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[Scylla] Bouncer Sentry Drone Optimal and Falloff

First post
Author
CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#1 - 2015-02-26 17:20:13 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Fozzie
Hello everyone. We are updating Singularity as we speak with the first testing versions of our Scylla release coming immediately after Fanfest.

If you've been watching CCP Rise's tweets, you already know that we have some important balance changes in the works and that more info will be coming this week.

I'm making threads right now for two of the sets of changes coming in Scylla, and for details of the rest you should watch the o7 show tonight at 20:00 EVE Time and keep your eyes peeled for a Dev Blog that will drop in the coming days. I'm making threads for this subset of the planned changes today because these are the ones that are already running in today's SISI update.

There are a number of balance issues that are being looked at surrounding Sentry Drones and the ships that use them, and more info on that will be revealed later. However one smaller tweak that I can announce now is that we are shifting some of the base optimal range on Bouncer sentry drones over to falloff.

The change removes 5km of base optimal for T1 Bouncers (6km for T2 and Navy) and adds the same value to falloff.

These are not the only balance changes coming in Scylla. All the details on those changes will be released in an upcoming dev blog.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

Lazei
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2015-02-26 17:26:39 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:


The change removes 5km of base optimal for T1 Bouncers (6km for T1 and Navy) and adds the same value to falloff.



Says T1 on both. Is the 6km from T2?
dexter xio
Zero Fun Allowed
#3 - 2015-02-26 17:27:16 UTC
Hmm, interesting.

Dead Game.

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#4 - 2015-02-26 17:28:35 UTC
Lazei wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:


The change removes 5km of base optimal for T1 Bouncers (6km for T1 and Navy) and adds the same value to falloff.



Says T1 on both. Is the 6km from T2?


Yup

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

Mimiko Severovski
Zero Fun Allowed
skill urself
#5 - 2015-02-26 17:32:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Mimiko Severovski
Good change.
Destoya
Habitual Euthanasia
Pandemic Legion
#6 - 2015-02-26 17:34:37 UTC
BLACK OPS HYPE
TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#7 - 2015-02-26 17:45:07 UTC
if it were me I'd do something like -40% or -50% optimal and falloff reduction on all sentry drones, or just remove them.
Swanky nutjob
Holding Inc.
#8 - 2015-02-26 17:47:56 UTC
Tracking is the problem, not optimal.

Rise and Fozzie, killing off 0.0 by one poorly thought out balance change, one after another.
Winter Archipelago
Autumn Industrial Enterprises
#9 - 2015-02-26 17:50:32 UTC
Swanky nutjob wrote:
Tracking is the problem, not optimal.

Rise and Fozzie, killing off 0.0 by one poorly thought out balance change, one after another.

Better to have multiple smaller changes that nail the issue completely (in the end) than one single massive change that completely ruins it.
Faife
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#10 - 2015-02-26 17:50:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Faife
Swanky nutjob wrote:
Tracking is the problem, not optimal.

Rise and Fozzie, killing off 0.0 by one poorly thought out balance change, one after another.


I can see how you read that first post and thought that the minor falloff/optimal tweak was the only change that's coming in Scylla and nothing else was being changed.

Emphasis on "you".
Princess Cherista
Doomheim
#11 - 2015-02-26 17:52:32 UTC
Paging Dinsdale
Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2015-02-26 17:58:44 UTC
Princess Cherista wrote:
Paging Dinsdale

Dinsdale hasn't posted since September 2014. I think he quit Eve. :( I miss him.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Harvey James
The Sengoku Legacy
#13 - 2015-02-26 18:06:31 UTC
i would hope some dps nerfs are incoming??

T3's need to be versatile so no rigs are necessary ... they should not have OP dps and tank

ABC's should be T2, remove drone assist, separate HAM's and Torps range, -3 HS for droneboats

Nerf web strength, Make the blaster Eagle worth using

Vince Draken
Burning Napalm
Northern Coalition.
#14 - 2015-02-26 18:07:46 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:


The change removes 5km of base optimal for T1 Bouncers (6km for T2 and Navy) and adds the same value to falloff.

.


Tracking is your problem friend a ship with no tracking / damage mods using sentrys still hits the smallest of ships pretty easy bring sentrys in line with every other drone (Small / Medium / Large)
colera deldios
#15 - 2015-02-26 18:33:57 UTC
This is perfect the problem with Ishtar is the Drone Control range and Targeting range. With this Sentry drone change if you also:

* Remove Ishtars drone control range bonus
* Reduce Ishtars base targeting range by 7.5km
* Reduce Ishtars CPU by 25

We get perfectly balanced Ishtar. DPS is really not the problem with Ishtars since you can easily just add more ships. Anyhow with these changes Ishtar is still viable at current ranges but they have to sacrifice that for a big hole in their tank.

And if they want to retain tank they have to fight at closer ranges which means doctrines like Legions, Lokis, Zealots, Absos, ANR and even BS doctrines can take them on and then the skill falls onto the FC's and fleet members.
Schneevva
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#16 - 2015-02-26 18:43:47 UTC  |  Edited by: Schneevva
Will the day come when you're finally ready to admit that the real problem is that they all just have too much DPS/alpha for their range?
Altirius Saldiaro
Doomheim
#17 - 2015-02-26 19:09:15 UTC
Just make EWAR that hits a ship, affect that ship's drones.

Tracking Disruption
Sensor Dampening
ECM

Why is it that I can EWAR an Ishtar, but that Ishtar continues to provide bonuses to it's drones from it's fitted modules?

At the very least, make it so that certain EWAR affects the bonuses provided by Drone Upgrade modules.

EWAR is an already in-game counter weapon. Instead of nerfing ships and drones, give us the ability to use already in-game tools so that we can counter them ourselves.
Phoenix Jones
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2015-02-26 19:15:16 UTC
Or just make some absolute distinctions between sentries and heavy drones.

Ishtar and navy vexor, bandwidth down to 100.
Ishtar dronebay down to 225.

Heavy drones bandwidth changed from 25 to 20.

Ishtar and navy vexor loses 20% of its dps potential when using sentry drones. Keeps all of its dps when using heavies.

Ishtar no longer can have a dronebay the size of a battleship (dronebay the size of the prophecy).

Half the problems fixed right there.

Yaay!!!!

Feodor Romanov
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#19 - 2015-02-26 19:34:55 UTC
This changes will not change anything really. The problem of centry drones is in tracking.
But not only the sentry drones is the problem. All Gallente droneboats is the most preferable ships in their class: Tristan. Algos, Vexor, Navy Vexor, Ishtar. Main reasons:
- can use any tank: shield, armor, hull;
- kite effectively or use thick tank;
- great possibilities for fitting
- any damage type
- best E-war protection

I have some thoughts what to do with them.
1. Restrict ship bonuses by thermal damage type. They can still use any drones they want but much less effective.
2. Devide ship doubled drones bonuses. For example: ships can have 10% to drones damage OR to drones HP; bonus 7,5% to drones max velocity or to tracking speed. Like all other ships have.
Anthar Thebess
#20 - 2015-02-26 19:48:34 UTC
2 ship types that are issues for sentry drones :
- isthars
- carriers

Solution:
Ishtar:
1. reduce bandwidth to 100mb/s
2. adjust hvy drone bandwidth to 20mb

Carriers:
1. [Capital Remote AID Rebalance](https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=405279)
2. Create Capital Drone Link Augmentor for carriers 5k m3 size 30km range , only 1 per carrier.





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