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EVE New Citizens Q&A

 
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Hurricane vs Ferox

Author
Xavi Mendosa
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#1 - 2017-05-08 18:39:07 UTC
I know, battlecruisers are not popular for a while but I'm looking for a battlecruiser to fight in solo/small gang pvp just for fun. I suppose Hurricane is a good choice for this purpose but heard something about Ferox is a better choice for solo pvp because of more mid slot (6 vs 4) and wide range and cane is better for fleet purpose because of high volley. On the other hand, cane has more max velocity (180 vs 150 m/sec) and has low signature radius (250 vs 295m).

I'm a bit confused and need some guidence. What do you think about Cane vs Ferox?
Fal Shepard
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#2 - 2017-05-08 19:11:37 UTC  |  Edited by: Fal Shepard
Minmatar ships are infamously versatile, capable of fitting armor or shield as well as an impressive variety of damage types. In my years, I've seen more solo hurricanes than any other solo battle cruiser.

I recommend the hurricane based on the fact that it will keep the opponent guessing at your capabilities, a hesitation that may cost them the fight.

As for slot differences between the two, well, that largely depends on how you plan to fly them. Whichever you choose, fit it to your combat style, mate.

From the ashes of our defeat, we will be reborn. With these chains with which we are bound, we will become indivisible. To those who showed us no mercy, we will give no sympathy. For the flames that burn our cities, we will douse in injustice's blood

Trevor Dalech
Nobody in Local
Of Sound Mind
#3 - 2017-05-08 20:19:15 UTC
I've had some great dps numbers with a blaster ferox, however it may not be the best choice solo, you need someone to hold down your target so you can get in blaster range.

Of course, some people see that ferox and think 5km is a great orbit distance...

Hurricanes are a lot more popular though, however I've never flown one.
Francis Raven
ExDominion
Evictus.
#4 - 2017-05-08 20:26:33 UTC
Both are commonly used in nullsec. I prefer the hurricane due to speed and versatility, but the ferox is a great choice too.

Use both, experiment, and why not start with the one you are skilled into more? (Both Racial Battlecruiser skill, as well as weapon system skill).

ExDominion | Nullsec Corporation | Website | Forums | Established Nov. 2015 |

Rexxar Santaro
Forex Corp
#5 - 2017-05-10 07:33:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Rexxar Santaro
The phrase “I suppose Hurricane is a good choice for this purpose but heard something about Ferox is a better choice for solo pvp because of more mid slot (6 vs 4) and wide range and cane is better for fleet purpose because of high volley.” is not very correct. More mid slots mean your ship should have a shield tank. You must put there more shield busters and resistances which means not many available PVP slots. Without them your ship will be squishy. At the same time, any Minmatar ship can handle Autocannons (high tracking and rate of fire) for short range and Artillery (high alpha strike, low tracking and fire rate) for long range and each of them can have different projectiles which can do any type of damage, improves tracking or range. There are decent fits for alpha-strike purposes. The Cane’s increased speed and lower signature will not play core role in solo or small fleet PVP. You’ll be webbed in a place with possible painter dot on your head.

I am flying the Hurricane over 1 month already for missions and combat sites and noticed this ship’s performance under different NPC ECMs. The most annoying ECM fighting frigates and cruisers are Weapon Disruption (we have Guidance Disruption for Ferox) mainly and Tracking Disruptor which is very rare used by other players. Both the Ferox and Hurricane can be fitted at long range fight, which is not good for PVP – you must be in a Disruptor and Web range.

To choose between Ferox or Hurricane mostly depends by your skills for their fittings – you have high skills with Gunnery or with Missiles -> HT. I can confirm that Hurricane performance with level 2 ship and Gunnery skills is very low. Every next skill level to his table increases his performance significantly. The minimum requirements for solo PVP for both ships, in my opinion, are: almost all ship devices should be T2 and you should have minimum level III Mastery on them, optimal a level IV Mastery.

