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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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Suggestions from a new player.

First post
Author
Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-09-15 21:48:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Usdom Chaffmen
I started playing and, seriously this is the worst mission/quest tracking system I have ever seen.

A) The fact the tutorial isn't voiced is pathetic. Really, if you don't want to spend money on it then have a contest and let your fans submit their voice recordings of reading the tutorial. I'm sure some of them would sell their children to get their voice in the game.

B) Setting a way point and jumping blindly around space not knowing where you are going or even if you are going the right way is infuriating. I'm on a training mission and the nav system has sent me through 6 jumps to find a acceleration gate that was "Just outside." according to the mission text. I think it was just going around in circles for a while there till it figured out where it needed to be.

List the jumps you need to make to get to where you need to go in a checklist under the mission log. It's really simple and eliminates the confusion.

Also, when you enter a section of space and there are 7 items with identical names that is not helpful. Put the parts of the name that are different FIRST in the overview "Mining platform VII, Luna Republic, Ponyville Sector" instead of having 7 things that are all listed by where they are or who owns them. You should know where you are, you are there.
What the item is, is of far greater importance than reaffirming that it exists. We can see it exists by looking out the window.

C) The mission logs are horribly organized. Half of the missions look like someone got sick and vomited words. Hiding important little tidbits like "Equip the (whatever) before you leave space dock" would be good to have without having to dig through 3 layers of UI.

D) The fact your NPC put courier packages in the dock hangar instead of your ship is stupid and just another useless, pointless step for the player. If your package is so important and secure then why would you leave it what amounts to a gym locker? Why not put it on, oh, the actual ship?

E) The overview window is horrible. People don't come home from work to log in and read space novels with TINY little letters. You need to give us more options for controlling the size of the text in each window. Your UI is cluttered and hard to read in general. The fact you can't hit escape to close the focused window is stupid as that is a standard feature of most games made this century.

Suggestion: Make a window for FRIENDLY SHIPS and things that are likely to change constantly in a high traffic area, an overview window for LANDMARKS which include static items in that sector of space, and lastly have a window for HOSTILE objects.

Have each of the overview windows be minimizable. If I want to know who is piloting friendly ships around me I'll look. If I'm just flying through a sector I don't want to have my screen giving me a seizure because of all the traffic.

You have a beautiful game with a great premise and I really want it to be enjoyable but your UI designers really need to take a second look at the way they are providing information to the players because it is not, at all player friendly.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2012-09-15 21:52:42 UTC
It would've been funnier if you were here 6 years ago, back when the tutorial was "Here's how you undock, here's how you lock, here's how to activate mods. Ok, now get outta here ya little scamp" and then proceeded to boot you out to learn Eve the way nature intended

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#3 - 2012-09-15 22:00:35 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
It would've been funnier if you were here 6 years ago, back when the tutorial was "Here's how you undock, here's how you lock, here's how to activate mods. Ok, now get outta here ya little scamp" and then proceeded to boot you out to learn Eve the way nature intended


Here's a Rubik's cube, now go forth and fornicate with yourself is the short version of this.

The overview is customisable to show what you want in tabs, the Eve Uni wiki has the best tutorial on it that I've seen.

Waypoints are easy, they show as yellow in your overview, they also show in the top left of your screen as little hollow boxes the solid ones are just systems on your route, the colours of which show the sec status of the systems.

When agents give you stuff to transport they put it into your hangar for you to load, we've all forgotten to load them into cargo, your suggestion would be paramount to giving a stranger the keys to your car, if you do this in Eve expect somebody to steal it, because we will.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#4 - 2012-09-15 22:06:20 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
It would've been funnier if you were here 6 years ago, back when the tutorial was "Here's how you undock, here's how you lock, here's how to activate mods. Ok, now get outta here ya little scamp" and then proceeded to boot you out to learn Eve the way nature intended


Here's a Rubik's cube, now go forth and fornicate with yourself is the short version of this.

The overview is customisable to show what you want in tabs, the Eve Uni wiki has the best tutorial on it that I've seen.

Waypoints are easy, they show as yellow in your overview, they also show in the top left of your screen as little hollow boxes the solid ones are just systems on your route, the colours of which show the sec status of the systems.

When agents give you stuff to transport they put it into your hangar for you to load, we've all forgotten to load them into cargo, your suggestion would be paramount to giving a stranger the keys to your car, if you do this in Eve expect somebody to steal it, because we will.


Lol It's true!

Anyway, let him vent. He'll get over the initial frustration and start liking it just like everyone else or he'll go back to playing mists of pandara or whatever else he does

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#5 - 2012-09-15 22:10:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
God can you imagine the whining if we still had learning skills? and all the other unneeded crap that's disappeared over the last few years?

