be the only group making mining ships? I'd argue that it simplifies things for industrial type players. So why not simplify things for explorers by giving them 1 clear maker of ships for exploration and a clear set of core skills.

I think it'd also allow for more versatility within exploration, sort of like covetor vs procurer. We could have a combat site exploration ship, one with bonuses mostly for finding and looting relic/data sites, a W-space specialist version, that sort of thing.
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2015-12-19 00:43:56 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:

So where is the T1 exploration ship?


Probe, imicus, and I can't remember the name of the other two.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#9 - 2015-12-19 00:47:50 UTC
Linna Excel wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:

So where is the T1 exploration ship?


Probe, imicus, and I can't remember the name of the other two.

That you are busy proposing we remove leaving only pirate ships for exploration. No T1 or T2 or Navy options.
See the difference between the exploration and mining ships changes?
Sobaan Tali
Caldari Quick Reaction Force
#10 - 2015-12-19 01:14:47 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
SoE are pirate ships already?


Only technically. They are listed as pirate ships and, as such, have two rather than one set of racial traits and attributes, even if SoE are far from being a pirate organization.

"Tomahawks?"

"----in' A, right?"

"Trouble is, those things cost like a million and a half each."

"----, you pay me half that and I'll hump in some c4 and blow the ---- out of it my own damn self."

Helios Panala
#11 - 2015-12-19 01:59:36 UTC
Eh, I can see the appeal I guess. The ship line up is starting to feel a little bloated.
Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2015-12-19 02:24:49 UTC
Sobaan Tali wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
SoE are pirate ships already?


Only technically. They are listed as pirate ships and, as such, have two rather than one set of racial traits and attributes, even if SoE are far from being a pirate organization.


I feel like SoE is considered "pirate" only because their ships currently require 2 factions, one per bonus. If they had their own starship skill, that could be paired down to one like the ore ships.
Petrified
Old and Petrified Syndication
G0N3 F1SS10N
#13 - 2015-12-19 02:47:13 UTC
I doubt the empire "exploration" ships need to be re purposed as they are capable of doing things soe cannot do effectively: combat probing and BLOPS. The T1 versions simply make good economical sense to use if you are learning probing and hacking - especially in High Sec.

However, I would not be disappointed to see a T2 version of the SOE ships that expands and improves on their exploration capabilities.

Cloaking is the closest thing to a "Pause Game" button one can get while in space.

Support better localization for the Japanese Community.

FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#14 - 2015-12-19 02:48:52 UTC  |  Edited by: FT Diomedes
Not supported. The current system works. The T1 exploration frigates get plenty of use. They logically continue to their T2 counterparts. This was not the case with the useless, deadend T1 mining frigates we had before.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

SurrenderMonkey
Space Llama Industries
#15 - 2015-12-19 03:21:52 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Why?



Because you've accidentally wandered into a Linna Excel thread.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Linna Excel
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2015-12-19 03:29:07 UTC
Petrified wrote:
I doubt the empire "exploration" ships need to be re purposed as they are capable of doing things soe cannot do effectively: combat probing and BLOPS. The T1 versions simply make good economical sense to use if you are learning probing and hacking - especially in High Sec.

However, I would not be disappointed to see a T2 version of the SOE ships that expands and improves on their exploration capabilities.


You misunderstand. The current ones out there would be the T2s or whatever. T1 versions of them would be added for beginners to learn with. Also, you could later add a combat probing version or whatever you need within the SoE line.
Xe'Cara'eos
A Big Enough Lever
#17 - 2015-12-19 12:06:04 UTC
are you proposing to introduce the skill 'SOE frigate'?
the T1 explo frigates also make pretty decent cargo runners.

For posting an idea into F&I: come up with idea, try and think how people could abuse this, try to fix your idea - loop the process until you can't see how it could be abused, then post to the forums to let us figure out how to abuse it..... If your idea can be abused, it [u]WILL[/u] be.

Xercodo
Cruor Angelicus
#18 - 2015-12-19 13:44:07 UTC
Yeah I totally see the logic here.

We need an SoE equivalent of the venture to replace the factional exploration ships.

What they get repurposed into though? No idea.

Oh and as an aside, I think ships like the tristan, tormentor, breacher, and kestrel need their own AF variants for the weapon system that they match best to, similar to how the command ships were changed.

Tristan hull Ishkur
Tormentor hull Vengeance
Breacher hull Jaguar
Kestrel hull Hawk

The Drake is a Lie

Lugh Crow-Slave
#19 - 2015-12-19 16:33:31 UTC
Why? Right now most of the t2 have good pros and cons (of some one could tell me why to use a gal over a cal I would love to know) the t1s ate a great starting option and the SOE do things better than the t2 but also have areas where the t2 are better overall the current state is pretty balanced
Donnachadh
United Allegiance of Undesirables
#20 - 2015-12-19 18:25:33 UTC
Lugh Crow-Slave wrote:
(of some one could tell me why to use a gal over a cal I would love to know)

Not terribly important in most uses but they are small advantages in some situations.
One more low slot
Lower inertia modifier
Faster align
Faster warp
Higher HP
Of course there are negatives as well but you asked how or why the Helios may have advantages. Personally I prefer the Anathema anyway.

To the OP I have to ask why as well.
The differences in the 4 are small but they are there and with proper fitting and implants they each fill a role that the others cannot do as well so why would we want to limit our choices.

The only skill difference between the 4 current is the racial frigate skill. Since the SOE ships are classified as a "pirate" faction they require two racial frigate skills so the training time is essentially equal so where is the advantage to this?

Staying with skills your single ship idea would actually punish some players. There are those who alreay have a racial frigate skill to 5 and would only need to train the cov-ops specific skills to fly a T2 exploration ship. With your change they still have to train those cov-ops skills but they may have to train a second racial frigate skill as well.

Overall I have to give your idea a -1. There are some negative aspects to it that your proposal does not adequately balance out with positive sides.

And you get a -1 because you offer us no ideas as to what the current line up of T2 exploration ships should become when they are superseded by your new SOE exploration ship.
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