EVE General Discussion

So really 'no player of the owning corp has docked'.

Because citadels have no fuel burn, if they have no online service modules.

(I've had discussions about this with various people)

This has been pretty well addressed, but i'm not above beating the dead horse.

If you don't see a problem with citadels being deployed so random and so much, then you're probably not A.) Trying to put a citadel there, yourself. B.) OCD about your overview, in which case, remove them from your overview. C.) just generally unhappy with highsec life, in which case, it's about time you moved to null.

Also, did you not consider the tactical advantage of the fact that if one person puts up a citadel somewhere, it hinders another person's ability to put up a citadel there; in that exact spot. For whatever strategic advantage a citadel's location may bring, occupying that space takes it away from someone else. So, what you see as useless, random, abandoned citadels, might actually just be strategically placed "citadel blockers". I mean, that's just a moment's though. Probably wrong, but you get the idea.

Normally in EvE when we don't like something somewhere we just shoot it.

But that was before when it actually dropped loot.

Exactly what do I get for killing citadels?

Now you have to use a whole different game breaking solution of asking for someway to remove them to fix the last game breaking solution of making items magically float to a new station.

Nice direction this game is headed.

tbh, this is something I've suggested.

Please don't assume that we're not talking to CCP about things just because we're not yelling about something in public.

Though the fuel burn I'd prefer isn't a flat cost. it's a minimum. So if you're running services, it doesn't increase your costs. Just sets a minimum.

Well to be fair to that poster, the CSM-CCP interactions are very opaque, intentionally that is, and it is not easy for an outsider to see what input their representatives have given. Judging from the things that slip through the cracks, the CSM does miss things and/or CCP ignores you guys on semi-regular basis for whatever reason and we have no way of knowing which it is.

I am trying to cut back on my back-seat game designing, and pontificating in general, but I am with Spookyjay there: just give them some freakin' fuel. This problem of accumulation of abandoned structures, and the ability to spam them everywhere, was pointed out to the design team on many occasions and was clearly heard, but Ytterbium and friends wanted to make them as easy to use and maintain as possible and ignored these concerns. I don't blame the CSM for this, and like most choices that have negative impacts, it was made with good intentions (that is to reduce the complaints from the few players whose role it is to refuel POS networks for large organizations). But honestly, the current imbalance is so predictable, and we have perfectly good paradigm for structure abandonment with POSes and their fuels, that I pains me to see such choices made by a game developer with as much experience as CCP should have.

Make fuelling as cheap and easy as you would like, but there needs to be some way for abandoned structures, either owned by players who have quit or by organizations that have been evicted from a space, to be much, much easier to remove. These things are suppose to be conflict and content generators, not time sinks that waste 1.5 hours times 5 people or more to get rid of, often in the middle of the night or work day. That is way too much tedium for an undefended structure.

Yea maybe its about time people started yelling in public. Especially the CSM.
The CSM was created to stop ridiculous development choices and get the wish of the players across. Instead its become a bureaucratic crap heap full of players with their own agendas that actually probably holds up some development. Fopr example.
The NC guy who wants to nerf mjd's. Literally the 1 thing that has made a change to the landscape of the battlefield in years. And he wants it removed because it hurts the blob. He should be kicked off CSM for that. it's entirely negative as breaking the blob should be one of CCP top priorities as its literally the stagnation that will slowly kill this game.

The Sov system is the other part of that stagnation. NOTHING is worth fighting for. Citadels are destroying tactical gameplay and fozzy sov is true cancer. a growing festering lump at the core of this games mechanics. IT IS TIME PEOPLE SHOUT AND SCREAM IN PUBLIC. Because it seems to be the only way CCP realise something needs fixing immediately. Players shouting and screaming in public are like EVE signs of illness. CCP heavy handed forum moderation and CSM have effectively killed EVE being able to show it's developers something is wrong and it is ill.

If you give them a fuel burn it's also a good idea to have similar to current POS mechanics.

Where if the fuel runs out you can blow it up in one go and don't need 3 reinforcement timers.

There is just no excuse for the current state of Sov and structure. The problems with them have been pointed out since day 1 of their announcement. It's exactly the same as with incarna when me and others were telling CCP it was a crap idea. CCP don't listen. But now they are even worse. Because now they have the CSM between them and the players, so the player they should be listening too are even more ignored. Instead what they have is a bunch of figure heads of EVE telling them what they want.

Lets put it in simple contexts. If the core is broken, every other aspect of the game will wither. And right now the core is more broken than it's ever been.

I'm well aware of the fact. I never calculated how much fuel it takes to run a service module though, so I cannot tell, whether the fuel hold would keep a single module running for a month or two.

I'd be fine with a single module running on fuel for two months and no player docking though. As long as there's a minimum of attention devoted to the structure, it should be fine.

Structures, that are not serviced or used at all though, should decay and go poof within something of 4 to six months.

Citadels don't _require_ fuel.

If they have no service modules, they don't use any. So put a single fuel block into them, and they're fueled forever.

Or you can manually offline all the fitted modules, and fuel will stick around.

Put in a quantity of fuel which isn't evenly divided by the quantity it burns, and you'll have the service modules offlining, and fuel being left.

You begin to see why more definition is required?