TL;DR Eve doesn't hold your hand and give you a cookie, it laughs at you and steals your cookie. If it did hold your hand, it'd be to steal your watch.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#6 - 2012-09-15 22:10:52 UTC
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
It would've been funnier if you were here 6 years ago, back when the tutorial was "Here's how you undock, here's how you lock, here's how to activate mods. Ok, now get outta here ya little scamp" and then proceeded to boot you out to learn Eve the way nature intended



I was here then. That would be why I stopped playing. Not having good tutorials is like sending people to a Chess tournament never having read the rule book. It just ends up being frustrating for everyone. Any game designer worth their salt would know that giving the consumer knowledge empowers them and the more empowered they feel the more likely they are to spend money. You never get a first chance to make a second impression.
Surfin's PlunderBunny
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2012-09-15 22:22:33 UTC
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
Surfin's PlunderBunny wrote:
It would've been funnier if you were here 6 years ago, back when the tutorial was "Here's how you undock, here's how you lock, here's how to activate mods. Ok, now get outta here ya little scamp" and then proceeded to boot you out to learn Eve the way nature intended



I was here then. That would be why I stopped playing. Not having good tutorials is like sending people to a Chess tournament never having read the rule book. It just ends up being frustrating for everyone. Any game designer worth their salt would know that giving the consumer knowledge empowers them and the more empowered they feel the more likely they are to spend money. You never get a first chance to make a second impression.


And yet here we are, more players than ever

"Little ginger moron" ~David Hasselhoff 

Want to see what Surf is training or how little isk Surf has?  http://eveboard.com/pilot/Surfin%27s_PlunderBunny

Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#8 - 2012-09-15 22:38:33 UTC
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
I started playing and, seriously this is the worst mission/quest tracking system I have ever seen.

A) The fact the tutorial isn't voiced is pathetic. Really, if you don't want to spend money on it then have a contest and let your javascript:insertsmiley('Ugh','/Images/Emoticons/ccp_ugh.png')fans submit their voice recordings of reading the tutorial. I'm sure some of them would sell their children to get their voice in the game.


B) Setting a way point and jumping blindly around space not knowing where you are going or even if you are going the right way is infuriating. I'm on a training mission and the nav system has sent me through 6 jumps to find a acceleration gate that was "Just outside." according to the mission text. I think it was just going around in circles for a while there till it figured out where it needed to be.


List the jumps you need to make to get to where you need to go in a checklist under the mission log. It's really simple and eliminates the confusion.



The tutorial used to be voiced. It was recently changed. A lot of people complained about the voice. Neither side is happy. This one is better then the one from a few months ago with much more information and information that points to what you need to know. They may revoice it in the future but... Eve has sound? Once you discover voice coms with your corp/alliance the game sound turns off.



There are overview guides out there to help you learn to set up an overview. The gates you need to jump to are marked in yellow on your overview. I didn't realize that for a long time. You are not flying blind. Also, the destination blocks that count down your jumps show what system is next if you mouse over them.

Even thou you are angry I will give you a link to Eve Unis Overview

As for the just outside thing... well this is space. :P

Usdom Chaffmen wrote:

Also, when you enter a section of space and there are 7 items with identical names that is not helpful. Put the parts of the name that are different FIRST in the overview "Mining platform VII, Luna Republic, Ponyville Sector" instead of having 7 things that are all listed by where they are or who owns them. You should know where you are, you are there.
What the item is, is of far greater importance than reaffirming that it exists. We can see it exists by looking out the window.

C) The mission logs are horribly organized. Half of the missions look like someone got sick and vomited words. Hiding important little tidbits like "Equip the (whatever) before you leave space dock" would be good to have without having to dig through 3 layers of UI.


This is very useful to players. It lets you know what type of station, if it may have reps, med bays, labs, what faction owns it... etc etc etc. You'll find it useful later.


It would but fitting is an art not a science. They'd advise people of stuff and it'd be wrong depending on race and ship and pilot skills and its not going to work that easily.


Usdom Chaffmen wrote:

D) The fact your NPC put courier packages in the dock hangar instead of your ship is stupid and just another useless, pointless step for the player. If your package is so important and secure then why would you leave it what amounts to a gym locker? Why not put it on, oh, the actual ship?


If you are in a ship that is to small to carry it? You have to get a bigger ship. You might want to contract someone else to do it. The hanger is your safest place in eve. It is far from a random locker.

Usdom Chaffmen wrote:


E) The overview window is horrible. People don't come home from work to log in and read space novels with TINY little letters. You need to give us more options for controlling the size of the text in each window. Your UI is cluttered and hard to read in general. The fact you can't hit escape to close the focused window is stupid as that is a standard feature of most games made this century.

