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Proposed laser turret naming changes

First post
Author
Tobiaz
Spacerats
#41 - 2012-03-20 13:06:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Tobiaz
[bittervet]

Was there a topic like this before CCP changed the missiles too? Because I would LOVE to read all the comments of the community about it being a bad idea, not making it more clearer AT ALL. Complaints about ret-conning stuff in EVE that's had perfectly functioning names for over eight years without anyone playing longer then a month complaining about it.

Which CCP would then have totally ignored and turned it into generic garble of discriptions anyway.

I suggest CCP also start renaming all ammo. 'Antimatter Charge S' can become 'Very Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge', and Plutonium 'Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge' and Lead Change M into 'Average-Range Medium Hybrid Charge'. I bet you can do even better with those horribly confusing projectile ammo. I mean 'EMP M'? That's waaaaay to short and non-descript for utter newbies and stupid devs to remember what it is. Ugh

Becomes lot more clear doesn't it? Now I want the read to look back into that block of text and quickly pick the types of ammo I just named. Which ones do you find the easiest? Not the names fitting CCP's 'new and improved'.

I'll admit I don't know the exact meta naming for lazorz, but that's because I never really used them. I'm Caldari, I could name every single missile before CCP stamped on them. I do know the meta 4 lasers, they be good sellin', the rest goes into the recycle bin anyway. If I really wanted to know the meta, I WOULD SIMPLY LOOK IT UP. It's not that hard, FFS!

Perhaps if CCP was honest about trying to make the stuff a bit more transparent, instead of getting a boner out of some OCD-driven urge to turn all names into generic bland descriptions, they should just put little chevrons on the icons for meta 0 to meta 4. There I fixed it for you Gnauton! Get some graphics flunky to draw them up and go do something more useful with your time.

[/bittervet]

Operation WRITE DOWN ALL THE THINGS!!!  Check out the list at http://bit.ly/wdatt Collecting and compiling all fixes and ideas for EVE. Looking for more editors!

Aqriue
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#42 - 2012-03-20 13:09:37 UTC
My god, that is soooo confusing right now, the slight difference to tell the varibles of a different caliber of gun. Its not like everybody already learned the meta types, so now we still need to relearn it again. Aside from calling missiles and hardeners by damage type....why does everything else have to be changed? I just took a look at armor tank mods last week since I wasn't playing EVE so much in recent months....thanks CCP...I new the difference between an N-type and a Radiosopte because you gave armor like 8 types of category, then 4 meta types in each category...yet shields only had like 8 total meta mods total! (non faction, non-T2). And I learned them....but now....yeah thanks for the ******* head ache Evil
Fidelium Mortis
Minor Major Miners LLC
#43 - 2012-03-20 13:38:15 UTC
Tobiaz wrote:
[bittervet]

Was there a topic like this before CCP changed the missiles too? Because I would LOVE to read all the comments of the community about it being a bad idea, not making it more clearer AT ALL. Complaints about ret-conning stuff in EVE that's had perfectly functioning names for over eight years without anyone playing longer then a month complaining about it.

Which CCP would then have totally ignored and turned it into generic garble of discriptions anyway.

I suggest CCP also start renaming all ammo. 'Antimatter Charge S' can become 'Very Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge', and Plutonium 'Short-Range Small Hybrid Charge' and Lead Change M into 'Average-Range Medium Hybrid Charge'. I bet you can do even better with those horribly confusing projectile ammo. I mean 'EMP M'? That's waaaaay to short and non-descript for utter newbies and stupid devs to remember what it is. Ugh

Becomes lot more clear doesn't it? Now I want the read to look back into that block of text and quickly pick the types of ammo I just named. Which ones do you find the easiest? Not the names fitting CCP's 'new and improved'.

I'll admit I don't know the exact meta naming for lazorz, but that's because I never really used them. I'm Caldari, I could name every single missile before CCP stamped on them. I do know the meta 4 lasers, they be good sellin', the rest goes into the recycle bin anyway. If I really wanted to know the meta, I WOULD SIMPLY LOOK IT UP. It's not that hard, FFS!

Perhaps if CCP was honest about trying to make the stuff a bit more transparent, instead of getting a boner out of some OCD-driven urge to turn all names into generic bland descriptions, they should just put little chevrons on the icons for meta 0 to meta 4. There I fixed it for you Gnauton! Get some graphics flunky to draw them up and go do something more useful with your time.