* Updated: Missiles to HT for Ferox

In general, I’ll suggest you develop Hurricane skills for solo PVP: Armor, Drones, Gunnery, Minmatar Battlecruisers. Hurricane’s tank – is low slots armor resistances, boosters and nanites. Mid slots are used for ECM. High slots: 6 x 200mm or 120mm AC + Energy stealer “Nosferatu” (btw Ferox should fit all h-slots with launchers). Compared to Ferox you can use more drones on Cane, which is very important for PVP. The armor tanked Cruiser and Battlecruisers looks better in PVP nowadays. This will let you to unlock T2 Sleipnir which is better for fleets.
Alasdan Helminthauge
AirHogs
Hogs Collective
#6 - 2017-05-10 13:24:48 UTC
Rexxar Santaro wrote:
The phrase “I suppose Hurricane is a good choice for this purpose but heard something about Ferox is a better choice for solo pvp because of more mid slot (6 vs 4) and wide range and cane is better for fleet purpose because of high volley.” is not very correct. More mid slots mean your ship should have a shield tank. You must put there more shield busters and resistances which means not many available PVP slots. Without them your ship will be squishy. At the same time, any Minmatar ship can handle Autocannons (high tracking and rate of fire) for short range and Artillery (high alpha strike, low tracking and fire rate) for long range and each of them can have different projectiles which can do any type of damage, improves tracking or range. There are decent fits for alpha-strike purposes. The Cane’s increased speed and lower signature will not play core role in solo or small fleet PVP. You’ll be webbed in a place with possible painter dot on your head.

I am flying the Hurricane over 1 month already for missions and combat sites and noticed this ship’s performance under different NPC ECMs. The most annoying ECM fighting frigates and cruisers are Weapon Disruption (we have Guidance Disruption for Ferox) mainly and Tracking Disruptor which is very rare used by other players. Both the Ferox and Hurricane can be fitted at long range fight, which is not good for PVP – you must be in a Disruptor and Web range.

To choose between Ferox or Hurricane mostly depends by your skills for their fittings – you have high skills with Gunnery or with Missiles. I can confirm that Hurricane performance with level 2 ship and Gunnery skills is very low. Every next skill level to his table increases his performance significantly. The minimum requirements for solo PVP for both ships, in my opinion, are: almost all ship devices should be T2 and you should have minimum level III Mastery on them, optimal a level IV Mastery.

In general, I’ll suggest you develop Hurricane skills for solo PVP: Armor, Drones, Gunnery, Minmatar Battlecruisers. Hurricane’s tank – is low slots armor resistances, boosters and nanites. Mid slots are used for ECM. High slots: 6 x 200mm or 120mm AC + Energy stealer “Nosferatu” (btw Ferox should fit all h-slots with launchers). Compared to Ferox you can use more drones on Cane, which is very important for PVP. The armor tanked Cruiser and Battlecruisers looks better in PVP nowadays. This will let you to unlock T2 Sleipnir which is better for fleets.


I think you get something wrong.
First, ECM is jam, which, among with Target Painting, Damp and Tracking Disruptor, is a kind of E-War.
Second, Ferox is also a gun ship.
Third, a nos on a bc is really a bad idea. It can only steals cap when the target has less absolute cap than you, and the amount isnt very much either. A neut should be far better.
Rexxar Santaro
Forex Corp
#7 - 2017-05-10 15:09:11 UTC
Alasdan Helminthauge wrote:

First, ECM is jam, which, among with Target Painting, Damp and Tracking Disruptor, is a kind of E-War.


Wut?

I mean Cane doing badly vs Cruisers and Frigates while under the effect of Damp or Tracking Disruptor (which can run continuously).


Alasdan Helminthauge wrote:

Second, Ferox is also a gun ship.


Sorry, my bad. I wrote this hasty and confused Ferox with other Caldari missile ship - Corax.

Alasdan Helminthauge wrote:

Third, a nos on a bc is really a bad idea. It can only steals cap when the target has less absolute cap than you, and the amount isnt very much either. A neut should be far better.


Hmm, it mostly depends by the situation: solo/little fleet PVP, you going vs other BC / BS or other S ships, by tanking type and playstyle.

Both NOS and NEUT are good on a projectile armed ship.

The Minmatar ships have the lowest cap pool mostly. So burning fast your little cap with a NEUT... IDK.

NOS list

NEUT list

This means if you turn on your NOS, and you have 125 cap in your cap pool, and your opponent has 370, the NOS works regardless of relative % cap.

