These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
123Next pageLast page
 

Your First Hour And Experience In EVE: Feedback from new Players

First post First post
Author
The Big Lebowski
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2012-06-09 23:22:06 UTC  |  Edited by: The Big Lebowski
I have read that CCP is interested in some feedback from new players. So i thought i will just write down my first hour with EVE. I would be interested in reading how other new players perceived and experienced their first hour in EVE. Maybe we can improve some things Bear
All i knew about EVE: Space, ships, complex, real market, takes long to skill stuff, SPACESHIPS, freedom
I ALSO KNOW that EVE is not like all other MMO and it has different gameplay. That is why i focus only on the FIRST HOUR!!
It is kinda the time from logging in and starting with the careermissions.
If you think, that some changes are needed, plz post here and like the thread!

* I create my character and start the game.
* Its nice, one can walk around in that room/captainsquarter
* Chat seems to be very active
* Why am i limited to slowwalking?
* Big screen with ships, numbers, pilotnames. I absolutly have no clue what it means
* My captainsquarters have like 10 walls. All walls are empty. The whole room looks like some storage room. It is all so empty. No things to pick up and take a closer look. What is the purpose of that room??

* Ok, i should talkt to this tutorialLady. She talks far to slow and boring. It's like someone is reading from a paper and not really talking to a person...
* This tutorialLady should be in my quarters and talk to me in person all the time, without me needing to press NEXT NEXT NEXT on that little ugly windows. If i miss something she said, i could press some REPEAT button.
* Anyway, i thought i am in space. Where is my ship and where is the space? Where are other players?
* Damn, i am stuck in some tutorial step: I should open some of the GUI elements. But where is it? cant do nothing
* I heard that the game is deep and complex, but this tutorial is just complicated and boring. How about that lady starts talking and gives some hints where to press on the screen to open that inventorywindow.... Cant open it... WHERE is it?
* Pressing like crazy all possible icons. There are like 25 of them....
* WINDOWS all over the place
* Why cant i close the last opened window with esc? i have everytime to click on the little small x in right corner...
* How to undock from station?
* That tutorialLady should be a real person or some agent i can relate to and acompany me to my ship
* Ok i undocked, i am flying in some kind of capsule, I see some space, some station and nice zoom, but where is my ship and how do i fly this capsule? Why isnt that tutorialLady giving any hints? For 2 minutes silence.
* Ok my first quest is to get to my ship, but how? There should be some quest/mission book
* To much talking/reading about some right clicks and contexts.... i thought i would get my first ship... really annoying
* Ok, i got somehow in my new ship. How do i fly it? Move it?? Is it stuck?
* srsly tutorialLady, how about some hints for the stuff i care?? You are talking about things i do not care RIGHT now.
* Ok like 2 tuts later i get the info that i can doubleclick in space to fly some direction. TOO LATE!
* Now my tutorialwindow is gone... what was i told to do?
* Get some box/item for some mission. But where from? How about the little ship in the big space is highlighted somehow??
* I get all the time some orders. Do this do that. How about you tell me in 5 sec HOW TO DO that instead of letting me read it for 30 sec and try &error for another 30 sec... tell me where to press and what to do. It is obvious that 1 minute after the order nothing happend and i am stil lost in space, i am STUCK
* Ok i managed the next order, but its like try&error. Its not that i have fully understood it...
* i docked back at my station and get new mission. To destroy something.

* 30 Mins so far over and i have seen nothing in EVE. All that stuff i could have done in 5 mins, if were not forced to read and try&error tutorialstuff. So 30 mins tutorial and i am still in my room without having seen anything interesting in EVE. No ships, no other players, no battles, no deep anything. Just reading manuals.
* Ok warping looks cool. nice space and nice ship
* The bald lady is a horrible teacher. She has no clue how to talk to new pilots. I do not need spoken ORDERS. WHAT i need is some audio which explains HOW TO DO STUFF. Why cant i have the bald lady act like if this all would matter what i am doing for 40 mins. I feel like i have called some telephone helpline and listening to some robot telling me to press 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 to quit this lame ass boring tutorial.
* I think even starcraft 1 in 1998 had better Avatars talking you through your first mission

