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[PROPOSAL] REFORM MISSION WARP IN BEACONS
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Tomaso Yoshitome
Project Nemesis
Touch Fiberoptic
#1 - 2012-08-08 00:14:25 UTC
I have encountered serious problems with the beacons that form the basis of warp-in points for missions and complexes.

Two examples that highlight some fundamental difficulties with them.

Scenario 1

I am in a Hurricane, hunting war targets in high-sec. Using a neutral alt, I scout down a missioning Tengu.

I neatly put my alt 10km away from the stationary Tengu, jump in with the Hurricane, and click warp to 0 to my alt. I fly across the entirety of the system, giving ample warning to the target, who fails to warp off before I land. Rather than land neatly on my alt at 0, I am dragged 70km away to a warp-in beacon, giving the Tengu ample time to warp away.

Scenario 2

I am hunting a target through a plex in 0.0, in my Pilgrim, having played AFK cloaky wossname for a week to give him time. I deftly maneuvre through dozens of Large Collidable Objects, and his own wrecks, stopping 2200m off the acceleration gate towards him, so I can activate it without being decloaked, in the sure and certain knowledge he'll be spamming d-scan.

I warp in without decloaking... until.. unavoidably, and arbitrarily, I am decloaked by the warp-in beacon I had no hope or ability to avoid. It's pot luck as to whether you land within 2000m or not, and are decloaked by it.

PROPOSAL

1) End the tyranny of the warp-in beacon in dragging you off your designated warp-in, where there is no acceleration gate to block your path. Allow people to make use of decent scouting to get decent warp-ins on targets.

2) Stop beacons from arbitrarily decloaking covert ships. Either terminate their decloaking properties, give players a chance to avoid them, or ensure that they ALWAYS decloak you when you warp in. I favor the former.
Eternal Error
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-08-08 03:54:01 UTC
Supported.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#3 - 2012-08-08 04:27:13 UTC
Considering that beacons were added specifically to decloak ships entering through acceleration gates, I am not sure there is much merit in your proposal. Put 70km range on your hurricane, or perhaps consider bumping the target with your alt to buy time to close range.

You want free ganks handed to you on a platter? No thanks.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Tomaso Yoshitome
Project Nemesis
Touch Fiberoptic
#4 - 2012-08-08 12:56:10 UTC
Can you give me a link to evidence for your first assertion? If true, then it's been executed poorly, as its more or less random as to whether you are decloaked or not.

Secondly, it is hardly a free gank. There are two (possibly three) opportunities for the carebear to avoid losing their ship to a war target when missioning during war time - which frankly, they shouldn't be doing anyway.

A) Keep an eye out for Combat Scanner Probes on D-scan, especially using d-scan range to identify when they are scanning you specifically.

B) Pay attention to local, and dock when a war target enters local

C) Use short-range D-scan to identify when something is about to warp in on you.

Incompetent carebears are incompetent.
Tomaso Yoshitome
Project Nemesis
Touch Fiberoptic
#5 - 2012-08-08 12:59:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Tomaso Yoshitome
Hang on... put 70km range on a hurricane? How to tackle with hurricane at 70km?

Also, bumping would reveal the neutral alt or friend doing the scouting, rendering them useless as a 'neutral scout' for the rest of the war.

Kthxbai
Obsidiana
Atrament Inc.
#6 - 2012-08-08 14:29:18 UTC
Part of the mission is to force the player to cover a certain range that they can't avoid (do they still block a MWD?). It's like a physical obstacle meant to make the mission take longer. Otherwise, the mission runner would do something like what you did. This also means that his hunter has the same problem.

Not all missions work this way. You'll just have to catch him on one of those. You also can wait for him to come back to the warp point. Better yet, let him salvage through a few areas, wait for him at the warp in point of the last area, and surprise attack.

This also is a good time to attack someone else from the war target corp. If he warps out to support them, you can be waiting for him when he warps back with his mission ship.

This also is a case where long range can be useful. You need a (AB?) tackler and possibly a heavy tackler. Then warp in with a long range BS. It takes a two man team (light tackler switches to a BS), but it could work. Yes, 70k is a lot of ground to cover, but he can't get that far if you watched him leave his station and pursue soon after.

My point is you can get to your target if you use tactics over game mechanics that are working as intended. If you want to hunt him in a mission, you have to deal with the mission too.
Eternal Error
Doomheim
#7 - 2012-08-08 16:13:12 UTC  |  Edited by: Eternal Error
Mara Rinn wrote:
Considering that beacons were added specifically to decloak ships entering through acceleration gates, I am not sure there is much merit in your proposal. Put 70km range on your hurricane, or perhaps consider bumping the target with your alt to buy time to close range.

You want free ganks handed to you on a platter? No thanks.

Anyone remotely competent (and paranoid/at war/in lowsec/etc.) jettisons a can or three as soon as they warp into a new mission area to decloak people. Put it in the hands of the players.
Tomaso Yoshitome
Project Nemesis
Touch Fiberoptic
#8 - 2012-08-10 23:26:45 UTC
From latest patch notes

"Cloaked Ships will no longer be uncloaked by invisible Cosmic Signature and Cosmic Anomaly beacons"

I wonder if this applies to mission warp-in beacons in the same way? Devs feel free to clarify please!