These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Jita Park Speakers Corner

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

CSM7 and the average player

Author
Galendil
THORN Syndicate
Northern Coalition.
#1 - 2012-01-27 16:59:24 UTC
As the CSM election approaches here are my thoughts. I feel I am not that far from the mainstream of average EVE players so maybe you agree with this, maybe you do not.

It helps when reading to understand that I started 2011 as a carebear with dreams of nullsec and ended up the year in nullsec to the expense of almost all other EVE pursuits.


  1. My corpmates may disagree but I loved watching Mittens and the other nullsec alliances win the metagame (again) by overwhelmingly stuffing the ballot boxes. I mean the metagame is one reason I joined EVE in the first place.

  2. I think, all in all this was a big WIN for the player base. TheMittani's megalomania knows very few bounds but he does, in fact, know the politics of working with a real software corporation and getting value in the product he is paying for.

  3. I do have some reservations and no idea how to fix them such as:


As a null-sec player now, I have a hard time making ISK since I am shooting people all the time. I do not live in SOV, I live in NPC null so the prospects of running plex's, mining, trading etc are all fraught with danger as my alliance is just not big enough, yet, to make our little corner of space safe. So when I do run plex's or whatever, I normally do so at a loss. I could probably join some SOV alliance but I am old and have kids and a life so I do other things.

Null-sec alliances griefing my ISK faucet, one that barely drips ISK as it is, makes it hard for me to keep playing. First it was my high-sec ICE mining being interdicted by Goons, then it was my high-sec Incursion running being interdicted by Darius. I guess I could go back to lvl 4 missioning but jeesh, "its hard out here for a pimp"

I get why, they hate carebears and what they stand for. But as Jester/Ripard Teg writes,
Quote:
It's tempting, for instance, to rack this up as yet another veteran EVE player interdiction of new-player resources, except obviously with incursions it's nowhere near that simple since a lot of PvP vets like myself also participate in them.
I am NOT in favor of consensual only PVP, yuck, EVE needs to be dangerous. I just need a little more wiggle room.

So, do I still want CSM7 to resemble CSM6 or CSM5? I am 60/40 in favor of it staying almost just like it is now. I think we overwhelmingly got a good deal with the changes they made but I sure miss making money. (I suppose I could try any number of other scams, private courier service is starting to appeal to me as I approach jump freighter readiness. On the otherhand, jump freighters cost a bundle.)

So maybe, balance in the CSM is what I need. Keep Mittens at the helm but rein him in just a tad with a couple of more carebear politicians with humongous egos and large IQs and legal skillz. Now where do I find one of those?

--- | --- Flammis Acribus Addictis --- | ---

Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2 - 2012-01-27 18:31:22 UTC
Galendil wrote:
a tad with a couple of more carebear politicians with humongous egos and large IQs and legal skillz. Now where do I find one of those?

There are plenty of them right here on this very board!

There's even one I just saw running specifically on a promise to counter goon influence. Of course they did not state any actual positions, so perhaps you may wish to confirm for yourself that they are indeed genuine.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

Galendil
THORN Syndicate
Northern Coalition.
#3 - 2012-01-27 18:37:37 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Galendil wrote:
a tad with a couple of more carebear politicians with humongous egos and large IQs and legal skillz. Now where do I find one of those?

There are plenty of them right here on this very board!

There's even one I just saw running specifically on a promise to counter goon influence. Of course they did not state any actual positions, so perhaps you may wish to confirm for yourself that they are indeed genuine.


I agree, there are a few. I just need to be certain that they are not always going to work on nerfing null or adding crazy ideas like consensual PVP. I like Malcanis but he doesn't want the job.

--- | --- Flammis Acribus Addictis --- | ---

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#4 - 2012-01-27 19:52:47 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Galendil wrote:
a tad with a couple of more carebear politicians with humongous egos and large IQs and legal skillz. Now where do I find one of those?

There are plenty of them right here on this very board!

There's even one I just saw running specifically on a promise to counter goon influence. Of course they did not state any actual positions, so perhaps you may wish to confirm for yourself that they are indeed genuine.


The Voice of Reason candidates would indirectly counter goon influence.

I can't say much about ego size (looking for my egonomitor to start measuring them) but I expect our candidates will have high IQs and some political savy, and maybe some legal skills.

I'm the first of the party's candidates, I hope we will have more join and by the time you can vote that the best of the "high sec" candidates will be on our party's slate.

And I can say we will NOT focus on nerfing null or changing the concept of risk/reward that makes Eve such a great game. We will be trying to make sure that the aspects of Eve outside direct ship PvP experience get some attention from CCP as well. Eve has a whole range of PvP that has been ignored, these battles are fought in the markets, in the fight over resources like mission and PvE, even mining is PvP (ask anyone that has planned a mining op and found all the belts picked clean).

So watch the Voice of Reason party this election and see if we can't find the care bear mittens for CSM 7!

Issler Dainze
Voice of Reason Party CSM 7 Candidate
Shobon Welp
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
#5 - 2012-01-27 22:35:11 UTC
Never trust anyone who describes themselves as the 'Voice Of Reason' - its generally a sign of batshit insanity cloaked in nursery school-level populism
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#6 - 2012-01-27 23:36:23 UTC
Shobon Welp wrote:
Never trust anyone who describes themselves as the 'Voice Of Reason' - its generally a sign of batshit insanity cloaked in nursery school-level populism

Suddenly, I understand the purpose of this thread. To get someone elected who will not actually represent my interests.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?

gfldex
#7 - 2012-01-28 07:53:12 UTC
Galendil wrote:

As a null-sec player now, I have a hard time making ISK since I am shooting people all the time. I do not live in SOV, I live in NPC null so the prospects of running plex's, mining, trading etc are all fraught with danger as my alliance is just not big enough, yet, to make our little corner of space safe. So when I do run plex's or whatever, I normally do so at a loss. I could probably join some SOV alliance but I am old and have kids and a life so I do other things.