* Why am i not told that 15 km are to far away to shoot this fuel? need to be closer
* Fueldepot destroyed, so what now? I think that after 2 mins of starring into the space without doing anything that tutoriallady would say something... Maybe check back and ask how i am doing??? If i need a sandwich or a white russian. Or repeat the order she has give 10 mins ago?
* Ok i killed brain afk those 2 pirate ships. That was borrng. How about some ingamecommunication between me and the pirates, or some ingamecutscene or anything that would make that moment special? It feels like it was step 18 from 14590 steps.....
* Another mission? How about some comments to a mission SPOKEN to me by that bald blue lady? I understand that i have to read some text, but few words when i take the mission wouldnt be bad too. I have not heard a single sound in this game, except the background music
* The whole 1 hour of EVE didnt feel like playing to me. It was more like following some ROBOTGIVEN orders and setting up a system/environment before you can start doing anything.... maybe back in the old days they really read the whole papermanual before they started installing the game
Louis deGuerre
The Dark Tribe
#2 - 2012-06-09 23:33:41 UTC
Trust me on this, you're having it easy, compared to tutorials of days gone by Bear.
Not saying your points aren't valid, but the tutorial process has seen dramatic improvement since the old days.
I think everything you did in an hour took me two whole evenings to figure out back then Lol

This is a good initiative and I invite all new players to make a note of what's good or bad about the tutorial so perhaps CCP will have an easier time to figure out what would be the best way to make further improvements.

Welcome to EVE. Game of SPACESHIPS (and lots and lots of windows).
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#3 - 2012-06-10 00:34:59 UTC  |  Edited by: J'Poll
Agreed, tutorials isn't perfect (but nothing is in the end).

But it's better then in the past, like Louis said.
When I started tutorial had 3 steps:
1.) This is your ship
2.) This is your gun
3.) This is a rat trying to kill you, good luck, tutorial ends here.

As for AURA (Tutorial lady) being a bad teacher, maybe that is actually good. Makes you interact with others from the start, as it's a MMO.

But I agree, your post is good. CCP should look at new player's experience with the tutorials and look where to improve it.
*When I did them with one of my alts, you needed a skilbook for a certain module, while that skillbook was the reward of the mission What?What?What? *

Also, sound in EVE doesn't particulairy work when most of it's players are running voice comms on the background.
My entire EVE music is disabled, the only sound EVE makes is when my cap goes dead or when my shields/armor is failing. Nothing else matters.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Forum Clone 77777
Doomheim
#4 - 2012-06-10 02:48:47 UTC
Honestly OP, I cant help but get the impression that you think youre "too good" for this game, and ironically, you also come across as pretty stupid.
1. You can close the tutorial if you like.
2. I wouldnt advice it.
3. Follow the steps.
4. If lost check the journal.

Even I was able to do that, and trust me, youl probably end up being pretty happy if you ever notice the flood of new people going "Omg how do I undock my ship".
They do this because they too, were "too good" for the game, and managed to close the tutorial, but dont have a clue how to open it again.

Do the tut, stop crying, once youre done with it, start playing EVE.
Keno Skir
#5 - 2012-06-10 03:02:00 UTC
Fair point, bit complex. I managed it tho, so did most people i fly with :/ Breath, and go see what you missed.
Baneken
Arctic Light Inc.
Arctic Light
#6 - 2012-06-10 06:43:03 UTC
I have to agree on the boring part, last time I did the tutorial with anew alt (because I'm stingy with my wallet and I like having free stuff RollP ) I just clicked yes yes yes yes as fast as I could and it still took me 10minutes.

I would like to be able to jump right in the good part of getting the skill books and ships tbh. Big smile
Liam Mirren
#7 - 2012-06-10 08:18:56 UTC
What the OP needs to realise that this game differs very much from other MMOs to a point where your vast x years experience with [insert 5 different MMOs] means absolutely nothing. Partially because this is effectively an old school MMO and doesn't cater for the "COD crowd" and mostly because it's so frecking complex you NEED it to be explained to you slowly.

