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Kinetic damage bonus vs mission recommended damage
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Lemok Sonji
Lethal Devotion
Escalation Theory
#1 - 2012-02-17 20:03:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Lemok Sonji
Simple question really.

I'm doing missions in minmatar space.
I don't get many recommended kinetic damage missions, and I'm flying a tengu, which has +25% to kinetic damage.

Is it worth switching damage types every mission, when kinetic bonus is pretty high?
So missions' info on eve-survival has average resists, so its easier to know.
Others don't have the info, so its a bit hard to know.

So just out of lazyness, is it worth switching ammo in a tengu? The difference per volly is 600 damage with T2 missiles.
stoicfaux
#2 - 2012-02-17 20:25:56 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
Use EM against EM weak NPCs (drones/BR/sansha, except for Elite Drone Parasites.) Use kinetic on everything else (and Elite Drone Parasites.)

Although, TBH, if you're lazy, you won't go to hell for using kinetic on EM weak NPCs.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Beef Knuckleback
Pawnstars INC
#3 - 2012-02-17 20:44:17 UTC
EM missiles will do more damage against EM-weak rats than the max kinetic bonus will - though aside from Rogue Drones and the occasional Worlds Collide (and faction missions if you do those) there aren't many EM missions in Minmatar space.

Kinetic is fine 99.9% of the rest of the time - if memory serves there's a total of two missions where you'll want to pack something else - the named rats in Vengeance. Carry some thermal missiles for the Serpentis version and maybe some explosive for the Angel version - both rats take a good long time to wear down with kinetic missiles, even fully bonused.

If memory serves, a tengu with a fully skilled offensive sub does slightly more damage against the vast majority of angel rats using Kinetic instead of Explosive. The difference is relatively marginal but it's enough to merit sticking with the bonused damage type.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#4 - 2012-02-17 21:35:08 UTC  |  Edited by: Batelle
in my experience and from what i've calculated, the correct damage type is much more important against elite frigs and cruisers than against other rats.

Also, because volley damage is relatively consistent, you can just see how much damage your volleys do with different kinds of missiles, so it should be easy to test out yourself. Just remember your results are per enemy ship type, not just by npc faction.

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Cathy Drall
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2012-02-17 22:34:56 UTC
stoicfaux wrote:
Use EM against EM weak NPCs (drones/BR/sansha, except for Elite Drone Parasites.) Use kinetic on everything else (and Elite Drone Parasites.)

Although, TBH, if you're lazy, you won't go to hell for using kinetic on EM weak NPCs.

It's what I do - and Stoicfaux isn't known for making things up ;-)
For drones/BR/sansha missions I use a megapulse Abbaddon, it's nice to have a little variety every now and then.
Katherine Starlight
Doomheim
#6 - 2012-02-17 22:53:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Katherine Starlight
If your ship packs kinetic missile bonus its only worth using EM missiles on Sansha and Kinetic for rest, all others are kind of evened out by the kinetic bonuses. Maybe on amarr to but i dont do anti empire mishs.
stoicfaux
#7 - 2012-02-18 02:32:21 UTC  |  Edited by: stoicfaux
Beef Knuckleback wrote:
If memory serves, a tengu with a fully skilled offensive sub does slightly more damage against the vast majority of angel rats using Kinetic instead of Explosive. The difference is relatively marginal but it's enough to merit sticking with the bonused damage type.


First column is the NPC.
2nd column is the Tengu's Effective Kinetic bonus. Meaning, instead of getting a full 125% damage bonus against an explosive weak target, the effective bonus might only be 111%.
3rd column is the Best damage type to use (i.e. the NPC's weakest EHP by dmg type)
4th column is the Tengu's Best damage type to use given the 125% kinetic damage bonus.

NPC Tengu Effective Kin Bonus Best Dmg Tengu Best Dmg
Angel Heavy Missile Battery 125% kin Tengu Kin
Angel Light Missile Battery 125% kin Tengu Kin
Angel Sentry Gun 125% kin Tengu Kin
Angel Viper 113% therm Tengu Kin
Angel Webifier 112% therm Tengu Kin
Arch Gistum Liquidator 96% expl Expl
Gist Commander 109% expl Tengu Kin
Gist General 108% expl Tengu Kin
Gist Saint 107% expl Tengu Kin
Gist Throne 106% expl Tengu Kin
Gist War General 108% expl Tengu Kin
Gist Warlord 107% expl Tengu Kin
Gistatis Praefectus 111% expl Tengu Kin
Gistatis Primus 111% expl Tengu Kin
Gistatis Tribuni 111% expl Tengu Kin
Gistatis Tribunus 111% expl Tengu Kin
Gistior Haunter 115% expl Tengu Kin
Gistior Seizer 115% expl Tengu Kin
Spider Drone II 121% expl Tengu Kin

The Tengu's Kinetic Bonus is generally being reduced from 125% to a 106% to 111% bonus against most Angel NPCs in AE.

Incidental:
Elite Angel frigates (Viper/Webifier) are weakest against therm, but the Tengu's kinetic bonus overcomes that.
Elite Angel cruisers (Arch Gistum ...) seem to have above average resists to the point that it is better for the Tengu to use explosive missiles. (However, the difference isn't big enough to justify switching ammo types.)


Quick and dirty Google Doc with EHP by damage type: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvCLlTV8bSxNdDBYdWpGcDlzVk9yeUFXQUFfc0lsNEE

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.
Lemok Sonji
Lethal Devotion
Escalation Theory
#8 - 2012-02-18 07:41:56 UTC
Cheers.

Thanks for all the information.
I guess I can't be that lazy P but at least its good to know the tengu bonus isn't a waste.