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The Ultimate Solution to the T2 BPO Problem Announced by CCP

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Author
Weaselior
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#1 - 2014-05-03 15:37:58 UTC
As anyone who was watching the fanfest stream knows, CCP Greyscale today announced that T2 BPOs will be going away in the future: that they've caused problems for the game for years and everyone has felt they'd be going away at some point. That point is apparently coming soon. The discussion indicated that they would not simply be deleted but that there would be a phasing out plan (presumably, the often-considered replacement with BPCs with a large number of copies).

Interestingly, CCP thought that people buying and selling T2 BPOs should have been taking this risk into account. As every bpo sells for something like 7-10 years profit at this point, players clearly did not have that sort of foresight or common sense, so we can expect the price to plummet dramatically.

What are people's thoughts on finally eradicating T2 BPOs to secure a future for invention as the only means of producing T2 bpos, and what do people think will happen in the interim between now and their eventual demise? What sorts of outrage do we expect from current T2 BPO holders who see large parts of their investment wiped out? Should they be compensated, or should we realize that buying a product that clearly was bad for the game and paying a decade's worth of profit was the sort of "sure, let me lend a million dollars to this strawberry picker for a mortgage on a mansion worth more than he'll make in his lifetime" financial decision that deserves the loss that everyone but they saw coming? When it comes to the plan to bail out T2 bpo holders with BPCs, how much is enough/too much? What sort of prices do we think we'll see people bailing out of their T2 BPO investments at, or do you think they'll hang onto them hoping that if they post loudly enough, they'll change CCP's mind?

Head of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal Pubbie Management and Exploitation Division.

Querns
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2014-05-03 15:39:45 UTC
This is very interesting stuff coming in the near future. It will nice to see some certainty brought to the T2 BPO problem.

This post was crafted by the wormhole expert of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal, the foremost authority on Eve: Online economics and gameplay.

Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#3 - 2014-05-03 15:39:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Doc Fury
Weaselior wrote:
The Ultimate Solution to the T2 BPO Problem Announced by CCP


You know who else had an ultimate solution?

I'll be surprised if this happens any time soon. They'll get nerfed before they disappear. I have yet to hear any valid reason these are a problem (except for jealousy) since invention was introduced.

Since CCP did not in fact announce what is stated in the thread title and OP I must rate this thread as follows.

Rumor Mongering Probability:
████████████ 100%

There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#4 - 2014-05-03 15:40:22 UTC
I think that they shouldn't just disappear some of the most valuable items in the game without compensation.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Abrazzar
Vardaugas Family
#5 - 2014-05-03 15:41:59 UTC
Invest in buckets, ctrl-A, shift-del, collect tears.
Ramona McCandless
The McCandless Clan
#6 - 2014-05-03 15:42:53 UTC
Until its in the patch notes of a patch or expansion it's not real.

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann

Aryth
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#7 - 2014-05-03 15:43:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Aryth
Doc Fury wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
The Ultimate Solution to the T2 BPO Problem Announced by CCP


You know who else had an ultimate solution?

I'll be surprised if this happens any time soon. They'll get nerfed before they disappear.


Ruining all my fun grr.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.

Liam Inkuras
Furnace
Thermodynamics
#8 - 2014-05-03 15:43:27 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
The Ultimate Solution to the T2 BPO Problem Announced by CCP


You know who else had an ultimate solution?

I'll be surprised if this happens any time soon. They'll get nerfed before they disappear.

Top lel

I wear my goggles at night.

Any spelling/grammatical errors come complimentary with my typing on a phone

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2014-05-03 15:44:41 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I think that they shouldn't just disappear some of the most valuable items in the game without compensation.


Yeah its not really a sandbox with CCP radically changing the baseline everytime a new player sneezes :D
Marsha Mallow
#10 - 2014-05-03 15:45:52 UTC
I sold mine, so don't care :P

I don't have a problem with them being compensated, but the owners can demand it themselves. Anyone in that market should have taken possible removal into account as a potential risk. Those who have had them since the lottery have had the benefit, its really only the later players who invested in them who will potentially lose ISK.

The danger in compensatons is that we might see a mass of inflated sales to try push up ISK reimbursed, so if they are going to do it CCP need to set a cutoff date for trade values sharpish.

Ripard Teg > For the morons in the room:

Sweets > U can dd my face any day

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#11 - 2014-05-03 15:48:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Kaarous Aldurald
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
I think that they shouldn't just disappear some of the most valuable items in the game without compensation.


Oh, and because I can see the attempted counter coming:

When someone says "Their compensation is making money off of it for so long", no, it's not. That's on CCP for not dealing with it sooner.

[edit: Also. "Item being deleted by the devs" is not a risk to be taken into account when playing this game. Being nerfed, yes. Being blow up or stolen? Hells yes. But not straight up deletion from the game.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Dramaticus
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#12 - 2014-05-03 15:50:23 UTC
CCP absolutely should not be compensating for people's terrible financial decisions.

The 'do-nothing' member of the GoonSwarm Economic Warfare Cabal

The edge is REALLY hard to see at times but it DOES exist and in this case we were looking at a situation where a new feature created for all of our customers was being virtually curbstomped by five of them

Thead Enco
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#13 - 2014-05-03 15:50:37 UTC
Weaselior wrote:
As anyone who was watching the fanfest stream knows, CCP Greyscale today announced that T2 BPOs will be going away in the future: that they've caused problems for the game for years and everyone has felt they'd be going away at some point. That point is apparently coming soon. The discussion indicated that they would not simply be deleted but that there would be a phasing out plan (presumably, the often-considered replacement with BPCs with a large number of copies).