Null-sec alliances griefing my ISK faucet, one that barely drips ISK as it is, makes it hard for me to keep playing. First it was my high-sec ICE mining being interdicted by Goons, then it was my high-sec Incursion running being interdicted by Darius. I guess I could go back to lvl 4 missioning but jeesh, "its hard out here for a pimp"


Do I understand you correctly that you are not doing very well in game for whatever reason. You could change your game play to counter your problems but you want to have the rules changed instead? In any competitive game the average player is not doing very well. Getting the rules changed will not help you. The best you could achieve is to get the goods your farm (ISK in your case) to drop in value because supply goes up while demand stays the same.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.

Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#8 - 2012-01-28 08:27:16 UTC
Shobon Welp wrote:
Never trust anyone who describes themselves as the 'Voice Of Reason' - its generally a sign of batshit insanity cloaked in nursery school-level populism


Could you provide some evidence to support your claim? I am certainly not any of the things you claim about me.

So as many say "prove it or STFU!"

Issler
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#9 - 2012-01-28 09:17:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Malcanis
Galendil wrote:
Alavaria Fera wrote:
Galendil wrote:
a tad with a couple of more carebear politicians with humongous egos and large IQs and legal skillz. Now where do I find one of those?

There are plenty of them right here on this very board!

There's even one I just saw running specifically on a promise to counter goon influence. Of course they did not state any actual positions, so perhaps you may wish to confirm for yourself that they are indeed genuine.


I agree, there are a few. I just need to be certain that they are not always going to work on nerfing null or adding crazy ideas like consensual PVP. I like Malcanis but he doesn't want the job.



Yes it's hard to understand, what with all the gratitude and informed, reasoned analysis of ones actions that the CSMs receive as their reward for all that unpaid time they invest Roll

Not to mention the careful way people distinguish between their actions as CSM and their actions as EVE players, that's a big incentive too. Oh and the meticulously ethical way in which people on these forums refrain from outright making stuff up about the CSM, I mustn't forget that.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Shobon Welp
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
#10 - 2012-01-28 09:34:50 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Shobon Welp wrote:
Never trust anyone who describes themselves as the 'Voice Of Reason' - its generally a sign of batshit insanity cloaked in nursery school-level populism


Could you provide some evidence to support your claim? I am certainly not any of the things you claim about me.

So as many say "prove it or STFU!"

Issler


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Voice_of_Reason

gfldex
#11 - 2012-01-28 17:01:05 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Shobon Welp wrote:
Never trust anyone who describes themselves as the 'Voice Of Reason' - its generally a sign of batshit insanity cloaked in nursery school-level populism


Could you provide some evidence to support your claim? I am certainly not any of the things you claim about me.


It's called Argument from authority. Instead of providing evidence to back a claim, that you ironically demand yourself, you try to derive authority from an abstract concept. Something as the voice of reason is an abstract concept and therefore does not exists (or it would not have to be an abstract concept).

Folk that try to back their claims in such a way are better be ignored. Saves you a lot of face palming.

If you take all the sand out of the box, only the cat poo will remain.

Shobon Welp
GoonFleet
Band of Brothers
#12 - 2012-01-28 23:40:07 UTC
Basically calling yourself "The Voice Of Reason", or "Common Sense", or claiming to represent "The Silent Majority" or calling your country the "People's Democratic Republic of ____", is generally a sign that you're trying too hard to convince.
Galendil
THORN Syndicate
Northern Coalition.
#13 - 2012-01-29 07:37:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Galendil
such vitriol. jeesh.

I just want to make ISK in high sec while shooting people in null.

--- | --- Flammis Acribus Addictis --- | ---

Pavel Bidermann
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2012-01-30 03:37:28 UTC
Galendil wrote:
such viriol. jeesh.

I just want to make ISK in high sec while shooting people in null.


Well, I would say join a null sec alliance because a lot of them do make their money in high sec. Others Don't. However, if you want pew-pew you'll need to go to low sec. Null is a NAP fest.Not much for pew-pew there.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#15 - 2012-01-30 10:34:53 UTC
Pavel Bidermann wrote:
Galendil wrote:
such viriol. jeesh.

I just want to make ISK in high sec while shooting people in null.


Well, I would say join a null sec alliance because a lot of them do make their money in high sec. Others Don't. However, if you want pew-pew you'll need to go to low sec. Null is a NAP fest.Not much for pew-pew there.


I'd say that most of us in INIT. make ISK where the making is good and according to our skill and abilities. Some have market alts, some have mission alts, others do incursions, suicide ganking and there seem to be quite a few industrialists. Others make their ISK in nullsec by plexing, doing pirate missions and faction/officer rat hunting.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

War Kitten
Panda McLegion
#16 - 2012-02-02 12:29:41 UTC
Shobon Welp wrote:
Basically calling yourself "The Voice Of Reason", or "Common Sense", or claiming to represent "The Silent Majority" or calling your country the "People's Democratic Republic of ____", is generally a sign that you're trying too hard to convince.


This.

Try going with "Tea Party" instead. :)

I don't judge people by their race, religion, color, size, age, gender, or ethnicity. I judge them by their grammar, spelling, syntax, punctuation, clarity of expression, and logical consistency.