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Requires three low slots
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manus
Subhypersonics
#1 - 2017-04-22 12:37:41 UTC  |  Edited by: manus
Am watching the ship browswer.
Notice some variants of transports ships are imune to cargo scanners
Think thats neat, but why isnt this a module fittable to other ships?


Module:

Cargo Screen
Requires three low slots
Makes your ship imune to cargo scans

The material used to screen the cargo bay is heavy yet fragile. it increases mass but reduces ship speed and maneuvaribility. Manufacturing the modile is also very time and resource consuming ie. the module is expensive and the module will take up 3 low slots.
Tech II variant requires 2 low slots but alot of skill points and is even more expensive.


As you see this is two ideas in one. Modules suddenly take up more slots. Thats completely new and fresh. But also you get the ability to shield your cargo from cargo scans, albeit at a significant cost. Gives people who are a wary of ganks a different option than full on tank to disincentivise the gankers. People who dont know any better will still be flaying around with the shuttles getting smartbombed and losing BP's and implants and industrials and freighters full of valuable cargo without tank. So dont worry, this wont be the end of ganks.
Alderson Point
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2017-04-22 12:49:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Alderson Point
manus wrote:
Am watching the ship browswer.
Notice some variants of transports ships are imune to cargo scanners
Think thats neat, but why isnt this a module fittable to other ships?


Module:

Cargo Screen
Requires three low slots
Makes your ship imune to cargo scans

The material used to screen the cargo bay is heavy yet fragile. it increases mass but reduces ship speed and maneuvaribility. Manufacturing the modile is also very time and resource consuming ie. the module is expensive and the module will take up 3 low slots.
Tech II variant requires 2 low slots but alot of skill points and is even more expensive.


As you see this is two ideas in one. Modules suddenly take up more slots. Thats completely new and fresh. But also you get the ability to shield your cargo from cargo scans, albeit at a significant cost. Gives people who are a wary of ganks a different option than full on tank to disincentivise the gankers. People who dont know any better will still be flaying around with the shuttles getting smartbombed and losing BP's and implants and industrials and freighters full of valuable cargo without tank. So dont worry, this wont be the end of ganks.



Honestly cargo immunity is a mixed blessing, Gankers will oneshot blockade runners just in case they have "shineys" on board.
All this proposal would mean is more ganks, and easier ganks, I almost wonder if this is a false flag post to make ganking less effort.

Probably not, but that would be the effect.
manus
Subhypersonics
#3 - 2017-04-22 12:51:02 UTC
Yea, no. After they have recieved enough "false positives" they will stop. They are just going to gank the ones that dont protect themselves at all. They are going to gank the ones where they know they profit.
Alderson Point
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2017-04-22 12:52:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Alderson Point
manus wrote:
Yea, no. After they have recieved enough "false positives" they will stop. They are just going to gank the ones that dont protect themselves at all. They are going to gank the ones where they know they profit.



Unfortunately if some one totally compromises their fit to hide the cargo, one can pretty much guarantee a good chance of a big payday.

And do not bet on player self restraint, the only restraints in EVE that work involve heavy chains.
manus
Subhypersonics
#5 - 2017-04-22 12:57:07 UTC
Quote:
Unfortunately if some one totally compromises their fit to hide the cargo, one can pretty much guarantee a good chance of a big payday.


Sounds good to me? We are not in the buisness of protecting players or deciding how they play. We are here to give them options. This is a sandbox after all. I mean IF it turns out that all ships fitting cargo bay screens will be ganked on sight, so be it. Emergent gameplay.



Quote:
And do not bet on player self restraint, the only restraints in EVE that work involve heavy chains.

Not sure what you mean
Black Pedro
Mine.
#6 - 2017-04-22 12:58:42 UTC
manus wrote:
Yea, no. After they have recieved enough "false positives" they will stop. They are just going to gank the ones that dont protect themselves at all. They are going to gank the ones where they know they profit.
The data say otherwise.