Every time the Aura asks you to do something like opening a window the game will point to it so if you take the time it's all there. This just is your first encounter with EVE where "take your time to read stuff and make SURE you understand what is going on" is being explained to you, hence the rather slow and deliberate voice acting. A Gung ho attitude in EVE generally means you'll write an emo ragequite thread about how bad the game is and how "it all sucks" in some 3 months time.

You can't clown your way through EVE, not if you're completely new, doing so anyway means you'll get your **** pushed in by both the game itself as other players. Also, because there's no simple goals and achievements (no levelling etc) take your time, why rush?

Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.

The Big Lebowski
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2012-06-10 09:29:34 UTC
All posts, which sound like:
* you just dont get it
* this is eve, not World of Warcraft
* it takes time to have fun and see the beauty of EVE
* eat it or starve

can be treated as spam.
I am talking about the first hour of EVE. Nothing else.

Quote:
What the OP needs to realise that this game differs very much from other MMOs to a point where your vast x years experience with [insert 5 different MMOs] means absolutely nothing. Partially because this is effectively an old school MMO and doesn't cater for the "COD crowd" and mostly because it's so frecking complex you NEED it to be explained to you slowly.

I do not see any complexity in the process of getting from point A (station) to point B (ship) to get into my first ship. The task is trivial, but the way how it is explained and presented is complicated and not appealing. One should not confuse complicated with complex.

And the point is: This is just the first hour with the most trivial tasks to do. And yes, i really wrote down every thought/action that was not clear within the first few moments. I mean, how are really complex tasks and situations going to be explained? Well i saw it 10 minutes later. I did the first few scanningmissions and there i was like: REALLY REALLY, You want me to do the same annoying thing like 4x?? Really??? There were like 5 different anomalies which could be found in the exactly same process, but i had to repeat them....
Malles Istveruckt
Debaser Monde
#9 - 2012-06-10 10:02:38 UTC
I found my first hour in EvE beautifully complex. I look on it as the second most awe-inspiring thing I've done in this game. The first was my first kill. Big smile

As EvE is the first and only MMO I've ever played I should admit that I did a helluva lot of reading before I even signed up for the trial, so I didn't feel that overwhelmed during my the first hour. I had a fair (theoretical) idea of what I was getting into and I think that helped.

Stick with it and Good Luck.Cool
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#10 - 2012-06-10 10:18:10 UTC
The Big Lebowski wrote:
All posts, which sound like:
* you just dont get it
* this is eve, not World of Warcraft
* it takes time to have fun and see the beauty of EVE
* eat it or starve

can be treated as spam.
I am talking about the first hour of EVE. Nothing else.

Quote:
What the OP needs to realise that this game differs very much from other MMOs to a point where your vast x years experience with [insert 5 different MMOs] means absolutely nothing. Partially because this is effectively an old school MMO and doesn't cater for the "COD crowd" and mostly because it's so frecking complex you NEED it to be explained to you slowly.

I do not see any complexity in the process of getting from point A (station) to point B (ship) to get into my first ship. The task is trivial, but the way how it is explained and presented is complicated and not appealing. One should not confuse complicated with complex.

And the point is: This is just the first hour with the most trivial tasks to do. And yes, i really wrote down every thought/action that was not clear within the first few moments. I mean, how are really complex tasks and situations going to be explained? Well i saw it 10 minutes later. I did the first few scanningmissions and there i was like: REALLY REALLY, You want me to do the same annoying thing like 4x?? Really??? There were like 5 different anomalies which could be found in the exactly same process, but i had to repeat them....


The real complex things IMO are not explained at all. The tutorials cover the most basic things, yes it can be boring and yes it can be improved, but it is needed to learn the basic. If you wouldn't you will not enjoy EVE at all as best to learn it in a safe-ish way then during your time in the harsh world of New Eden.

