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Why is CCP spending so much time on rehashing content?
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Do Little
Bluenose Trading
#21 - 2017-04-16 16:49:15 UTC
The average Eve player is now in their 30's with career and family responsibilities. Setting aside several hours for a fleet or cooperative industrial activity is difficult. As CCP Ghost pointed out at Fanfest - 90% of the people he talks to want more and better solo options. Things to do when you have a half hour of spare time to login. I'm willing to bet that a lot of players would like a pause button for PVE to help with kids, pets and other interruptions that are a normal part of family life. I don't see Eve heading in that direction anytime soon but a lot of the game and a lot of the ideas I see presented on the forum seem to assume that we actually live in New Eden when most of us simply visit for a little while when real life permits.

In my experience, communities in Eve have private chat channels - few people monitor local unless they're undocked, and then more for intel than social interaction.

When you look at what players have been contributing to the sandbox over the past 3 years the numbers are healthy http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/Feb_2017/0_produced.vs.destroyed.png
mkint
#22 - 2017-04-16 16:57:30 UTC
Do Little wrote:


When you look at what players have been contributing to the sandbox over the past 3 years the numbers are healthy http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/Feb_2017/0_produced.vs.destroyed.png

That graph doesn't really mean a lot, except that people are mostly just playing the game to accumulate imaginary assets. That huge gap between produced and destroyed is a clear message that people aren't building products to use them. Maybe they are holding on to the fantasy that some day they'll use them, and then never get around to it. When a player gets bored of the game because he can't find any interesting meaningful adventures, a hangar full of assets isn't going to keep him around. As can be seen by the TCU graphs.

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Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#23 - 2017-04-16 17:04:02 UTC
Do Little wrote:
The average Eve player is now in their 30's with career and family responsibilities. Setting aside several hours for a fleet or cooperative industrial activity is difficult. As CCP Ghost pointed out at Fanfest - 90% of the people he talks to want more and better solo options. Things to do when you have a half hour of spare time to login. I'm willing to bet that a lot of players would like a pause button for PVE to help with kids, pets and other interruptions that are a normal part of family life. I don't see Eve heading in that direction anytime soon but a lot of the game and a lot of the ideas I see presented on the forum seem to assume that we actually live in New Eden when most of us simply visit for a little while when real life permits.

In my experience, communities in Eve have private chat channels - few people monitor local unless they're undocked, and then more for intel than social interaction.


I disagree that they are necessarily looking for solo options, though some might like a pause option heh. But looking for options that don't necessarily mean committing to a corp and/or can be dipped in and out of more readily. I suspect most would be up for cooperative PVE or even in some cases PVP where they knew they could dip in and out at any time for say an hour at a time, etc.

Do Little wrote:

When you look at what players have been contributing to the sandbox over the past 3 years the numbers are healthy http://cdn1.eveonline.com/community/MER/Feb_2017/0_produced.vs.destroyed.png


You need to pull those numbers apart quite a lot to make something useful of them, they tell a story but its beyond face value as the poster above me said.
oiukhp Muvila
Doomheim
#24 - 2017-04-16 17:09:40 UTC
mkint wrote:

That graph doesn't really mean a lot, except that people are mostly just playing the game to accumulate imaginary assets...



Interesting, twelve years ago as a null sec player my assets were lucky to reach a billion in sub cap ships and mods.
A year ago as a low sec pirate I had 20+ billion in doctrine ships and mods, capital and sub-capital.

I understand the necessity of PLEX as a counter to isk sellers, but I can't help to wonder how much less players would have if we could only rely on ingame mechanics to accumulate those assets.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#25 - 2017-04-16 17:10:31 UTC
You realize we're playing a 14 year old game? Without 'rehashing' content, we'd still be stuck in the EVE of 2003. And that is not a pretty picture, let me tell you.