[/bittervet]


Actually the hybrid and projectile ammo types tend to be pretty good on the description end.

For hybrids - the range of ammo is determined by the density of the ammo material.
Projectiles - EMP seems pretty straight forward since it does primarily EM damage, Phased Plasma does heat etc. Some of the mid range/long range ammo can be confusing but how often do people use the T1 versions anyway?


ICRS - Intergalactic Certified Rocket Surgeon

Tobiaz
Spacerats
#44 - 2012-03-20 14:01:02 UTC
Fidelium Mortis wrote:


Actually the hybrid and projectile ammo types tend to be pretty good on the description end.

For hybrids - the range of ammo is determined by the density of the ammo material.
Projectiles - EMP seems pretty straight forward since it does primarily EM damage, Phased Plasma does heat etc. Some of the mid range/long range ammo can be confusing but how often do people use the T1 versions anyway?




I think you missed the sarcasm. Anyway, the missiles were pretty good on the description end. CCP didn't care.

Operation WRITE DOWN ALL THE THINGS!!!  Check out the list at http://bit.ly/wdatt Collecting and compiling all fixes and ideas for EVE. Looking for more editors!

Mona X
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#45 - 2012-03-20 14:59:22 UTC
Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something.

I need new signature.

Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#46 - 2012-03-20 15:01:11 UTC
Mona X wrote:
Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something.


shut up idiot

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

SokoleOko
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#47 - 2012-03-20 16:01:45 UTC
Change what you want, but DO IT ONCE!

Make a list of changes, gather feedback, anounce final list of new names, publish it BEFORE releasing the patch, then do all in ONE patch and be done with it.

Reason is simple - now every patch breaks up killboards. All I care in this game is PvP, so this is ruining my gameplay since I have problem with posting mails.

DO
IT
ONCE

Not every week, ffs!
Andski
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#48 - 2012-03-20 16:09:09 UTC
MY KILLBOARD STATS

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar

Misanth
RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE
#49 - 2012-03-20 16:25:24 UTC
CCP Gnauton wrote:

MEDIUM BEAM LASERS:
Heavy becomes Solid-State Medium


MEDIUM PULSE LASERS:
Heavy becomes Medium


That's all you really needed to change tbh.

AFK-cloaking in a system near you.

SokoleOko
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#50 - 2012-03-20 16:33:06 UTC
Andski wrote:
MY KILLBOARD STATS


Well, when I kill someone I want be able to post that kill on killboard - too much to ask?
JamesCLK
#51 - 2012-03-20 18:59:16 UTC
SokoleOko wrote:
Andski wrote:
MY KILLBOARD STATS


Well, when I kill someone I want be able to post that kill on killboard - too much to ask?


Creating an API for module names is a solution too. Straight

-- -.-- / -.-. .-.. --- -. . / .. ... / - --- --- / . -..- .--. . -. ... .. ...- . / - --- / ..- -. -.. --- -.-. -.- / ... - --- .--. / .--. .-.. . .- ... . / ... . -. -.. / .... . .-.. .--. / ... - --- .--.

Alice Katsuko
Perkone
Caldari State
#52 - 2012-03-20 20:35:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Alice Katsuko
Changes look good. Only suggestion is that you remove "gatling" from small beam lasers, for two reasons. (1) The in-game turret model does not look like a gatling gun. (2) "Gatling" is currently used for names of short-range guns like pulse lasers and autocannons, which helps distinguish them from their long-range counterparts, and makes sense conceptually.

That said, I do not understand how anyone could be confused by the current names as a practical matter. Small guns are filed under a separate category from medium guns, which are filed under a different category from large guns in the market. It is quite literally impossible for a player to buy the wrong size of gun unless he is a complete idiot.
James1122
Perimeter Trade and Distribution Inc
#53 - 2012-03-21 00:09:53 UTC
In terms of naming conventions on guns i honestly believe the best thing you can do is standarise the names of the meta modules.

I remember when i first started playing and getting extremely confused around the fact that prototype was good meta 4 for gear fr hybrids yet it was crappy meta 2 (i think) gear for projectiles.
Combine this with a separate 4 meta names for lasers as well and you've got over 12 different names that people need to learn and memorise across all the 3 main weapon systems.

Standardising this would make the lives of all new people a hell of a lot easier. I would argue the actually naming of the guns takes secondary importance to the meta names.

....

Obsidian Hawk
RONA Midgard Academy
RONA Directorate
#54 - 2012-03-21 04:20:17 UTC
One thing people should try to remember, by changing some of the names, -- CCP is making it easier to translate their game into other languages, more languages means more subs, more subs mean more targets.


