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tie tax income to bounties - removing isk creating faucets?

Author
Arklan1
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2012-03-24 11:38:32 UTC  |  Edited by: Arklan1
so, for a while now there's been alot of discussion about the economy and what's wrong/broken with it and the like. there's all sorts of reasons for this and i'm not going to go into them. but i've been wondering something.

in the real world governments more or less use tax income to pay for everything (ignoring debt spending and the like) they want to accomplish. money comes in as tax, it goes back out as pay for government stuff of all sorts. salaries, paying for services like postal and police, hospitals, etc.

so... why don't we do that in eve? we already HAVE taxes, both corp and empire/concord. these taxes bring in isk that, currently, just vanishes. on the other hand we have bounties and similar activites that create isk out of thin air, and with an imbalance in these faucets and sinks, things get unbalanced and all sorts of messy.

so why not take the taxes (modifying the rates where appropriate of course and potentially on the fly) and use the tax income to pay the bounties. no more isk creation, no more isk deletion. everything just cycles through, being earned and spent and shifted about. i'd bet this would make things fasciating for our good dr. eyjo and his crew to analyze. :D

i have every expectation that i've missed some blatant and obvious reason why this can't work in eve, but i've been unable to think of it. so, flame on folks.
Grumpy Owly
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#2 - 2012-03-24 12:30:02 UTC
The short answer to this primarily I imagine is that whatever the equaivalent model for GDP of each EvE player is larger than the associated taxation involved in the economy. This is to allow the purchase/payment or use of products and services.

How this then works in the reality of EvE that bounties are funded creates an interesting question of course and not something I've tried to find out in the lore how governments/factions etc fund the SCC or pay for faction mission rewards etc. Of course the lore affords for income from planets and the New Eden population not associated with capsuleer money or the EvE economy as we understand it, so its perfectly possible for it to be funded.
DarthNefarius
Minmatar Heavy Industries
#3 - 2012-03-24 17:26:47 UTC  |  Edited by: DarthNefarius
As long as the NULL SEC bounty taxes are double the HI SEC taxes I got no problem with it... HECK I wish I could ratt in a Titan in HI SEC to make the EZ bounty ISK too
Hmmm I may have misread the OP I thought he wanted a bounty tax but on second read I guess he saying tax ISK sinks to feed the bounties? What happens when the bounties outstrip the ISK sinks? Concord has to then issue bonds & go into debt like the US government? lol Concord would have to default on thier debt in 6-12 months from bot bounties alone.
An' then Chicken@little.com, he come scramblin outta the    Terminal room screaming "The system's crashing! The system's    crashing!" -Uncle RAMus, 'Tales for Cyberpsychotic Children'
BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#4 - 2012-03-24 17:38:54 UTC
Arklan1 wrote:


so why not take the taxes (modifying the rates where appropriate of course and potentially on the fly) and use the tax income to pay the bounties. no more isk creation, no more isk deletion. everything just cycles through, being earned and spent and shifted about.


If I understand your idea correctly, you don't want any new isk creation. There's no way this would work. Older players will acquire more isk to buy bigger and bigger things. I have ~16b sitting around my hangers and it grows all the time. I buy new ships to pvp with and I buy them faster than I lose them. New players would be competing with people like me for the limited supply of isk.

Then I stop playing the game (I'm never really going to stop, but lets say I do). Now I have ~16+b sitting around my hangers that nobody can access, it's removed from the limited pool the economy has.
Ashley SchmidtVonGoldberg
Doomheim
#5 - 2012-03-24 17:41:50 UTC
OP does not run missions

Standing in for Karn Dulake who was banned for saying bad words

Arklan1
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-03-25 00:29:59 UTC
Ashley SchmidtVonGoldberg wrote:
OP does not run missions


not currently today, no. but i sure have plenty in the past. just look at my gallente standings.

as for isk being removed locked away when older players quit or otherwise stockpiled, there's still a roughly consistent number of people out there ratting, missioning and god knows we all use the market and LP stores all the time, as well as highsec PI tax too.

so, it seems ot me, there's a constant flow of isk "in" to the eve "government" via pi tax (not player owned customs offices tax, but highsec or interbus owned) market taxes, manufacturing fees, lp store purchases, contract fees, and so on. there is also the consistent "out" from the "governments" in the form of bounties, mission rewards, incursion bounties, etc.

thus there's a constant in and out flow of isk already. it seems to me all we'd have to do is adjust these to be roughly equal and balanced (which would of course need to be done dynamically) and, even that was simply impossible, have a fixed markup on the outgoing payments to compensate. as i see it, this would force an overall balancing of the economy, in time at least. god knows it'd be a clusterfrak at first.

taxes and lp store prices and other concord/empire fees would have to be relatively dynamic, say monthly, quarterly, whatever. bounties and other outgoing isk would be similarly dynamic, raising or lowering depending o nthe availble pool of tax income to be used for payments. because of this the exact mission reward in isk would be different over time from each time you run it (depending how often the rates were adjusted.) but in comparison to other missions and sources of isk creation, all would be in balance.

in short, no more fixed taxes or fees for anything, and no more fixed bounties or isk reward either. wouldn't it be better ot have these values dynmaically changing based on several factors like how popular they are (incursions getting ran all the time? well, at the next adjustment the isk payments would be reduced.) in addition to availbe isk to make payments.