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Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#26 - 2017-04-16 17:18:02 UTC
Terminal Insanity
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#27 - 2017-04-16 17:44:18 UTC
because it was made in early 2000s and if they never rehashed content, it would still be the same old game? CCP has done an amazing job at maintaining eve. They **** up here and there, but overall you cant deny its improved a lot.

"War declarations are never officially considered griefing and are not a bannable offense, and it has been repeatedly stated by the developers that the possibility for non-consensual PvP is an intended feature." - CCP
Chainsaw Plankton
FaDoyToy
#28 - 2017-04-16 18:01:06 UTC
manus wrote:
Warning, this post may be controversial. Proceed at your own discretion.
Disclaimer, i care about the game and thats the motivation behind my post.

In almost every update there is a new skin, a ship rebalance, or something similar that is uninteresting. It seems like its just filler content. They do it just to have something for the patch notes. Why dont they develop something interesting?

Take for example the new map they are trying to make. Why are they doing that? What was wrong with the old one? It seems like a waste of manhours and doesent provide players anything fresh to keep them interested.

Dont CCP have anyone at their disposal who play the game and also have an imagination? It is frustrating to see the growth in player count stall and then reverse and each new update bring nothing significantly interesting.

Is there a reluctance to try something new? Why is that? Is CCP just going to milk EVE until players have eventually abanonded it? Its a game with so much potential but i dont see much drive in pushing it forward.

So when will CCP wake up and start making really interesting and original content again? The thing is, the players dont show up as soon as you get development back on track, it takes years to build a player base. So they have to make changes now in order to change things around. Otherwise the trend with dropping players will likely continue until theres not alot of people left. Thank you for reading and have a nice day.

skins are easy to do and make money, of course there are going to be lots of them. Ship rebalancing is a never ending cycle and one that is pretty well handled by a fairly small team. When they introduce or change something and the meta shifts around that, and maybe a counter meta develops. Big fancy things take a lot of dev time. I'm sure there are many things they could do, but there is always the question of should they?

On the new map I assume the old map is a mess of spaghetti code and it was time for something fresh and easier to maintain.

Blood raider ship yards are coming soon™ and come with a large revamp of NPC behavior. Who knows what they will do with that tech in the future. Also a bunch more structures to come.

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Jasmine Deer
Perkone
Caldari State
#29 - 2017-04-16 22:59:13 UTC
Ranzabar wrote:
[quote=Rroff][quote=Ranzabar] When I'm in local, say in Balle. There are about 20 or so players in the system. Not a peep on local. I've dropped a line or two to sal hello and I get crickets. Same in other high-sec systems. That's Ok, I get it's a sandbox full of rocks, but if CCP wants this to be a social game, it has to promote the general sense of community in-game, and not just on the help channel.


I keep local closed in hisec because 95% of the chatter is scams and trolls, and it doesn't help that the general sense of paranoia encouraged in the game that everyone is out to get you means we tend to be wary of strangers.
Fek Mercer
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#30 - 2017-04-16 23:07:48 UTC
did you guys not see the new blood raider sotiyos?
Cade Windstalker
#31 - 2017-04-17 03:11:57 UTC
There has to be a mix of new content and reworks of the old or the old stuff gets left behind and has to be removed because it doesn't work.

In the case of T3s these are ships that have been out of line for years. Most of the playerbase knows it, CCP knows it, and now they're finally getting around to fixing it.

If you just want an endless parade of new stuff while the old is discarded then Eve is not the game for you, and no there aren't other options. Old stuff needs to either be made obsolete and effectively removed or updated and maintained, and in a persistent world where things are supposed to matter and stick around removing huge chunks of old stuff or making them worthless defeats the point.
Cade Windstalker
#32 - 2017-04-17 03:15:39 UTC
Rroff wrote:
Have to say looking at the proposed T3 cruiser stuff I'm kind of agreeing with you. I can't see how that isn't just going to annoy people who've invested into T3s while doing nothing to reinvigorate uptake of the game by newer players or really give anything new to established players.

