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Intaki counter-offensive successful

Author
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#21 - 2012-02-25 01:38:34 UTC
Thank you Captain Eionell for your detailed and emotional reply, just a few things I'd like to ask though.

Sakaane Eionell wrote:
Isn't it? Tell me, Mr Marellus, how exactly do you expect the Intaki Assembly to generate its own, proper security force in Intaki, or anywhere else in Placid, when the Federation has a choke hold on station grants in this area?


Apologies for cutting the rest of the quote short, but surely your frustration at the situation should lie in this case with your ancestors who were short sighted enough to not request this in their agreement when they joined the Federation along with the other demands they had for self determination?

I can understand it might feel humiliating to have to make such a request to an overall governing body but surely that's nothing to hold over them with contempt? You are no different to any other entity within the Federation who would have to go through the same process.

Quote:
Funny how the Intaki Assembly only denied the Federation Navy access to the Intaki system itself, yet so much more of Placid is vacant of proper policing and thus remains low security space by CONCORD standards. What is the navy's excuse for this? They are stretched thin? Please.


I think I touched on this earlier, and offered examples across all the Empires. This is much like your compatriot's "Oh please, that old chestnut" reply to the comments regarding the Federation's agreement with the Intaki in the first place. Just because you don't like a fact, no matter how long it's been around, doesn't make it any less true. Personally as I'm sure I've said before I would love to see more resources across all Empires dedicated to improving the security in these systems, it'd be better spent than shooting the hell out of each other for no gain.

Quote:
How much bureaucratic red tape is actually thrown up in order to deny the Assembly the approvals they would need in order to do the job the Federation agreed to allow the Assembly to undertake? I'd be willing to bet the Federation would say something akin to From our cold, dead hands before releasing any existing station rights or allowing any additional ones in Intaki, or anywhere else for that matter. To do so would actually allow the Assembly to get its foot in the door and be one step closer to becoming truly autonomous, and thus independent, from the "great" Gallente nation.


I'm not going to delve into the realm of supposition and hyperbole here, quite frankly without actually going ahead and doing it the answer is pretty clear, I don't know and you don't know. Short of being someone in a position to give an answer (who probably also doesn't know because they haven't had an application to actually mull over) I don't think anyone can give you a factual answer on this. Playing guessing games won't help anyone.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.

Herzog Wolfhammer
Sigma Special Tactics Group
#22 - 2012-02-25 06:27:02 UTC
Silas Vitalia wrote:
I'm sure the Intaki people are.. most excited to be under Federation control again.





If my cousin Zeke is drinking that stuff he makes from boiled lorenz fluid and rotten grain he and anybody who drinks with him probably didn't notice.

Bring back DEEEEP Space!

Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#23 - 2012-02-25 10:43:39 UTC
Caellach Marellus wrote:
All Empires are overstretched with regards to effective policing against criminals. Placid is merely the Federal equivalent of Molden Heath, Bleak Lands or Black Rise. It's the unfortunate downside to rapid growth, and something every Empire should focus on trying to improve.


Black Rise is an extremely freshly settled region, and by settled we're talking corporate enclaves, arcologies or purpose-built colonies, and not by any means a 'native population'.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#24 - 2012-02-25 12:08:42 UTC
Desiderya wrote:
Caellach Marellus wrote:
All Empires are overstretched with regards to effective policing against criminals. Placid is merely the Federal equivalent of Molden Heath, Bleak Lands or Black Rise. It's the unfortunate downside to rapid growth, and something every Empire should focus on trying to improve.


Black Rise is an extremely freshly settled region, and by settled we're talking corporate enclaves, arcologies or purpose-built colonies, and not by any means a 'native population'.


My apologies for being a little confused, but what does this have to do with his point ?
Jon Engel
Machete Carbide
#25 - 2012-03-06 00:16:06 UTC
So maybe someday the Caldari State will actually win something next time they conquer Intaki?

So maybe someday the Gallente Federation will actually win something next time they liberate Intaki?
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#26 - 2012-03-06 10:08:42 UTC
Lyn Farel wrote:


My apologies for being a little confused, but what does this have to do with his point ?


