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Can Eve improve?

Author
Kipsley Caton
Blame The Bunny
#1 - 2017-07-21 13:04:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Kipsley Caton
I hope a Developer reads this. Problem with Eve is Ganking. New players get it and you can't move around sectors. People are there just to kill your ship for the score. This equals dull. So how to improve Eve?
Imagine this.....
You go into a battle and during the fighting your ship is taking more and more damage. It gets slower and slower the more badly damaged it gets. Your guns are going offline one by one. Your modules are degrading fast as is their effectiveness against your attacker. You lose.... But your ship does not explode. Instead (as a wreck) you are left to limp home to either repair what you can, or trash the thing and begin again. No one got "modules" from your corpse. No one got a "score" added. No one made millions of Isk. A fight was won and lost and you as the loser retire to lick your wounds and maybe come back again stronger. If you want isk you have to go earn it through mining or other isk related pursuits. No more ganking for isk. No more getting destroyed in nullsec just because you are a newbie.
X3 runs this way, but that game is not online like Eve. The ships "degrade" during battle, need repair, eventually need replacing. They can be detonated by the pilots but not actually destroyed by another. A fight is deemed as won when the losing ship is little more than a floating hulk and only just limps home. Fighting costs a lot of money, and bounties would actually mean something. Heck. You may not even need Concord anymore. As I said......

I hope a developer reads this.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#2 - 2017-07-21 13:08:53 UTC
As a ship builder, I disapprove of this post.

Mr Epeen Cool
Memphis Baas
#3 - 2017-07-21 13:49:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Memphis Baas
And as an MMO player, the scenario you've so emotionally described turns into the scenario of graveyard-zerging (which removes all skill from the fights), the need to train industry skills to be able to repair your own ship (crafting skills to be able to fix / patch your armor), and the cold calculation of what's most profitable to do and what actions are easiest to win the fight.

You misunderstand EVE.

EVE is not a dogfighting game, where you valiantly fly your ship through various missions that are custom-crafted to let you win, if barely. EVE is a strategy game, build a fleet composed of various units, and conquer the map with that fleet. The units in a strategy game don't have choreographed fight scenes, they meet and they win or die rather instantly, based on which unit is supposed to be the nemesis of which unit. Cavalry vs. infantry vs. archers. Or the spaceship equivalent.

Your proposal is similar to trying to add heroic combat moves and spells to pawns, bishops, rooks, and knights in a chess game. It's certainly possible to fully Dungeons-and-Dragons the chess pieces, or Magic-the-Gathering, and it's probably tons of fun, too, but then it's no longer a chess game. It's no longer a strategy game; the outcome of a "fight" between chess pieces is no longer instantly determined by the standard rules of chess.

We like the strategy aspects of EVE.

And, if we feel like space opera dogfighting combat, there are other games out there that do it much better than EVE ever could, including your X series, and perhaps Valkyrie and others.

EDIT: If you're not talking about extra abilities, but just strictly having your ship degrade during the fight, and just replacing the explosion and the instant trip home when you're podded with a slow crawl home in a badly-damaged wreck, well, I tell you what, get into a freighter, and try to travel from Jita to Dodixie, see how you like that. I'd rather explode and reappear and be able to jump into a new ship right away, than be forced to spend 5 ******* hours slow-boating home.
Chico Isagar
Laughing Jackass
#4 - 2017-07-21 14:09:09 UTC
As a random who didn't read your post past the "I'm a bear, listen to me cry" bit, go back to WoW.
LulKlz Duster
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#5 - 2017-07-21 14:14:09 UTC
It took awhile to become accustomed to the way of Null Sec but I did and noobs can do the same. Null is not meant for Solo play,besides (exploration. This is coming from a mining carebear FYI.
Tyekanis
Pod Test Dummies
Virtus Crusade Protectorate
#6 - 2017-07-21 14:49:20 UTC
The problem is not ganking, but rather people´s reaction to said ganking.

No game prepares you better for life than EVE.. you are quick to realize life is hard, cold and wet.. and then you die.

That is not to say EVE doesn´t have problems with semi-pvp, like HS bumping - which in essence is PVP people can´t respond to. At least not without either wardeccing - which takes 24 hours at least or suicide ganking the suicide gankers.. which I´m sure makes the dark god of the internets laugh with glee.