A lot of the reason I stopped playing the game was due to how frequently the goal posts got moved around on established features while actual new and interesting content was a slow trickle and the only reason I'm still around, as I do have a lot of interest in the core concept of the game, is that I was kind of hoping that would change.


If you feel like "the goal posts" keep moving then that's probably because you keep chasing the latest kinda OP flavor of the month ship or fit or whatever, rather than finding some over-arching goal within the game world and pursing that, whether it's +10 standings with every empire, 1 trillion in assets amassed, or just going out and having fun with friends in some corner of a the game a few hours a night.

If you expect CCP to leave the OP ships OP then you're kinda in for disappointment in the long run.
Piugattuk
Litla Sundlaugin
#33 - 2017-04-17 06:26:57 UTC
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Collectively eve players tend to shoot down lots of CCPs more imaginative ideas because they don't want their area of the game affected. Most first reactions to a piece of news are just "oh great, how does this make my daily gameplay more of a chore', to me this means we have the wrong people playing, or at least those playing are in a poor mindset.

It is tough but not so tough, eve is a space game, wormholes are a good example of an expansion. Wormholes are real(?) things that exist in space and through playing this we get experience with them. Players have been asking after the Jove for over a decade so that would be a logical place to go, when CCP do though they need to get it right with new interesting mechanics and resources. I would personally prefer they look more at the rogue drones but that's just my opinion.



You ante kidding eve players shoot down every ideal that players bring up in the ideals/features, there is no pleasing many eve players no matter what except when it supports one type of play style, blood lust, when it comes to that they go ape, anything else gets shot down that I've seen in my years in eve, anyway, that's my thought.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#34 - 2017-04-17 08:50:13 UTC
Piugattuk wrote:
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Collectively eve players tend to shoot down lots of CCPs more imaginative ideas because they don't want their area of the game affected. Most first reactions to a piece of news are just "oh great, how does this make my daily gameplay more of a chore', to me this means we have the wrong people playing, or at least those playing are in a poor mindset.

It is tough but not so tough, eve is a space game, wormholes are a good example of an expansion. Wormholes are real(?) things that exist in space and through playing this we get experience with them. Players have been asking after the Jove for over a decade so that would be a logical place to go, when CCP do though they need to get it right with new interesting mechanics and resources. I would personally prefer they look more at the rogue drones but that's just my opinion.



You ante kidding eve players shoot down every ideal that players bring up in the ideals/features, there is no pleasing many eve players no matter what except when it supports one type of play style, blood lust, when it comes to that they go ape, anything else gets shot down that I've seen in my years in eve, anyway, that's my thought.
The reason that 90+% of the ideas in F&I get shot down is because they're often repeats of prior posts, poorly thought out, easily exploited, have no place in Eve and are generally just shite.

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Jacques d'Orleans
#35 - 2017-04-17 09:21:55 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
Piugattuk wrote:
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Collectively eve players tend to shoot down lots of CCPs more imaginative ideas because they don't want their area of the game affected. Most first reactions to a piece of news are just "oh great, how does this make my daily gameplay more of a chore', to me this means we have the wrong people playing, or at least those playing are in a poor mindset.

It is tough but not so tough, eve is a space game, wormholes are a good example of an expansion. Wormholes are real(?) things that exist in space and through playing this we get experience with them. Players have been asking after the Jove for over a decade so that would be a logical place to go, when CCP do though they need to get it right with new interesting mechanics and resources. I would personally prefer they look more at the rogue drones but that's just my opinion.



You ante kidding eve players shoot down every ideal that players bring up in the ideals/features, there is no pleasing many eve players no matter what except when it supports one type of play style, blood lust, when it comes to that they go ape, anything else gets shot down that I've seen in my years in eve, anyway, that's my thought.


The reason that 90+% of the ideas in F&I get shot down is because they're often repeats of prior posts, poorly thought out, easily exploited, have no place in Eve and are generally just shite.