I do not see what there is to misunderstand? Black Rise is not equivalent to Placid. We're not talking about a sizeable native population - civilists - that are suffering under neglect from the responsible authorities in these systems.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Astera Zandraki
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#27 - 2012-03-06 11:28:22 UTC
Neglect? I'm amused by how often people paint we Intake as victims, as the oppressed. My ancestors chose to take charge of their own policing matters. This isn't neglect, this was our choice.

The State's objectives have been fulfilled, you have Caldari Prime, fine, keep it but do not claim to represent systems or peoples who are quite capable of making their own decisions. I, along with most other Intake have voted with my feet, choosing Federal democracy over Provist dictatorship.
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#28 - 2012-03-06 17:47:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Desiderya
You can quit yapping, I have merely picked up the argumentation of my predecessor to illustrate the point I was trying to make to Ms. Farel.

Besides, the militia war started after an agreement about the surrender of Caldari Prime to the State was brokered. Not everyone seemed to be content with that solution - on both sides, I might add - and now we have our pointless region wide skirmish. You have hardly voted with your feet against 'Provist Oppression', but feel free to nurture your disdain, I'm sure it'll help you along splendidly.
Oh, and while we're at it: claiming to be part of 'the majority' is always a good way to enforce your point, especially as a capsuleer, who are known to be one with the people.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Astera Zandraki
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2012-03-06 18:49:18 UTC
Fisrtly, I would appreciate it if you did not misquote me. I said 'Provist dictatorship' not 'Provist Oppression'.
Secondly, The vast majority of ethnic Intake live in the Federation.
Thirdly, ad Hominen attacks do not become you.
Lyn Farel
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#30 - 2012-03-06 19:15:22 UTC
Desiderya wrote:
Lyn Farel wrote:


My apologies for being a little confused, but what does this have to do with his point ?


I do not see what there is to misunderstand? Black Rise is not equivalent to Placid. We're not talking about a sizeable native population - civilists - that are suffering under neglect from the responsible authorities in these systems.


Yes, this is why I have difficulties to understand why you refer to the difference in terms of native population while Mr Marellus was refering to policing against criminals...
Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#31 - 2012-03-06 20:21:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Desiderya
Astera Zandraki wrote:
Fisrtly, I would appreciate it if you did not misquote me. I said 'Provist dictatorship' not 'Provist Oppression'.
Secondly, The vast majority of ethnic Intake live in the Federation.
Thirdly, ad Hominen attacks do not become you.


The difference in the first point is, especially from your point of view, probably extremely superficial and generally speaking rather unimportant. But for your peace of mind, I hereby apologize deeply for implying disdain of a provist leadership.

Indeed, the vast majority of Intaki does live in the federation. I must have missed the memo where you were appointed their spokesperson.
Lastly, don't insult yourself about being the target of an ad hominem argument. Neither did I insult you, nor did I use such a hypothetical insult to infer that the point you're raising is moot. I was, however, implying that claiming that oneself is speaking for the people, or the majority is a messy business.




Lyn Farel wrote:

Yes, this is why I have difficulties to understand why you refer to the difference in terms of native population while Mr Marellus was refering to policing against criminals...

There's a difference if criminals are threatening local civil life or cash flow coming from frontier installations. Increasing the security levels of Placid would benefit a substantial amount of people, whereas there's hardly someone in Black Rise who'd benefit from a similar undertaking. Apparently the megacorporations with a presence in the frontier systems have already found their equilibrium between security spendings and losses to local piracy.

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Desiderya
Blue Canary
Watch This
#32 - 2012-03-06 20:22:03 UTC
----

Ruthlessness is the kindness of the wise.

Andreus Ixiris
Duty.
Stay Feral
#33 - 2012-03-06 21:18:22 UTC
This is a rather hilarious example of Provist desperation - attempting to capture one Federal system deep behind enemy lines while while close to two dozen of their own have fallen, and failing even to hold it a week. Truly all spirit, honour and dignity left the Caldari Militia when Duty decided they'd had enough of lesser corporations leeching off their accomplishments and severed ties.