But in general EVE is in a good place for PvP, and has been so for ages.
Spookyjay
Brain Farmers Inc
#7 - 2017-07-21 14:52:42 UTC
CCP need to address these things to turn EVE around:

- Fozzy sov.
- Structure Spam.
- The Super capital cold war that is basically the pre WW1 dreadnaught Arms race. The large super capital fleets stop a lot of fights from ever happening. A reason they have to actually field them needs putting in.
- War spam and Harassment wars/Ganker wars. (it's not a war its just a 1 sided excuse for greifing and is not good pvp content).
- The now limited number of used ships. (something like 70% of ships in eve see less than 5% use at a educated guess).
- AFK cloaking. Must be dealt with. Its a huge problem for the game. It's literally a tactical bullying of active players by non-active players. Cloaking it'self is fine. but the ability to basically harass people who are online while you are not is fundamentally detrimental to the health of the game. There is 0 risk to being cloaked in another alliances sov while the potential for huge rewards for you and your friends come out of it. I have done it. I know its wrong and bad for the game. It stops people playing. Anything that attacks the core of being able to log in and play the game is not right. Afk cloaking should be counter able by a sov dependant structure that declaoks campers at random 10-20 min intervals. It's the only fair solution. It means you have to be actually playing the game to do it while leaving its core mechanics intact. Basically if you want to do area denial warfare you have to be actually doing it.



Spookyjay
Brain Farmers Inc
#8 - 2017-07-21 14:55:55 UTC
Tyekanis wrote:
The problem is not ganking, but rather people´s reaction to said ganking.

No game prepares you better for life than EVE.. you are quick to realize life is hard, cold and wet.. and then you die.

That is not to say EVE doesn´t have problems with semi-pvp, like HS bumping - which in essence is PVP people can´t respond to. At least not without either wardeccing - which takes 24 hours at least or suicide ganking the suicide gankers.. which I´m sure makes the dark god of the internets laugh with glee.

But in general EVE is in a good place for PvP, and has been so for ages.


no EVE is a terrible place for pvp. PVP has become worse and worse in EVE.
Good PVP is brawly and requires making decisions and fighting. You know Actual skills.. EVE has become less about good pvp and more about ganking and the reputation ganking gives you. Its like the equivillent of high school bullying and saying it's better than Boxing or wrestling or and other legitimate sport.
Gregorius Goldstein
Queens of the Drone Age
#9 - 2017-07-21 15:36:15 UTC
Fake News! You didn't get ganked once with that pilot. Ganking is when they blow you up in higsec without a wardec.

Your mobil tracktor unit got blown up.. happens. You got blown up mining in Nullsec while still in an NPC corp, works very much like intended. You lost cheap and badly fitted ships in lowsec, that will get better when you join a corp and bring your own freinds.

HighSec is a huge zone that pretty much has a standart MMO PVE gamestyle, if you don't haul billions around or fall for yellow blinking suspects you are prette much save. The rest of EVE is eat or get eaten, the only reason the game is still around.


Kipsley Caton wrote:
I hope a Developer reads this. Problem with Eve is Ganking. New players get it and you can't move around sectors. People are there just to kill your ship for the score. This equals dull. So how to improve Eve?
Imagine this.....
You go into a battle and during the fighting your ship is taking more and more damage. It gets slower and slower the more badly damaged it gets. Your guns are going offline one by one. Your modules are degrading fast as is their effectiveness against your attacker. You lose.... But your ship does not explode. Instead (as a wreck) you are left to limp home to either repair what you can, or trash the thing and begin again. No one got "modules" from your corpse. No one got a "score" added. No one made millions of Isk. A fight was won and lost and you as the loser retire to lick your wounds and maybe come back again stronger. If you want isk you have to go earn it through mining or other isk related pursuits. No more ganking for isk. No more getting destroyed in nullsec just because you are a newbie.
X3 runs this way, but that game is not online like Eve. The ships "degrade" during battle, need repair, eventually need replacing. They can be detonated by the pilots but not actually destroyed by another. A fight is deemed as won when the losing ship is little more than a floating hulk and only just limps home. Fighting costs a lot of money, and bounties would actually mean something. Heck. You may not even need Concord anymore. As I said......

I hope a developer reads this.

Kipsley Caton
Blame The Bunny
#10 - 2017-07-21 15:56:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Kipsley Caton
Well what can I say? Firstly, I do agree with you all. But the reality is that when I get ganked in my "mere mining ship", it's by three guys in cruisers who seem to think they are awesome for some reason. Lol. Eve does have it's issues. It is polarized around small minds who are over compensating for some lack in their real life (I suppose) and those who have been in the game for ages and are true masters of it. As for me, I take it as a credit and compliment that it takes three cruisers to take me down. Banking of newbie miners just seems a bit shallow however. But maybe that is just me. And as for Eve teaching you life-skills..... It's a game guys. Capsules are not real.