Suggestion: Make a window for FRIENDLY SHIPS and things that are likely to change constantly in a high traffic area, an overview window for LANDMARKS which include static items in that sector of space, and lastly have a window for HOSTILE objects.

Have each of the overview windows be minimizable. If I want to know who is piloting friendly ships around me I'll look. If I'm just flying through a sector I don't want to have my screen giving me a seizure because of all the traffic.


Unified Inventory Rage Here


Go learn how to set up your over view. You have several tabs and a lot of customization. Go. Learn.


Usdom Chaffmen wrote:

You have a beautiful game with a great premise and I really want it to be enjoyable but your UI designers really need to take a second look at the way they are providing information to the players because it is not, at all player friendly.


It is more then it was. It can only accomplish so much. Ask for help. Make some friends. Do some web searches.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#9 - 2012-09-15 23:43:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
A) The fact the tutorial isn't voiced is pathetic. Really, if you don't want to spend money on it then have a contest and let your fans submit their voice recordings of reading the tutorial. I'm sure some of them would sell their children to get their voice in the game.

Have you looked at the size of the download recently?

Now imagine localizing that with English, German, Russian, Chinese, French, etc.

EDIT: And as long as we are reminiscing, I started in space, near an asteroid with a small red cross. I decided I woudn't shoot anything until I knew what I was getting into, so I warped (up-hill) to a nearby station. I couldn't get back. Thus ended my tutorial experience (2009-02-23). Later the same day I signed-up for a full year subscription.
Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#10 - 2012-09-16 00:26:09 UTC
I think it's the tutorial experience that is really just pissing me off. Like right now I have a mission to go mine ore. Great! I love treasure hunting however they don't actually -give- you a mining laser. They just kind of assume you have some across one some how??? In all the forum posts I have seen regarding this, some of them saying the same bug has been in the game for over five years.
I would buy one but the cheapest one on the market is seven times the money than I have.. so.. yeah. My tutorial experience has come to a complete halt. My only option is to randomly warp around looking for enemy ships to kill and hope that one of them eventually drops a mining laser.

Awesome game design guys... Awesome.. Have you considered working for the republican party?
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#11 - 2012-09-16 00:28:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
The very first ship you were given has a civilian mining laser attached to it.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#12 - 2012-09-16 00:36:25 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
The very first ship you were given has a civilian mining laser attached to it.

Not so much actually. That would be the bug they haven't addressed in half a decade.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#13 - 2012-09-16 00:48:48 UTC
In that case, leave your current ship and use your pod to dock into a station where you have no ships, you should be given a noob ship with a civilian miner and civilian gun. I must admit I've not come across the bug so it may or may not work.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack

Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#14 - 2012-09-16 02:13:21 UTC
Some nice stranger named Killer Tanker gave me enough money to buy a laser. I have to say, the game mechanics may be clunky but the players are nice. Even when I rant. Stop killing my rage-buzz you people and your niceness!

Hulk... calmly fix problem..
J'Poll
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-09-16 02:31:08 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
A. Not sure if answered but the reason the tutorialsnarent voiced at this point is cause ccp is working on them.
It use to have a voice over but cause they are changing stuff the voice over and on screen display dont match so to prevent confussion they temporarely disabled voice over

B. Won't work cause you can change your autopilot settings, so each player can take a different route. If you want a route a distant system, right click the system you want to go to and select 'set destination'.
All you ahve to do now is follow the yellow gates.\

What are you talking about when there are 4 times teh same thing in system.

C. Agree, mission report are messy. Yet all the objectives are clearly stated so you can clearly see what you have to do.

D. Mainly because people can accept a contract while they dont have a ship in that station. Or already accept a courier mission for future use. Or maybe they want to swap ships before flying that contract out.

E. Guess what...Your overveiw is completely costumizable. If you want it less messy, fix it yourself.
And if you did some further researc and hit the esc button you would have found the UI scaling system there to make stuff look bigger


But really if you find these things annoying, EVE might not be the game for you.

Or you are just a fail troll with a 0/10 score.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Usdom Chaffmen
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#16 - 2012-09-16 02:46:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Usdom Chaffmen
and just when I was willing to look past the HORRIBLE glaring flaws in the game design I run into another one. My brand new ship has two hard points on it so I have the choice of having guns and a mining laser or having guns and a salvaging kit but should the situation arise where I need to salvage a ship I battle while trying to get to a mine I just miss out because I can't use the two things I have purchased. Awesome! Seriously, these guys need to work for congress. This level of stonewalling progress is something that needs to be truly appreciated by people who practice the art.
Lady Naween
Immortalis Inc.
Shadow Cartel
#17 - 2012-09-16 03:41:03 UTC
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
and just when I was willing to look past the HORRIBLE glaring flaws in the game design I run into another one. My brand new ship has two hard points on it so I have the choice of having guns and a mining laser or having guns and a salvaging kit but should the situation arise where I need to salvage a ship I battle while trying to get to a mine I just miss out because I can't use the two things I have purchased. Awesome! Seriously, these guys need to work for congress. This level of stonewalling progress is something that needs to be truly appreciated by people who practice the art.