ANYWAY i digress.

I dong like gattling, on somethings. Quads seem pretty intuitive as is.

Why Can't I have a picture signature.

Also please support graphical immersion, bring back the art that brought people to EvE online originaly.

Nova Fox
Novafox Shipyards
#55 - 2012-03-21 05:13:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Nova Fox
May I suggest Strobe over Gatling.

Gatling sounds like projectile stuff but Strobe is something you can only apply to a laser.

Unfourtunately This would almost call into the question about the laser turret models matching names.

Dust 514's CPM 1 Iron Wolf Saber Eve mail me about Dust 514 issues.

DarkAegix
Acetech Systems
#56 - 2012-03-21 06:50:15 UTC
Nova Fox wrote:
May I suggest Strobe over Gatling.

This springs to mind: http://bigamarrianraveparty.ytmnd.com/
Alavaria Fera
Imperial Shipment
#57 - 2012-03-21 07:11:34 UTC  |  Edited by: Alavaria Fera
Mona X wrote:
Don't forget to change Heavy Missile Lauchers into Medium Missile Lauchers, otherwise your homogenization will fail, and poor noobies will have to think or something.

So standard missile launchers would be light missile launchers? There are alread light missiles, uh..

And rockets would be hahaha missile launchers.

The current laser names though could get confusing unless you had some sense when buying and looked at the categories (or slot size if it was in inventory).

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Spc One
The Chodak
Void Alliance
#58 - 2012-03-21 11:42:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Spc One
Again you're trying to change something that isn't broken.
Current names are ok.

If you change names it will be very difficult for me as an old player to find what i am looking for in lasers.
Mega Pulse Laser II sound very good for me and please don't change it.

I don't see any reason but still you changed the name of invulnerability field to adaptive invulnerability field.

Why ? why adaptive ? just to confuse us with something that's not important.


"Heavy becomes Solid-State Medium"
Now that is very confusing.
Malamber
Venomous Cloud
Scorned Syndicate
#59 - 2012-03-21 16:30:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Malamber
Spc One wrote:
Again you're trying to change something that isn't broken.
Current names are ok.

If you change names it will be very difficult for me as an old player to find what i am looking for in lasers.
Mega Pulse Laser II sound very good for me and please don't change it.

I don't see any reason but still you changed the name of invulnerability field to adaptive invulnerability field.

Why ? why adaptive ? just to confuse us with something that's not important.


"Heavy becomes Solid-State Medium"
Now that is very confusing.

I think the "adaptive" part is superfluous - both it, and "invulnerability" both infer what they were trying to get across: this module protects against various damage types.

For the rest of your post... I disagree that the names are ok. At the very least they need to change the SIZE of the lasers to reflect the fitting size.
Falin Whalen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#60 - 2012-03-21 20:53:39 UTC
I'm in favor of the wattage as caliber idea, as put forth previously W < kW < MW < GW = Small < Medium < Large < Capitol sized lasers, also breaking it down into number of Watts also gives some idea as to the hitting power. (larger number means more damage being dealt) [wattage][meta name][size][type] is a pretty straight forward naming schema, without much room for confusion.

Examples:

Small
Dual Modulated Light Energy Beam I becomes 400 W Modulated Light Energy Beam Laser I
Medium Modulated Energy Beam I becomes 600 W Modulated Light Energy Beam Laser I
Medium Modal Pulse Laser I becomes 550 W Modal Light Pulse Laser I

Medium
Quad Anode Light Particle Stream I becomes Quad 150 kW Anode Medium Beam Laser
Heavy Modulated Energy Beam I becomes 550 kW Modulated Medium Beam Laser
Heavy Afocal Pulse Maser I becomes 500 kW Afocal Medium Pulse Maser

Large
Dual Heavy Beam Laser II becomes 150 MW Heavy Beam Laser II
Mega Modulated Beam Laser I becomes 250 MW Modulated Heavy Beam Laser I
Dual Heavy Afocal Pulse Maser I becomes 200 MW Afocal Heavy Pulse Maser I

This also makes Capital guns fall into the Gigawatt range IE Giga Beam laser and Giga pulse laser.

Please rethink naming any Beam laser "Gatling", it will just confuse everybody. When I think of something named Gatling, I think of a weapon with a high rate of fire, like a pulse laser, which Beams do not have.

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka