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Mindlink BPO/LP item desparately needs to be seeded
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Rakshasa Verr
010111010101110110111001
#1 - 2012-01-12 07:55:11 UTC
Like now.

Check out any of the graphs for the 4 useful mindlinks (all except info) The price has gotten out of control.
A year ago mindlinks were around 8-15m a pop, the mining one being a bit more of course but they were fairly priced in my opinion.

Mindlinks come from only one source, a specific level 4 storyline mission with a small chance to give a mindlink as a reward.
The evil Incarna expansion released lots of more level 4 storyline missions which has reduced the already small chance of getting a mindlink to extremely low levels. Thus the supply of mindlinks crashed making the price skyrocket. I have seen a mining mindlink go for 550m isk and most other mindlinks hovering at 90-110m, a price increase of around 10 times.

I do not think that CCP intended to make mindlinks as expensive as deadspace items when they released more storyline missions. Mindlinks have been reduced to off grid boosters in high sec instead of being put onto command ship/battlecruiser pod pilots that go off and die in glorious battle.

Now if I really had my way I'd also like a tech 1 mindlink with reduced effectiveness and less insane skill reqs, but that may be asking too much. Surely adding in 5 BPOs for mindlinks or an LP store item would be easy to implement and improve the game, right?
Lucinda Hamu
Doomheim
#2 - 2012-01-12 13:53:42 UTC
You state that it would improve the game. Why would it? What benefit would it have other than to make it more affordable to you?
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#3 - 2012-01-12 14:21:39 UTC
To expand - why do you have this massive sense of entitlement that you should get these really quite advantageous implants at rock bottom prices? If so: X-type mods for everyone! (Yes, I know there are huge differences in obtaining mindlinks and X-types, but the point remains.)

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2012-01-12 14:24:13 UTC
I consider 100m a fair price for a mindlink. You only really need a couple even for a full fleet. I'd start getting worried when they compare to pirate implants in price.

On the other hand, a cheaper, weaker, TI mindlink would be a nice addition to small gangs when you want to keep things expendable.
Salcon Cliff
Zephyr Corp
#5 - 2012-01-12 15:30:49 UTC
I dunno, I kind of like the price increase. I had several mining foreman mindlinks from 'back in the day' (alas, they were cheap enough that I gave some away, even...) and am debating whether to sell them or not :). I also have gotten the 'shipyard theft' storyline once recently - run a bunch of level 4 distribution missions from the agents in Bei/Uttindar. You will need a blockade runner, though, and not mind dodging the campers in low-sec.
Zifrian
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2012-01-12 15:39:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Zifrian
Bumblefck wrote:
To expand - why do you have this massive sense of entitlement that you should get these really quite advantageous implants at rock bottom prices? If so: X-type mods for everyone! (Yes, I know there are huge differences in obtaining mindlinks and X-types, but the point remains.)

You are trolling, but I'll bite because people might not notice.

Why? The OP already pointed out why. Because the current prices are a secondary result of changing storyline missions, not a specific change to mindlinks the increase the price, which has been reasonably priced in the past. If CCP wants to change the status quo, fine. However, its highly unlikely they do since they usually announce such changes (PI.is a good example) and as the OP stated well, the status quo should be restored.

But I'm sure you think we should 'cry more' right? (P.S. I already have several mindlinks)

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astara989
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2012-01-12 16:15:21 UTC
550mill wont take long to pay for itself with the extra ore you mine.
Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#8 - 2012-01-13 19:31:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Bumblefck
Zifrian wrote:
Bumblefck wrote:
To expand - why do you have this massive sense of entitlement that you should get these really quite advantageous implants at rock bottom prices? If so: X-type mods for everyone! (Yes, I know there are huge differences in obtaining mindlinks and X-types, but the point remains.)

You are trolling, but I'll bite because people might not notice.

Why? The OP already pointed out why. Because the current prices are a secondary result of changing storyline missions, not a specific change to mindlinks the increase the price, which has been reasonably priced in the past. If CCP wants to change the status quo, fine. However, its highly unlikely they do since they usually announce such changes (PI.is a good example) and as the OP stated well, the status quo should be restored.

But I'm sure you think we should 'cry more' right? (P.S. I already have several mindlinks)



Did they announce the change to loot tables that caused Y-T8 MWDs and all the rest to plummet in price?


Again...you're basically restating what the OP has said - that they are upset that the drop rate has effectively been nerfed, and that the price has risen as a result.

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Zifrian
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2012-01-13 21:55:16 UTC
Bumblefck wrote:


Did they announce the change to loot tables that caused Y-T8 MWDs and all the rest to plummet in price?


Again...you're basically restating what the OP has said - that they are upset that the drop rate has effectively been nerfed, and that the price has risen as a result.

So what is your argument? You think they wanted to do this or they didn't, but it's awesome because you like it?

The first requires proof. The second isn't relevant to the OP.

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Bumblefck
Kerensky Initiatives
#10 - 2012-01-14 13:52:51 UTC
No, I'm indifferent about it - all I'm saying is "So what if CCP nerfed the effective drop rate of these Mindlinks?" Does that really give anyone cause to complain about them (without appearing as if they are whining)?

By this logic, therefore, should we not all start complaining about how pricey Estamel's Invulns. are because the drop rate is particularly low?

Perfection is a dish best served like wasabi .

Bumble's Space Log
Rakshasa Verr
010111010101110110111001
#11 - 2012-01-15 07:51:17 UTC
Lucinda Hamu wrote:
You state that it would improve the game. Why would it? What benefit would it have other than to make it more affordable to you?


