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Creating more mystery

Author
Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#1 - 2017-06-16 16:11:04 UTC
I'm very interested in the idea of creating more mystery where the game is concerned.

For example: Everything in this game. Every system and its holdings. Even the holdings newly placed by its occupants, are easily looked up through websites such as Dotland. Doesn't take much to find out whats out there without actually going. I understand that Dotland has been around forever and most people here, even myself, are used to using it but considering all of the changes that are being made in game, isn't it time to begin looking at whats being made available out of game?

I would suggest that CCP begin the creation of new space and expand its entire network of Stellar Clusters and so on. Continue its development along the lines they are already going where game play is concerne and either freeze Dotland at the point where it is now, limit the type of info that Dotland can absorb or find a way to make it irrelevant.

Now granted someone from somewhere will figure out how to remap or regenerate what's on Dotland. That's a given and maybe this idea might sound ridiculous to those who've become used to it but in order to make things better and create a sense of mystery, discovery and exploration some of the older tools of the game may simply need to be abandoned.

1) Expand the Eve Universe. :)
2) Freeze, limit info to or make Dotland irrelevant.

I could go on but this would at least be a good place to start from.
Keno Skir
#2 - 2017-06-16 16:27:10 UTC
IIRC, it doesn't really work like that. I think if they had an area of space that limited public data, kill reports and stuff would be broken there too.

Dunno rly, see where you coming from tho..
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#3 - 2017-06-16 16:30:11 UTC
Deaths Phoenix wrote:
I'm very interested in the idea of creating more mystery where the game is concerned.

For example: Everything in this game. Every system and its holdings. Even the holdings newly placed by its occupants, are easily looked up through websites such as Dotland. Doesn't take much to find out whats out there without actually going. I understand that Dotland has been around forever and most people here, even myself, are used to using it but considering all of the changes that are being made in game, isn't it time to begin looking at whats being made available out of game?

I would suggest that CCP begin the creation of new space and expand its entire network of Stellar Clusters and so on. Continue its development along the lines they are already going where game play is concerne and either freeze Dotland at the point where it is now, limit the type of info that Dotland can absorb or find a way to make it irrelevant.

Now granted someone from somewhere will figure out how to remap or regenerate what's on Dotland. That's a given and maybe this idea might sound ridiculous to those who've become used to it but in order to make things better and create a sense of mystery, discovery and exploration some of the older tools of the game may simply need to be abandoned.

1) Expand the Eve Universe. :)
2) Freeze, limit info to or make Dotland irrelevant.

I could go on but this would at least be a good place to start from.


The game has thousand of players and you expect a map to somehow not being drawn?
SurrenderMonkey
The Exchange Collective
Solyaris Chtonium
#4 - 2017-06-16 16:34:32 UTC
So you're saying you want wormhole-space.

"Help, I'm bored with missions!"

http://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/

Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#5 - 2017-06-16 16:43:29 UTC
Frostys Virpio
"The game has thousand of players and you expect a map to somehow not being drawn?"

I think I've already acknowledged that in some way shape or form Dotland, or off shoots of it, will always come into play. However everything in the game doesn't need to be available there. Leave some things out for the sake of leaving some mystery in the game.

After all I do want to game to last.

SurrenderMonkey
"So you're saying you want wormhole-space."

Not at all, I'm just interested in creating a sense of more mystery.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#6 - 2017-06-16 16:47:03 UTC
Deaths Phoenix wrote:

Not at all, I'm just interested in creating a sense of more mystery.
I have an idea.

Have the Jove randomly sweep in and blow up everyone's ships in a selected region. If nothing else, it would make for some great threads.


Mr Epeen Cool
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#7 - 2017-06-16 16:49:09 UTC
Deaths Phoenix wrote:
Frostys Virpio
"The game has thousand of players and you expect a map to somehow not being drawn?"

I think I've already acknowledged that in some way shape or form Dotland, or off shoots of it, will always come into play. However everything in the game doesn't need to be available there. Leave some things out for the sake of leaving some mystery in the game.

After all I do want to game to last.

SurrenderMonkey
"So you're saying you want wormhole-space."

Not at all, I'm just interested in creating a sense of more mystery.