yes god forbid you have to make a choice about what you want to do. all ships should be able to do everything!!! *shakes fist and then rolls eyes*
Sugar Kyle
Middle Ground
#18 - 2012-09-16 09:06:11 UTC
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
and just when I was willing to look past the HORRIBLE glaring flaws in the game design I run into another one. My brand new ship has two hard points on it so I have the choice of having guns and a mining laser or having guns and a salvaging kit but should the situation arise where I need to salvage a ship I battle while trying to get to a mine I just miss out because I can't use the two things I have purchased. Awesome! Seriously, these guys need to work for congress. This level of stonewalling progress is something that needs to be truly appreciated by people who practice the art.


Woah horsey. Calm yourself down. Your level of rage whatever really isn't amusing.

You have a spaceship that is designed to do something or do something within an area of ability. This is never going to go away. The game gives you a very basic free ship that has limited abilities. It did give you a free ship.

Eve ships are about roles and tasks. If you want to mine you mine. If you want to shoot things you shoot things. If you want to mine and shoot things you use drones. If you want to salvage stuff you sacrifice something from mining or shooting things OR you pick a specalized salvage ship that does it well. Or even better you find a friend and everyone does different things to create a whole.

Everything doesn't get shoehorned into one package. Shoehorning will reduce your abilities.

Eve also can take some time. What a calmer person could do is go, shoot stuff, book mark the spot, go back, salvage it.

Will you also scream when you run out of cargo space and you have to return to a station to dump your cargo hold?

One of the things that I haven't seen said, that isn't obvious this early on is that missions are a very small part of eve and something that many players do not even do. No one will disagree that Eve's mission system isn't great. However, many would prefer that Eve focus on something else. You outgrow missions amazingly fast.

You are learning the controls. It does not come instantaneously.

Member of CSM9 and CSM10.

Oraac Ensor
#19 - 2012-09-16 09:29:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Oraac Ensor
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
I think it's the tutorial experience that is really just pissing me off. Like right now I have a mission to go mine ore. Great! I love treasure hunting however they don't actually -give- you a mining laser. They just kind of assume you have some across one some how??? In all the forum posts I have seen regarding this, some of them saying the same bug has been in the game for over five years.
With this one you're spot on. They've been told repeatedly about this and have done nothing about it, yet there is an obvious and easy solution: give a mining laser when the mission is accepted. What could be simpler?

Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
The very first ship you were given has a civilian mining laser attached to it.
Nope - as I understand it, new players used to start out in a ready-equipped rookie ship, but not any more. Now they are sent out in their pod to find and board an unfitted rookie ship and then instructed how to fit modules, including guns and ammo. But despite this, at a later point in the tutorials they are still told that they need to learn how to use ammo-using guns in place of their ammo-less gun! Rookie ships only come with civilian modules when docking in your pod in a station where you have no ships or after being repackaged and re-assembled.

Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
and just when I was willing to look past the HORRIBLE glaring flaws in the game design I run into another one. My brand new ship has two hard points on it so I have the choice of having guns and a mining laser or having guns and a salvaging kit but should the situation arise where I need to salvage a ship I battle while trying to get to a mine I just miss out because I can't use the two things I have purchased. Awesome! Seriously, these guys need to work for congress. This level of stonewalling progress is something that needs to be truly appreciated by people who practice the art.
EVE is all about prioritising and making choices. If you can't understand and accept that you might as well quit now.

So far, people have been ready and willing to help you, but that could well change if you carry on raging like a 5-year-old in a tantrum.
Smiling Jack Irish
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#20 - 2012-09-16 16:10:19 UTC
Usdom Chaffmen wrote:
I think it's the tutorial experience that is really just pissing me off. Like right now I have a mission to go mine ore. Great! I love treasure hunting however they don't actually -give- you a mining laser. They just kind of assume you have some across one some how??? In all the forum posts I have seen regarding this, some of them saying the same bug has been in the game for over five years.
I would buy one but the cheapest one on the market is seven times the money than I have.. so.. yeah. My tutorial experience has come to a complete halt. My only option is to randomly warp around looking for enemy ships to kill and hope that one of them eventually drops a mining laser.

Awesome game design guys... Awesome.. Have you considered working for the republican party?


Don't look for a mining laser. Look for a "Civilian Miner". It's enough for the tutorial and costs just 150 ISK.
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