The scanning tutorials are repetitive cause the tutorials will show you the different types of cosmic signatures, which means you have to probe them all out. If they didn't you would be here complaining you didn't know that a Gravimetric site was a mining site etc.

Again, agree that tutorials aren't good yet. They need a lot of work, but they aren't as bad as you make it look. You can do them in less then 1 hour easily (friend of my who started playing EVE lately did AURA in about 20min).

My suggestion / advice:

1.) Stick through it.
2.) Do all the tutorials (Aura and all 5 career agents)
2a.) Do the SoE Epic Arc
3.) Find out what you like in EVE ( http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/ ) and join a corp that does what you like in your timezone.
4.) Enjoy EVE.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Liam Mirren
#11 - 2012-06-10 10:21:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Liam Mirren
The Big Lebowski wrote:
All posts, which sound like:
* you just dont get it
* this is eve, not World of Warcraft
* it takes time to have fun and see the beauty of EVE
* eat it or starve

can be treated as spam.
I am talking about the first hour of EVE. Nothing else.

Quote:
What the OP needs to realise that this game differs very much from other MMOs to a point where your vast x years experience with [insert 5 different MMOs] means absolutely nothing. Partially because this is effectively an old school MMO and doesn't cater for the "COD crowd" and mostly because it's so frecking complex you NEED it to be explained to you slowly.

I do not see any complexity in the process of getting from point A (station) to point B (ship) to get into my first ship. The task is trivial, but the way how it is explained and presented is complicated and not appealing. One should not confuse complicated with complex.

And the point is: This is just the first hour with the most trivial tasks to do. And yes, i really wrote down every thought/action that was not clear within the first few moments. I mean, how are really complex tasks and situations going to be explained? Well i saw it 10 minutes later. I did the first few scanningmissions and there i was like: REALLY REALLY, You want me to do the same annoying thing like 4x?? Really??? There were like 5 different anomalies which could be found in the exactly same process, but i had to repeat them....


You'd be surprised how full rookie and help channel is "how do I do [insert basic action that's thoroughly explained in the tutorials], and how many older players there are which are clueless on the most basic game mechanics. Your first post stated how you couldn't find some basic windows (while the tutorial points them out to you) and now you say it's too easy and should hurry up?

EVE is a slow burning game and if you're a true newbie full of pitfalls, expensive mistakes and players capitalising on your lack of knowledge/experience. It's not a Freelancer clone. Don't get me wrong, I'm not trying to fanboy here but there is a good reason why EVE starts at a really slow pace as it'll spit you out if you refuse to learn or put in effort. Also, the game isn't for everyone (which is a GOOD thing), if you're looking for more direct action oriented games look elsewhere.


If you do have questions or issues you can always mail/convo me or check the help channel (not rookie), while there's some trolling going on from time to time it's full of people willing to help newbies (some are mor knowledge than others, ofcourse). Alternatively, check the link in my sig, it might help you.

Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.

Yuriko Deathstrike
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#12 - 2012-06-10 13:56:15 UTC
* Why am i limited to slowwalking?
where would you run to? if they introduce WiS (walking in station) then i will complain about the slow walk.

* Big screen with ships, numbers, pilotnames. I absolutly have no clue what it means
Aura explains most of what the overview is...and no offense but use your head man. Took me about 5 seconds to realize what the overview was all about. Hmm...they have symbols assigned to things, and i see a unique name, and a distance column, and a item category column. And i can sort by any column, just like a lot of stuff i use IRL.

* My captainsquarters have like 10 walls. All walls are empty.
IMO people should worry less about eye candy in the CQ, and more about other meaningful things, like eye candy on your actual ship.

* Ok, i should talkt to this tutorialLady. She talks far to slow and boring. It's like someone is reading from a paper and not really talking to a person...
Aura is pretty useful if you listen to her, read her instructions and look at the little pictures that pop up. Otherwise if you have a poor attention span, you'll be asking questions like "i'm in space in a pod, what do i do?"

* This tutorialLady should be in my quarters and talk to me in person all the time, without me needing to press NEXT NEXT NEXT on that little ugly windows. If i miss something she said, i could press some REPEAT button.
maybe they can add a little yellow exclamation mark above her head too...

* Anyway, i thought i am in space. Where is my ship and where is the space? Where are other players?
* Damn, i am stuck in some tutorial step: I should open some of the GUI elements. But where is it? cant do nothing
listen to Aura, read Auras instructions, look at the little picture that pops up (its not just for show)

* I heard that the game is deep and complex, but this tutorial is just complicated and boring. How about that lady starts talking and gives some hints where to press on the screen to open that inventorywindow.... Cant open it... WHERE is it?
tutorial may be boring, but it is not complicated

* Pressing like crazy all possible icons. There are like 25 of them....
hover over the icons while you are in station

* How to undock from station?
hover over the icons while you are in station

* Ok i undocked, i am flying in some kind of capsule, I see some space, some station and nice zoom, but where is my ship and how do i fly this capsule? Why isnt that tutorialLady giving any hints? For 2 minutes silence.
I've done the tutorial 6-7 times now, and i can tell that you did not listen to Aura, and that you did not read what she said, and that you did not look at the little pop up window. I did all of those things, and i had zero problems getting the first space mission done

I've snipped the rest of your stuff because all i am getting is that you cannot follow simple instructions. When Aura or any agent gives you a mission, you only have to do 2-3 things before you can get on your way.

1) you have to read and in Auras case listen
2) you have to be able to comprehend what you are reading
3) you have to pay attention

If you do not or cannot do any of those, then you are gonna have a hard time. Also all that stuff you talked about regarding cutscenes and voiceovers? that stuff costs money, takes time and requires more work.

TLDR tutorials and EVE are working as intended, new players just need to adapt
J'Poll
MUSE LLP
RAZOR Alliance
#13 - 2012-06-10 14:08:41 UTC
Let's make a cut scene video for every single mission. So that mission runners can watch the same video over and over again.
Or have PvP players who never watch it and have money spent on something useless that doesn't add to the gameplay.

Personal channel: Crazy Dutch Guy

Help channel: Help chat - Reloaded

Public roams channels: RvB Ganked / Redemption Road / Spectre Fleet / Bombers bar / The Content Club

Yuriko Deathstrike
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-06-10 14:34:13 UTC
I dont know if the OP is complaining that the tutorials are too hard, or that the tutorials are too hard for a task that is so simple.

The idea is not to focus on the task they are giving you, the idea is to learn from it. Aura or the agent might be sending you 5 systems away to retrieve an item. Along the way you're supposed to be learning a few things, not complaining about why they would send you 5 systems away to retrieve that item.

pod to ship? basic system navigation, how to board a ship, how to loot. Similar to how MMOs have a WASD pop up, but slightly more complicated.

fuel depot to drones? basic ship repair/shield boosting, target locking and firing

academy office? more navigation, camera operation

aura to first training hub? system to system navigation


Also the scanning missions? it is a good way of training through repetition on how to scan while at the same time introducing you to all the different scan sites and what they are for. My first toon it took me about 10-15 minutes and one time close to 20 minutes to scan for sites. Three or so toons later i'm able to do each scanning tutorial in under 2 minutes upon finding a signal.
The Big Lebowski
State War Academy
Caldari State
#15 - 2012-06-10 16:00:51 UTC  |  Edited by: The Big Lebowski
Yuriko Deathstrike wrote:
I dont know if the OP is complaining that the tutorials are too hard, or that the tutorials are too hard for a task that is so simple.

So why do you respond if you have no clue what i am talking about?

It seems to me that some people here in the forums just love complaining about the complains of other players. And by the way i am not complaining about any core elements of the game. I just complain about the first hour of EVE and what i have been presented. ownd.
Liam Mirren
#16 - 2012-06-10 17:25:50 UTC
See, that's the fun thing about this game, we make our own goals and we have the game mechanics to have some fun. Enjoy.

Excellence is not a skill, it's an attitude.

Yuriko Deathstrike
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2012-06-10 18:38:04 UTC
The Big Lebowski wrote:
Yuriko Deathstrike wrote:
I dont know if the OP is complaining that the tutorials are too hard, or that the tutorials are too hard for a task that is so simple.

So why do you respond if you have no clue what i am talking about?

It seems to me that some people here in the forums just love complaining about the complains of other players. And by the way i am not complaining about any core elements of the game. I just complain about the first hour of EVE and what i have been presented. ownd.



Well in your OP you seem to complain a lot about the first hour of your EVE experience. You even said you were "interested in reading how other new players perceived and experienced their first hour in EVE". Then a few posts later you say "I do not see any complexity in the process of getting from point A (station) to point B (ship) to get into my first ship. The task is trivial, but the way how it is explained and presented is complicated and not appealing".

So which one is it? are you having trouble understanding the basic tutorials? are you just annoyed by it? or are you afraid you wont be able to understand more complex things? on the subject of scanning, which you said yourself was complex there is a youtube by CCP on the subject. Or if you have even the basic understanding of how 2 dimensional triangulation works you can apply that to the 3 dimensional in the game. And unless you are still stuck on basic arithmetic, you probably already have knowledge of triangulation...you might just not have realized it.

Using scanning as an example, you need to pay attention and use some common sense, because there is a pattern there. One scan bubble on a signal > strength stays the same, but overlap two scan bubbles and the signal strength changes. That must mean the signal is somewhere in that new overlap area you just created when you moved the second probe. What if you had overlapped two bubbles and the signal strength had not changed? that must mean the signal is not in the overlap area, but rather in the scan bubble of the one probe that isnt being covered by the second probe. See the pattern?

I managed to do the scanning tutorial by myself with no help from youtube at all. First toon took me 10-15 and on a few occasions 20 minutes from found signal to 100% and warp. By my third toon i was down to 1 to 2 minutes from found to 100% warp. Once i had found a pattern, it got a lot easier.

My advice still stands, pay attention, read, listen and look. If you are having trouble just with the tutorials, then i'm guessing you are doing none of those. Also right click>show info is your friend along with mouse hover. Feel free to explore, just dont click anything that says delete, confirm or are you sure. It was either tell you that or i just tell you that you are an idiot...or that i'm smarter then you, blah blah. But thats not what you want to hear i'm sure.

P.S. i think i already mentioned it, but i didnt have any problems with the aura or agent tuts.
ShahFluffers
Ice Fire Warriors
#18 - 2012-06-10 19:34:55 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Phantom
And the tutorial is stupid easy compared to what it used to be. Like others said, there is room for improvement on it but it shouldn't take an hour to do the first slew of missions from Aura (pro-tip: when in doubt, right-click).

Edit: Off topic part removed, CCP Phantom
DeBingJos
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#19 - 2012-06-10 19:38:42 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Phantom
I recently did the tutorials. They are not as bad as he says.

However, they are lacking in several aspects and it would be very wise of CCP to improve them.

Sometimes you need modules to complete a tutorial mission that you don't own yet. The veterans among us just say: "buy it from the market" but they forget how overwelmed you are in your first hour. The new player does not know how the market works. It needs to be explained.

What I suggest to CCP is this: Find some people that never played EVE before. Let them do the tutorials and sit next to them. DO NOT INTERFERE, just take notes of how the new guys respond to the tutorials.

Edit: Off topic part removed, CCP Phantom

Ungi maðurinn þekkir reglurnar, en gamli maðurinn þekkir undantekningarnar. The young man knows the rules, but the old man knows the exceptions.

gfldex
#20 - 2012-06-10 22:35:49 UTC
The Big Lebowski wrote:
So i thought i will just write down my first hour with EVE. I would be interested in reading how other new players perceived and experienced their first hour in EVE.


You have written down what all those folk with their noses high in the air have forgotten. The tutorial is dreadful and explains very little about the game. If EVE would be a board game, nobody in his right mind would even attempt to try to play it.

Proper handbooks are hard, that's why we don't got one.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.

123Next pageLast page