You can already do this for free by "double-wrapping" your cargo using a container and a courier contract. Try this for a while and see if it makes you any safer.

The 8 Golden Rules of Eve

Why Do They Gank?
mkint
#7 - 2017-04-22 12:59:10 UTC  |  Edited by: mkint
Not that this idea is particularly *bad*. So congratulations on that. But this idea is particularly pointless. You can already double-wrap stuff (which is far more effective at obfuscation than your proposal), and that demonstrates how this would play out. Scout caries a ship scanner and a cargo scanner. If they see one of these fit, they attack. Because of the agility hit, you won't want one fit if you're not carrying cargo, which makes it a big advertisement that you need to be ganked. The status quo for how to effectively move cargo doesn't change. Module only gets used by rookies and only until they learn better.

edit: and you used the term "emergent gameplay" wrong. While it means unpredictable, your idea is extremely predictable. Not emergent, just bad by design.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
manus
Subhypersonics
#8 - 2017-04-22 13:04:57 UTC  |  Edited by: manus
Uh no. It is emergent gameplay. The only people who would consisently go out of their way to gank players who obfuscate cargo will be people who are part of the CODE. or of similar caliber. It wont be done to profit per say, because its not profitable. Its too much of a risk. I can see CODE. establishing Hek as a "No cargo screen" area. Everyone with a cargo screen will be shot on sight just for the RP aspect. If you were really bored you could also fly your hauler empty with this module trying to bait gankers. Emergent gameplay?
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#9 - 2017-04-22 13:30:40 UTC
manus wrote:
Yea, no. After they have recieved enough "false positives" they will stop. They are just going to gank the ones that dont protect themselves at all. They are going to gank the ones where they know they profit.

How is a guaranteed 150M kill mail for 2 Thrasher or a Tornado a "false positive"?

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
mkint
#10 - 2017-04-22 14:39:24 UTC
manus wrote:
Uh no. It is emergent gameplay. The only people who would consisently go out of their way to gank players who obfuscate cargo will be people who are part of the CODE. or of similar caliber. It wont be done to profit per say, because its not profitable. Its too much of a risk. I can see CODE. establishing Hek as a "No cargo screen" area. Everyone with a cargo screen will be shot on sight just for the RP aspect. If you were really bored you could also fly your hauler empty with this module trying to bait gankers. Emergent gameplay?

No. Not emergent. Predictable. Emergent is when jetcans got used for mining, as it wasn't something the devs predicted would happen. Emergent is when w-space got fully colonized, as they expected players to only do day trips. Emergent was the formation of alliances and coalitions, as those weren't originally part of the design and was unexpected. Emergent is any time the meta ossifies around an unexpected FOTM.

Your idea is not emergent. It is tedious and predictable. Your idea is to hang a "gank me" sign on people stupid enough to use your module. If anyone is flying with that module fit, it's obvious they have something to hide and are too stupid to know how, i.e. easy gank. No one would bother setting up a screen-free zone because it would be redundant. If you're a ganker, you already gank every screen you see because obviously. If it got added, it wouldn't be the only pointless module in the game, but it would definitely be pointless.

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Wander Prian
Nosferatu Security Foundation
#11 - 2017-04-22 15:16:35 UTC
Not yet mention that ships are​ supposed to be different. Not every ship should be able to do everything. It is part of the role for blockage runners to be cargo scan ummune, just as DST:s have a high tank.

Wormholer for life.
Cade Windstalker
#12 - 2017-04-23 05:22:38 UTC
Because it's one of a number of abilities limited by the hull rather than being something you can easily fit to whatever you'd like. They're almost all extremely powerful, and would be considered a no-brainer to fit in many situations if they were generally available.

More specifically if you could fit that to a DST you'd have an incredibly tanky ship with a large hauling capacity and no way to tell if ganking it is going to be cost effective. That would be incredibly powerful and shift the ganking meta in favor of haulers in a big way that isn't needed.