Andreus Ixiris > A Civire without a chin is barely a Civire at all.

Pieter Tuulinen > He'd be Civirely disadvantaged, Andreus.

Andreus Ixiris > ...

Andreus Ixiris > This is why we're at war.

Astera Zandraki
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2012-03-06 23:39:05 UTC
Desiderya wrote:

The difference in the first point is, especially from your point of view, probably extremely superficial and generally speaking rather unimportant. But for your peace of mind, I hereby apologize deeply for implying disdain of a provist leadership.


Doule dos Rouvenor III.
Newton Gingrich
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#35 - 2012-03-09 05:50:07 UTC
The Caldari know all too well the "benefits" of Gallentean rule. Despite the rhetoric of the culturally bankrupt FDU representative, the citizens of Intaki yearn for a new society. One governed by a uniquely Caldari ethos where hard work, patriotism and selflessness are the order of the day. Never forget this.
Aquila Shadow
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#36 - 2012-03-09 12:35:35 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
This is a rather hilarious example of Provist desperation - attempting to capture one Federal system deep behind enemy lines while while close to two dozen of their own have fallen, and failing even to hold it a week. Truly all spirit, honour and dignity left the Caldari Militia when Duty decided they'd had enough of lesser corporations leeching off their accomplishments and severed ties.


I would hardly call taking one of the more culturely importent systems in the federation it an act of desperation. Not only is Intaki the home system of one of the main cultures in the Federation but it has also been one of the main symbols of the whole war. Like you said the state didnt hold it for longer then a week but like you also said it is deep behind federation lines. To underestimate a foe is to hand them the keys to the fortress, the Federation should has learned this by now.

                                              "Let Vigilance Be Your Sword"

Sakuma Ogunuchi
#37 - 2012-03-10 14:14:51 UTC
Andreus Ixiris wrote:
This is a rather hilarious example of Provist desperation - attempting to capture one Federal system deep behind enemy lines while while close to two dozen of their own have fallen, and failing even to hold it a week. Truly all spirit, honour and dignity left the Caldari Militia when Duty decided they'd had enough of lesser corporations leeching off their accomplishments and severed ties.



If all members of the State Protectorate are Provists, and Duty. were in the State Protectorate, does that make you a Provist?
Caellach Marellus
Stormcrows
#38 - 2012-03-10 18:47:04 UTC
Newton Gingrich wrote:
The Caldari know all too well the "benefits" of Gallentean rule. Despite the rhetoric of the culturally bankrupt FDU representative, the citizens of Intaki yearn for a new society. One governed by a uniquely Caldari ethos where hard work, patriotism and selflessness are the order of the day. Never forget this.


I'm sure you've plenty of sources you can use to back your claims up, unlike every Caldari Patriot who claimed as much before you.

When your gut instincts tell you something is wrong, trust them. When your heart tells you something is right, ignore it, check with your brain first. Accept nothing, challenge everything.

Damar Rocarion
Nasranite Watch
#39 - 2012-03-11 16:21:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Damar Rocarion
In another desperate and superficial move, Caldari state occupied Deven solar system in Essence region. Then Caldari forces ran headlong and in panic to Intaki. And occupied that too. This was a follow-up to multiple superficial offensives where Caldari forces liberated systems in Black Rise from gallente jackboots.

Andre Ixiris was located to be in high-security system in Everyshore region, as benefits staunch defender of Intaki, but was unreachable for comment.

Carry on.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#40 - 2012-03-11 18:26:00 UTC
Damar Rocarion wrote:
In another desperate and superficial move, Caldari state occupied Deven solar system in Essence region. Then Caldari forces ran headlong and in panic to Intaki. And occupied that too. This was a follow-up to multiple superficial offensives where Caldari forces liberated systems in Black Rise from gallente jackboots.

Andre Ixiris was located to be in high-security system in Everyshore region, as benefits staunch defender of Intaki, but was unreachable for comment.

Carry on.


with the help of the small force the empress sent over to make sure her assistance in intaki was sucsessfull

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro

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