Exxcept it's player who made all that info available. There is no way CCP could really prevent it from happening again unless they made the data not static and at that point, WH space already exist.
Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#8 - 2017-06-16 17:39:49 UTC
Frostys Virpio
"Exxcept it's player who made all that info available. There is no way CCP could really prevent it from happening again unless they made the data not static and at that point, WH space already exist."

I don't want to recreate WH space in Null Sec. That would be repetitive. What I'm saying is simple. CCP should introduce new space and we don't need for everything in the game to be openly available on Dotland. That all. One should be able to actually go out and explore. Should Dotland perhaps maintain the basics? Perhaps but not EVERYTHING.
Eternus8lux8lucis
Duckzer Mining Corporation
RAZOR Alliance
#9 - 2017-06-16 18:19:16 UTC
CCP has always gone the opposite way of making more and more information publicly available through APIs for both players and third party developers to build tools and gather information out of game.

I too disagree with this fundamentally for the "fun" factor of the unknown to remain unknown yet understand why CCP wishes more information to be available. Its a double edged sword and for those that enjoy knowing and gathering intel on enemies and friends to develop intrigue and Machiavellian storylines knowing more than someone else creates this excellently.

Normally, if we had only one character like we do in real life, this isnt that much of an issue as information gathering is imperfect at best and a lot harder with much higher punishments for failure. But you add in alts and the ability to effectively biomass while still keeping the intel gathered removes the punishment factor and much of the value of the entire thing for me. I am unique in my viewpoints usually and I can understand why people would wish it this way regardless.

This is one of the main reasons why I never used the forums or 3rd party tools for the first few years of this game and on purpose limit myself in many areas simply to make it harder and more difficult on myself. The game would be insanely boring if I played it with all the tools available tbh. But limiting myself this way it has added enjoyment above what is designed. Effectively hobbling me with severe limitations forces me to stretch myself to adapt in different ways. I realize that not everyone wishes to do this nor would I ever assume my enemies will.

It is like the limited movement of those who wish to be self sufficient in game rather than earning the top isk/hr and then buying everything on market. Its something each person has to do on their own.


Now a new space that simply didnt have API information available to it would be... interesting to say the least and a decent thought exercise to indulge in.Blink

Have you heard anything I've said?

You said it's all circling the drain, the whole universe. Right?

That's right.

Had to end sometime.

JC Mieyli
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#10 - 2017-06-16 18:32:21 UTC
i know what you mean
some parts of low sec are so violent i cant even get past the outlying systems anymore
Vortexo VonBrenner
Doomheim
#11 - 2017-06-16 20:43:03 UTC
Gimme Sake
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2017-06-16 20:55:25 UTC
Unmapped isk farming space. Available only to a few players who know about it... hmmm..Bear

"Never not blob!" ~ Plato

Sir BloodArgon Aulmais
Fortis Fortuna Adiuvatt
#13 - 2017-06-16 22:15:00 UTC
Create mystery for what, so people, you, can solve it?

What happens when they do? What stops people from sharing it or re-mapping the systems. How would you prevent that? And what's the point? So people can have more "fun"? I use fun in quotation marks because stumbling around in the dark might be entertainment for you, but its annoying as hell for the next guy.

Eve being an open universe, the last thing it needs is data being hidden for the sake of hiding it.

You want deep mystery and meaning to the game? Go read the lore. It's all there already.
Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#14 - 2017-06-16 22:19:41 UTC
Forcing people to use third party sites simply for a map is bad.
Doesn't mean I don't want more mystery but your method is not more mystery. It's more exclusivity for the first people to bother making a map.

Mystery should be in Anoms not being clearly labelled as a sanctum or a hub or a haven.
It should be in Dscan simply telling you '4 cruisers 3 frigates'.
It should be in NPC's not being hard coded so you know that an Outuni neuts lots. But just being a 'Sansha Battleship, Armageddon Class'
It should be in missions being to complex and variable to have a guide written, because the NPC's aren't 100% known and the layout changes.

That's where the Mystery should appear. Inside the existing space. So that it becomes about working things out for yourself each time, rather than reading the 'best way to do X' guide and being able to simply follow the steps with no understanding.
Scipio Artelius
The Vendunari
End of Life
#15 - 2017-06-16 23:30:42 UTC  |  Edited by: Scipio Artelius
If someone wants to be able to go and explore, then surely the sense of "mystery" is totally controllable by them?