Another item to manufacture instead of being left to the almighty level 4 mission runner luck system. A mindlink is a staple part of a gang focused BC/CS. They released T2 warfare links and they don't cost 100m a pop. Was releasing those bad for the game? I'll give you another example, stealth bomber bombs used to cost something ridiculous like 20m a piece, which made using bombers rather dumb so CCP changed it. Cheaper bombs has made them more useful and many interesting battles have taken place all for the improvement of EVE.

I fail to see how this makes mindlinks more affordable to me, it makes them more affordable to everyone. I have no problem with making pirate mindlinks and charging whatever for them but a staple T2 item for 100m? And I've gotten quite rich over selling my mindlinks for 100m a pop when I bought em for 8m tyvm.

Bumblefck wrote:
Cry more, deprived minebear


I do not mine and I am not crying, I got rich over this change. I will answer your other attack: why should the item be cheap. Answer is because it is a tech 2 mod and a critical part to flying a BC/CS with a warfare link. What other part of a T2 BC/CS fit is 100m? I kinda answered this more above but really I just hate to see things go stagnant and unused in EVE. I like things to be used by everyone to their fullest potential and get destroyed and remade till the end of EVE. A few hangar decoration ships/items are fine but an item that is critical to the role bonus of BCs?

The skill reqs alone on a warfare link is enough to rarely see them. I'd rather have BCs be used to great effect in small-medium well organized gangs, not mainly used for an off grid pilot giving bonuses to high sec fleets.
Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#12 - 2012-01-15 18:07:23 UTC
The issues are (why the prices have gone up):

- Less people grinding L4s, more people grinding incursions (or other income sources)
- More storyline missions were added, which drove down how often that particular mission shows up

Personally, I would not mind seeing implants or BPCs to produce those implants added to the loot tables of exploration sites (magnet / radar). Seems like either magnet or radar sites are constantly being brought up as "lacking" in rewards.

A second source for items is always a good thing, especially if it is a luck-based system.
Clementina
University of Caille
#13 - 2012-01-15 21:00:04 UTC
Quick Question, Are any implants manufacturable by players at this time?
Zifrian
Federal Defense Union
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-01-15 21:09:08 UTC
Clementina wrote:
Quick Question, Are any implants manufacturable by players at this time?

Newp

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Scrapyard Bob
EVE University
Ivy League
#15 - 2012-01-15 21:51:54 UTC
Clementina wrote:
Quick Question, Are any implants manufacturable by players at this time?


It's been kicked around by the devs off and on over the years, but nothing seems to have ever come of it.

I could see it using some combination of a bit of moon goo, a bit of minerals, some salvage and some of the lesser-used PI goods.
Clementina
University of Caille
#16 - 2012-01-15 23:08:59 UTC
I think we've found the problem then. CCP needs to come up with a way for players to manufacture implants (All of them, not just mindlinks). Let our industrialists have some fun.
Praia
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#17 - 2012-02-04 19:48:06 UTC  |  Edited by: Praia
Seed them in the LP stores its the best option, i think, and then decide if it will be a expensive item or cheap one.
The other implants are already there.
Celgar Thurn
Department 10
#18 - 2012-02-05 11:43:37 UTC
Clementina wrote:
I think we've found the problem then. CCP needs to come up with a way for players to manufacture implants (All of them, not just mindlinks). Let our industrialists have some fun.


As far as production of implants & clones there will opportunities for us industrialists to manufacture those types of items for Dust 514 mercs. At least one line in that type of item has been added to EVE already although it cannot be produced yet.

As to the OP's original question I disagree and believe the status quo should remain as it is. I have never made any ISK personally from selling on mindlinks - infact I paid 395 mil ISK not long ago for the mining mindlink for another char. Too many high value equipment is too easy to acquire nowadays. Without any challenge within the game there is no point and we don't want everything as cheap as chips! With the current lovely high sec mineral prices you can easily make fifty million ISK in a few hours - just save up and go buy your chosen mindlink/s. Cool
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#19 - 2012-02-05 22:11:29 UTC
Rakshasa Verr wrote:
Like now.

Check out any of the graphs for the 4 useful mindlinks (all except info) The price has gotten out of control.
A year ago mindlinks were around 8-15m a pop, the mining one being a bit more of course but they were fairly priced in my opinion.

Mindlinks come from only one source, a specific level 4 storyline mission with a small chance to give a mindlink as a reward.
The evil Incarna expansion released lots of more level 4 storyline missions which has reduced the already small chance of getting a mindlink to extremely low levels. Thus the supply of mindlinks crashed making the price skyrocket. I have seen a mining mindlink go for 550m isk and most other mindlinks hovering at 90-110m, a price increase of around 10 times.

I do not think that CCP intended to make mindlinks as expensive as deadspace items when they released more storyline missions. Mindlinks have been reduced to off grid boosters in high sec instead of being put onto command ship/battlecruiser pod pilots that go off and die in glorious battle.

Now if I really had my way I'd also like a tech 1 mindlink with reduced effectiveness and less insane skill reqs, but that may be asking too much. Surely adding in 5 BPOs for mindlinks or an LP store item would be easy to implement and improve the game, right?


Why should mindlinks be cheaper than an average +5% hardwiring?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Rakshasa Verr
010111010101110110111001
#20 - 2012-02-06 04:03:19 UTC
Malcanis wrote:


Why should mindlinks be cheaper than an average +5% hardwiring?


I feel like you haven't read the thread at all because I already answered this but I will go through it once again. Mindlinks take about 50-60 days more training than a 5% hardwiring and are T2 items that are essential to a specific ship module, gang warfare links. Mindlinks were not broken when they were much cheaper and the dramatic price increase was not intentional, it was a byproduct of the level 4 storyline mission change. Mindlinks also promote specialized groups and teammwork while your standard 5% hardwiring does not.


Mindlinks would fit into the LP store perfectly at the 3% hardwiring or +4 implant category price levels.
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