The biggest effect here will most likely be that any time you're fighting up a class (frig vs cruiser, cruiser vs BS, etc) NOS will become a much more attractive choice. It also means that in fights with several ship sizes present, deciding on a target for your NOS should be more intuitive (target something big).

On an armor tanked Cane, you can keep your cap at 0-10%, having max dps, and time to time inject a battery for an armor reparation round, while NOS will let you keep disruptor up.

Sure, is no need in BC NOS vs S-class ship. You'll blow them up in few rounds.
Magnus Jax
#8 - 2017-05-10 17:01:37 UTC
Small gang the Cane is better, it's more agile and faster while having less range issues. Solo I prefer the Ferox in scram/MJD fit.
Cara Forelli
Caldari Colonial Defense Ministry
Templis CALSF
#9 - 2017-05-10 17:07:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Cara Forelli
Rexxar Santaro wrote:

Wut?

I mean Cane doing badly vs Cruisers and Frigates while under the effect of Damp or Tracking Disruptor (which can run continuously).

He's trying to point out that your terminology is incorrect. ECM refers specifically to jams. All the others (tracking/missile disruption, damps, target painting) together with jams are referred to as EWAR, not ECM.

OP I recently lost a solo ferox. If you need fitting ideas have a look at my loss mail. I reccomend swapping the MJD for a cap booster. The Caldari hybrid ships are very susceptible to neuts (hence the loss to a neut boat ;) )

There are also some interesting dual web fits you can use. The 6 mids offer a lot of flexibility if you are creative.

Want to talk? Join my channel in game: House Forelli

Titan's Lament

Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
Working Stiffs
#10 - 2017-05-10 19:34:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Tau Cabalander
Ferox are commonly used as fleet ships with railguns.

Hurricane solo are typically autocanons. When used in fleet they are typically artillery.
[I have an artillery Hurricane for level 3 missions - only the ones I can't do in an Assault Frigate.]

Ferox lacks the speed and agility of the Hurricane, and the range flexibility of projectiles (hybrids are either in-your-face blasters or long range railguns, with no middle range - rails are the lowest DPS mid-range weapon-system).

The Ferox isn't effective at controlling engagement range, so using blasters on it is a bad idea. It's bonus to optimal range is for railguns (blasters would be a tracking bonus).
Magnus Jax
#11 - 2017-05-11 09:14:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Magnus Jax
Tau Cabalander wrote:
The Ferox isn't effective at controlling engagement range, so using blasters on it is a bad idea. It's bonus to optimal range is for railguns (blasters would be a tracking bonus).


Not at all.

CBC have the option to fit MJD which is a massive boon for solo work. MJD effectively gives your enemies a choice: let you go or get within scram range to counter your MJD. This is especially hilarious in 0.0 where only a small percentage of ships are scram fitted and the ones that are tend to be smaller ones which don't react well to neuting and blasters to the face.

Active tanked Ferox and bulkhead Brutix are almost ideal for this. Myrmidon is another option but vulnerable due to reliance on drones. Prophecy suffers from a lack of mid slots but can still work, same for the Cyclone.

The two worst options are the Cane due to a lack of tank and the Harbinger due to lasers not being ideal for this in more ways than one.
Othran
Route One
#12 - 2017-05-11 15:54:32 UTC
While the cane is not what it used to be (by a LONG way), zkillboard tells the tale of which one is used in which scenario :

https://zkillboard.com/ship/24702/ is the cane - note the numbers on killmail.

https://zkillboard.com/ship/16227/ is the Ferox - again note the numbers.

Personally I wouldn't go near either for solo/small gang work - the Cynabal is a better option than the cane and ultimately will cost you less in losses. It projects the same (real) DPS as the cane outside overheated scram range (16km or so for faction IIRC, been a while) and moves a hell of a lot faster. It also warps at the same speed as a destroyer.

We may have different ideas about small gang work though - I'm talking under 8 and probably more like 5 max on grid if you're very lucky Big smile
Fal Shepard
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#13 - 2017-05-11 17:57:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Fal Shepard
Othran wrote:
Cynabal is a better option than the cane and ultimately will cost you less in losses.

Cost less? Cynabal costs 3xs as much.

From the ashes of our defeat, we will be reborn. With these chains with which we are bound, we will become indivisible. To those who showed us no mercy, we will give no sympathy. For the flames that burn our cities, we will douse in injustice's blood