Interestingly, CCP thought that people buying and selling T2 BPOs should have been taking this risk into account. As every bpo sells for something like 7-10 years profit at this point, players clearly did not have that sort of foresight or common sense, so we can expect the price to plummet dramatically.

What are people's thoughts on finally eradicating T2 BPOs to secure a future for invention as the only means of producing T2 bpos, and what do people think will happen in the interim between now and their eventual demise? What sorts of outrage do we expect from current T2 BPO holders who see large parts of their investment wiped out? Should they be compensated, or should we realize that buying a product that clearly was bad for the game and paying a decade's worth of profit was the sort of "sure, let me lend a million dollars to this strawberry picker for a mortgage on a mansion worth more than he'll make in his lifetime" financial decision that deserves the loss that everyone but they saw coming? When it comes to the plan to bail out T2 bpo holders with BPCs, how much is enough/too much? What sort of prices do we think we'll see people bailing out of their T2 BPO investments at, or do you think they'll hang onto them hoping that if they post loudly enough, they'll change CCP's mind?



T2 BPO's should of been removed after "T20"
Aryth
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2014-05-03 15:51:56 UTC
The greatest irony of that panel was the guy standing up to seek compensation for 20%. While the Greyscale response was to reply he was going to lose 100%.


Best troll ever.

Leader of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal.

Creator of Burn Jita

Vile Rat: You're the greatest sociopath that has ever played eve.

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#15 - 2014-05-03 15:52:51 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


[edit: Also. "Item being deleted by the devs" is not a risk to be taken into account when playing this game. Being nerfed, yes. Being blow up or stolen? Hells yes. But not straight up deletion from the game.


Happened before.

Collectible stuff has just been recycled.
TedStriker
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#16 - 2014-05-03 15:57:16 UTC  |  Edited by: TedStriker
Weaselior wrote:

Interestingly, CCP thought that people buying and selling T2 BPOs should have been taking this risk into account. As every bpo sells for something like 7-10 years profit at this point, players clearly did not have that sort of foresight or common sense, so we can expect the price to plummet dramatically.


It never was just CCP. I myself sold my T2 BPO i won in the lottery (ah..the days) because it was ALWAYS clear that T2 BPOs no longer had a place in EvE the moment they announced no new T2 BPOs would EVER enter EvE again.

What you guys did was pure SPECULATION. Someone will be the last one not to profit from it....deal with it. Yes, you should have known. If at all you have been lucky enough that CCP didn't care enough the last years to do anything serious regarding industry.

Really....just say it out lout for a moment: "5-10 years turnover".....yea, good luck with that mate ;)
Doc Fury
Furious Enterprises
#17 - 2014-05-03 15:57:18 UTC
Thead Enco wrote:
Weaselior wrote:
As anyone who was watching the fanfest stream knows, CCP Greyscale today announced that T2 BPOs will be going away in the future: that they've caused problems for the game for years and everyone has felt they'd be going away at some point. That point is apparently coming soon. The discussion indicated that they would not simply be deleted but that there would be a phasing out plan (presumably, the often-considered replacement with BPCs with a large number of copies).

Interestingly, CCP thought that people buying and selling T2 BPOs should have been taking this risk into account. As every bpo sells for something like 7-10 years profit at this point, players clearly did not have that sort of foresight or common sense, so we can expect the price to plummet dramatically.

What are people's thoughts on finally eradicating T2 BPOs to secure a future for invention as the only means of producing T2 bpos, and what do people think will happen in the interim between now and their eventual demise? What sorts of outrage do we expect from current T2 BPO holders who see large parts of their investment wiped out? Should they be compensated, or should we realize that buying a product that clearly was bad for the game and paying a decade's worth of profit was the sort of "sure, let me lend a million dollars to this strawberry picker for a mortgage on a mansion worth more than he'll make in his lifetime" financial decision that deserves the loss that everyone but they saw coming? When it comes to the plan to bail out T2 bpo holders with BPCs, how much is enough/too much? What sort of prices do we think we'll see people bailing out of their T2 BPO investments at, or do you think they'll hang onto them hoping that if they post loudly enough, they'll change CCP's mind?



T2 BPO's should of been removed after "T20"


There was no invention then, thanks for removing all Tech 2 from the game.


There's a million angry citizens looking down their tubes..at me.

Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#18 - 2014-05-03 15:58:11 UTC
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


[edit: Also. "Item being deleted by the devs" is not a risk to be taken into account when playing this game. Being nerfed, yes. Being blow up or stolen? Hells yes. But not straight up deletion from the game.


Happened before.

Collectible stuff has just been recycled.


Collectible stuff. Not an actual asset.

Can they decide this about ships, for example? Suppose Jump Freighters get disappeared next week. Compensation? Skillpoints, isk, both, or nothing?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.

Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2014-05-03 15:59:58 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:


Can they decide this about ships, for example? Suppose Jump Freighters get disappeared next week. Compensation? Skillpoints, isk, both, or nothing?



Now that would make losec way more interesting.
per
Terpene Conglomerate
#20 - 2014-05-03 16:01:39 UTC  |  Edited by: per
"CCP Greyscale today announced that T2 BPOs will be going away in the future"

where did i see this already, lol


T2 BPO's are really a problem with no easy solution, i don't have any myself and i don't like them but i can imagine that having some i would be pretty pissed if they were to be removed ... i'd increase their copying times hard or turn them into bpc's with some silly amount of runs
but there's already quazilion of discussions about this.....
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