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To: The Developers (Exumers Need a bit more mining for their Price)
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Fifty Three
Doomheim
#1 - 2017-04-13 18:48:18 UTC
Exhumers are not worth it versus Mining Barges, since they cost about 8 times as much than the Tier 1 counterparts(the barges) and give fairly little back in return relative to the cost ratio. (1)This is especially apparent with the "Mackinaw" from the "Retriever". The mackinaw does not, when Exhumer Skill is being upgraded, give a 5% percentage more hold capacity per level.(2) Furthermore, Procurer/Skiff(50% damage + drone hit points ) + Covetor/Hulk( lessactivation cost+25% less mining duration), all have a "Role Bonus" but the Retriever/Mackinaw does not. I suggest to give the Retriever/Mackinaw like 15%, more cargo space for Its "role bonus", to be equal to the rest, as, like I said, they(Retriever/Mackinaw) has no role bonus currently like the others.

Note: The Exumers, to what I calculate, mining speed when they are upgrade in level 5 skills are still nothing much. It is roughly 2 minutes or a bit more(in case of Hulk), faster per hour. For ships that cost so much more than barges, 8 times approximately, that is quite terrible, as it doesn't significantly make a difference.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2017-04-13 18:59:46 UTC
Diminishing returns are a feature, not a bug.

How much of a buff do you want to see to exhumers, and how much further down do you think this would push mineral prices?
Fish Hunter
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2017-04-13 19:00:42 UTC
Here's how much better the exhumer is compared to the barge for yield only, exhumers have more tank and easier fitting in general

Hulk 17% - coveter
mack 11% - retriever
skiff 21% - procurer

and yield progression high to low is hulk - covetor - mackinaw/skiff - retriever - procurer

Retriever/Mack have the largest ore hold as their role.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#4 - 2017-04-13 19:54:21 UTC
If hardly anyone flew exhumers because they were too expensive for their benefits then you might be onto something. However, this is not the case.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=491069&find=unread

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs
Elenahina
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2017-04-13 19:56:55 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
If hardly anyone flew exhumers because they were too expensive for their benefits then you might be onto something. However, this is not the case.

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=491069&find=unread


mmm. There's nothing like facts to make you stop and take note.

Eve is like an addiction; you can't quit it until it quits you. Also, iderno
Cade Windstalker
#6 - 2017-04-13 20:18:04 UTC
Your math is bad.


  1. The Mackinaw doesn't need an additional 5% per level bonus, it has a much larger base ore hold in addition to *three* more mid slots and higher yield. At all 5s the Mackinaw has an ore hold of 35k m3 while the Retriever only has 27.5k m3.

  2. The Mackinaw and Retriever's Role Bonus is the massive ore hold. This was stated clearly in the original mining ships rework from years ago. They don't need to give the ship a smaller ore hold and then give it a bonus to make it clear what the role of the ship is.


You've also failed to account for Mining Upgrades and the way larger values explode when multiplied by a succession of multiplicatively stacking bonuses. The Hulk, with all 5s and T2 modules and crystals, mines 18% more than the Covetor while having three extra mid slots and not quite 50% more base EHP. The absolute amount more also becomes much more than the Covetor when you throw Mining Boosts into the mix. The percentage remains 18% but the value of that 18% grows significantly in absolute terms.

For reference that would be like an almost 11 extra minutes of mining per hours spent with a Hulk vs a Covetor.

You find something similar with each of the T2 Exhumbers, the Mackinaw mines ~11% more than the Retriever while having a 27% larger Ore Hold meaning it has to dock less frequently and *three* extra mid slots. The Skiff mines ~22% more than the Procurer, gains a mid slot, and has almost 6.5k more base EHP before tank mods are applied.

Yes, these ships cost more, but they also mine significantly better and are significantly more survivable against ganks and belt rats. They don't need a buff, and their costs are fine.
mkint
#7 - 2017-04-14 00:55:16 UTC  |  Edited by: mkint
Mining income has nothing to do with mining yield. It's 100% value of time spent. If you aren't making as much as you want mining, it's because your time spent mining isn't worth that much. Highsec ore supply is infinite, time spent is finite, therefore mining is an hourly wage determined by the market value of your hours. If you want to make more mining, you have to make your time more valuable than everybody else's, whether through in-game negotiating, or coming up with a suggestion that makes mining reward some kind of player skill. Supply v demand in action. Working as intended.

edit: what I love about the OP is that he's posted dozens of mostly bad ideas and gets nearly zero likes from any of them. Most people eventually learn a little bit about the world when their ideas are shot down, but not the OP!

Maxim 6. If violence wasn’t your last resort, you failed to resort to enough of it.
Ramukan
Radiation Sickness
#8 - 2017-04-14 22:59:38 UTC
At this point you either mine in a rorqual or do something else.