Also because those "ideas" are always easily recognisable as the usual "Make HS even more easy" BS.

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manus
Subhypersonics
#36 - 2017-04-17 10:35:49 UTC  |  Edited by: manus
Mr Mieyli wrote:
Collectively eve players tend to shoot down lots of CCPs more imaginative ideas because they don't want their area of the game affected. .


This is a good point. CCP needs someone strong and confident. Someone who is not afraid to make a game HE likes. The second CCP starts treating development as a populairty contest the death spiral will begin. And i think they started doing this some time ago. It would explain why when going back and forward in the updates most of the content is unrelated to gameplay, and merely superficial. Ie. new skins, anniversary ships, changes to the aurum store etc. Its pathetic.
manus
Subhypersonics
#37 - 2017-04-17 10:41:17 UTC
TigerXtrm wrote:
You realize we're playing a 14 year old game? Without 'rehashing' content, we'd still be stuck in the EVE of 2003. And that is not a pretty picture, let me tell you.


Allright lemme make a new skins for you. thats just what the game needs. maybe i will make a new map browser, just because. maybe i will change the models of the ships because **** it why not. maybe i will implement walking in stations! oh and i know, i will change the icons of the UI because why not! This is really helping the game push forward. Not.
Nana Skalski
Taisaanat Kotei
EDENCOM DEFENSIVE INITIATIVE
#38 - 2017-04-17 10:52:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Nana Skalski
manus wrote:
TigerXtrm wrote:
You realize we're playing a 14 year old game? Without 'rehashing' content, we'd still be stuck in the EVE of 2003. And that is not a pretty picture, let me tell you.


Allright lemme make a new skins for you. thats just what the game needs. maybe i will make a new map browser, just because. maybe i will change the models of the ships because **** it why not. maybe i will implement walking in stations! oh and i know, i will change the icons of the UI because why not! This is really helping the game push forward. Not.

Yeeaaaah! Even walking in stations is not enough at this point. We need dancing in stations and gambling and Space Vegas. And some cuddling animations.

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Rroff
Antagonistic Tendencies
#39 - 2017-04-17 11:08:35 UTC
Cade Windstalker wrote:

If you feel like "the goal posts" keep moving then that's probably because you keep chasing the latest kinda OP flavor of the month ship or fit or whatever, rather than finding some over-arching goal within the game world and pursing that, whether it's +10 standings with every empire, 1 trillion in assets amassed, or just going out and having fun with friends in some corner of a the game a few hours a night.

If you expect CCP to leave the OP ships OP then you're kinda in for disappointment in the long run.


Nope - I've always been one to chase the esoteric/outside the box things - sadly these often become casualties of balance or other changes in overlapping or other parts of the game even when it could have been avoided.

I came into Eve from a different direction to many people (I watched my brother playing it for about 3 years without ever having the slightest interest in playing it myself until I saw them doing wormhole PVE and PVP with dreads and I started the game with the intention of skilling up for a moros with no idea how long that would take :D) and a lot of the day to day gameplay really doesn't interest me at all - I'd rather just spend the time playing an FPS shooter or whatever.
TigerXtrm
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#40 - 2017-04-17 11:18:43 UTC
manus wrote:
TigerXtrm wrote:
You realize we're playing a 14 year old game? Without 'rehashing' content, we'd still be stuck in the EVE of 2003. And that is not a pretty picture, let me tell you.


Allright lemme make a new skins for you. thats just what the game needs. maybe i will make a new map browser, just because. maybe i will change the models of the ships because **** it why not. maybe i will implement walking in stations! oh and i know, i will change the icons of the UI because why not! This is really helping the game push forward. Not.


All those things help the game. You must be the new kid here if you don't realize the community has been screaming for ship skins for over 10 years. The more skins the better. Skins generate revenue for CCP. If you don't see how that benefits the game you might want to go back to school.

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