There's no requirement to look at Dotlan, zkillboard, uni-wiki (now EVE survival is gone), etc. They are tools available for people that want them, but if someone is looking to explore, then don't use them.

Edit: spelling and grammar. My post was a mystery. Thanks Apple.
Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#16 - 2017-06-17 01:43:02 UTC
Sir BloodArgon Aulmais wrote:
Create mystery for what, so people, you, can solve it?

What happens when they do? What stops people from sharing it or re-mapping the systems. How would you prevent that? And what's the point? So people can have more "fun"? I use fun in quotation marks because stumbling around in the dark might be entertainment for you, but its annoying as hell for the next guy.

Eve being an open universe, the last thing it needs is data being hidden for the sake of hiding it.

You want deep mystery and meaning to the game? Go read the lore. It's all there already.


Unfortunately I can't say what you're saying isn't true. "And what's the point? So people can have more "fun"?" <--Do we actually have an issue with fun? Perhaps you meant something else.
Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#17 - 2017-06-17 01:46:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Deaths Phoenix
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Forcing people to use third party sites simply for a map is bad.
Doesn't mean I don't want more mystery but your method is not more mystery. It's more exclusivity for the first people to bother making a map.

Mystery should be in Anoms not being clearly labelled as a sanctum or a hub or a haven.
It should be in Dscan simply telling you '4 cruisers 3 frigates'.
It should be in NPC's not being hard coded so you know that an Outuni neuts lots. But just being a 'Sansha Battleship, Armageddon Class'
It should be in missions being to complex and variable to have a guide written, because the NPC's aren't 100% known and the layout changes.

That's where the Mystery should appear. Inside the existing space. So that it becomes about working things out for yourself each time, rather than reading the 'best way to do X' guide and being able to simply follow the steps with no understanding.


To be honest I was hoping to start a conversation regarding the subject and the idea of creating more space and diminishing aspects of Dotland are just pet peeves of my own. There are certainly other areas one can look at.
Deaths Phoenix
Zervas Aeronautics
The Bastion
#18 - 2017-06-17 01:48:44 UTC
Scipio Artelius wrote:
If someone wants to be able to go and explore, then surely the sense of "mystery" is totally controllable by them?

There's no requirement to look at Dotlan, zkillboard, uni-wiki (now EVE survival is gone), etc. They are tools available for people that want them, but if someone is looking to explore, then don't use them.

Edit: spelling and grammar. My post was a mystery. Thanks Apple.



Very true, however the use and knowledge of it gives one an extreme advantage. Which is why I also suggest the creation of new space that way there are advantages all around.
Aedaxus
Digital Zone Corp
#19 - 2017-06-17 09:06:01 UTC
Deaths Phoenix wrote:
Scipio Artelius wrote:
If someone wants to be able to go and explore, then surely the sense of "mystery" is totally controllable by them?

There's no requirement to look at Dotlan, zkillboard, uni-wiki (now EVE survival is gone), etc. They are tools available for people that want them, but if someone is looking to explore, then don't use them.

Edit: spelling and grammar. My post was a mystery. Thanks Apple.



Very true, however the use and knowledge of it gives one an extreme advantage. Which is why I also suggest the creation of new space that way there are advantages all around.


CCP can not control information outside their game and owned websites. In a game where one time there was this one spai and one intrigue.... I can ony wonder what your hidden agenda is....
Mark Marconi
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#20 - 2017-06-17 09:14:22 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Deaths Phoenix wrote:

Not at all, I'm just interested in creating a sense of more mystery.
I have an idea.

Have the Jove randomly sweep in and blow up everyone's ships in a selected region. If nothing else, it would make for some great threads.


Mr Epeen Cool

Actually I would love to see Sov Null under attack by masses of hot dropping NPCs or mass gate jump ins.

Now that would be fun, having to combat, lawless space against something unpredictable and large and when I say large I mean enough NPCs to create TiDi.

The CSM gets in the way of CCP communicating properly with the players of this game.

After all we are not just players, we are customers.

Time for the CSM to be disbanded.

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