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Missions & Complexes

 
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Which Marauder is best for L4 missions?

Author
Jeremiah Saken
The Fall of Leviathan
#141 - 2017-03-16 06:39:12 UTC
hmskrecik wrote:
Funny you comment on game balance issues without doing your own homework. I just looked at prices in my region and they are as follows (slightly rounded for better typing)::

Incursus - 350 000
Daredevil - 58 000 000
Enyo - 27 000 000

Thorax - 9 000 000
Vigilant - 203 000 000
Deimos - 209 000 000

Megathron - 139 000 000
Vindicator - 358 000 000
Kronos - 1 175 000 000

See the discrepancy here? Hint: the problem is not with Marauders.

Lol
You just proven my point. T2 BS (marauders) are way overpriced and they are overpriced because of the manufacturing cost. Overfarmed explo sites won't help with it either.
hmskrecik wrote:
Good for you. Feel free to contract to me all your Marauders. At the price you think they are worth of course.

Lol I don't have any. Sold my golem, bought 4 rattlesnakes and put them in four corners of the hisec.

"I am tormented with an everlasting itch for things remote. I love to sail forbidden seas..." - Herman Melville

Drake Aihaken
CODE.d
#142 - 2017-03-16 08:22:53 UTC
hmskrecik wrote:
Amen to that.

With this addition: it pays off to support drones, if only slightly. On all my Marauders in highs there is Drone Link for range and on my Kronos there is Drone Damage Amp in lows.

Also I Intentionally dedicate one mid slot on each ship as utility to be freely replaced with whatever is necessary for given mission. On some missions you need propulsion, on others it would be completely unused and thus Omni Tracking would be more useful, for example. The choice is purely personal here.

I usually don't augment my drone range as I have 57km already and find that the more distance I give them - the more they tend to hang themselves with it (nothing wrong with that setup though). The Auto Targeting II system is useful to give you a passive 11 targets when not in Bastion (not needed with Advanced Target Management V). A single Salvager II can also really speed up salvaging in conjunction with salvage drones.

Having a dedicated swappable mid slot is a good idea. For my blaster Kronos the sensor booster is swapped out for a Large Micro Jump Drive on a few missions. I find that the Deadspace MWD and pair of range-scripted tracking computers are indispensable, though - as I often need it to close 10-20km for a better firing solution.
hmskrecik
TransMine Group
#143 - 2017-03-16 17:22:39 UTC
Jeremiah Saken wrote:
hmskrecik wrote:
Funny you comment on game balance issues without doing your own homework. I just looked at prices in my region and they are as follows (slightly rounded for better typing)::

Incursus - 350 000
Daredevil - 58 000 000
Enyo - 27 000 000

Thorax - 9 000 000
Vigilant - 203 000 000
Deimos - 209 000 000

Megathron - 139 000 000
Vindicator - 358 000 000
Kronos - 1 175 000 000

See the discrepancy here? Hint: the problem is not with Marauders.

Lol
You just proven my point. T2 BS (marauders) are way overpriced and they are overpriced because of the manufacturing cost. Overfarmed explo sites won't help with it either.

I don't think so but I'm out of rational arguments and I will not got down to ad personam thus to me this discussion has run its course. Fly safe.
Drake Aihaken
CODE.d
#144 - 2017-03-17 04:41:39 UTC
Fly what you enjoy, fly for fun and don't sweat the ISK/hr. We're all basically space-poor anyway...
Myriad Blaze
Common Sense Ltd
Nulli Secunda
#145 - 2017-03-19 03:00:19 UTC
Drake Aihaken wrote:
The Golem has been intentionally left out of this list. It is bar none the worst Marauder for PvE as cruise missiles and torpedoes have horrible damage application, lengthy delay to impact, the least amount of EHP/tank and requires substantial additional training into electronic warfare for Target Painters. It is not effective at shooting anything smaller than battlecruisers and you will lose a lot of time micromanaging target painters, lost DPS against cruisers, massive lost DPS against frigates and volleys in transit. It is almost extremely difficult to volley smaller ships from a room with missiles once they start moving.

Every other Marauder will far-outperform the Golem at full mission clears - in no small part because they can apply instant damage across large distances - but also because guns receive penetrating, smashing and wrecking bonuses.


Apparently my experience with the Golem is a lot more pleasant than yours. I don't have the skills to fly a Kronos or Vargur, but I can fly a Golem and a Paladin equally well. Actually my skills for the Paladin are somewhat superior, because my gunnery skills are substantially better than my missile skills (at the moment). Nevertheless I get better overall results with a Golem.

Damage application is something you can train and fit for.

While there is some delay to impact, I still hit targets within 120km (or so) before the launcher is ready to fire again. I don't think I ever lost a single volley within this range.

Maybe the Golem has the least amount of EHP/tank of the Marauders, but this doesn't matter at all since my omnitanked Golem is way overtanked for PvE anyway.

Yes a Target Painter is necessary imho. But I don't think the skill requirements are a good argument against flying a Golem. Likewise you could say that a Golem is bad, because it's the only Marauder that requires missile skills. Also micromanaging a single Target Painter (that's all I need) is a non-issue.

Effectiveness against cruisers and frigates depends on choosing the correct ammo. Oneshotting cruisers is possible. To be able to oneshot frigates you usually need to switch to Precision. With regard to effectiveness the Paladin outperforms the Golem against targets which are weak against EM/therm and at range. However, if you go against Guristas, Serpentis or Angel Cartel for example, the Paladin sucks and is nowhere near as effective as a Golem (not to mention the performance against targets which are close). In my experience (largely from running missions in Caldari, Amarr and Ammatar space) the Golem is better overall by quite a bit.

However, I'm aware that the style of running missions has significant effect on how you experience ship performance. Personally I dislike leaving stuff behind, so usually I clear, loot and salvage everything (yes, I know that that's not the most efficient way to run missions). Since I'm lazy my preferred method is warp in, hit Bastion, launch MTU, aggro everything (getting them closer to speed up looting), clear the grid.

Furthermore I'd say that fitting a Golem is more difficult compared to fitting a Paladin, which could be held against the Golem. The ideal fit (for me) costs roughly 700m ISK (estimated price in the fitting window). It is perfect for PvE imho, but the bling might draw some attention to it. Since ganker presence in my area seems to have increased lately, I switched to a different fit, though. I sacrificed some damage application and the third Salvager to bring up the tank to near PvP standard while using cheaper mods (which require more CPU; roughly 350m ISK for the whole fit; and the fit is still good enough).
Casina Lumine
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#146 - 2017-03-20 14:19:18 UTC
Those of you using the Vargur - how do you fit it against Serpentis with their annoying sensor dampening?
Mina Sebiestar
Minmatar Inner Space Conglomerate
#147 - 2017-03-20 16:00:57 UTC
Casina Lumine wrote:
Those of you using the Vargur - how do you fit it against Serpentis with their annoying sensor dampening?


Bastion module

You choke behind a smile a fake behind the fear

Because >>I is too hard

Problem Addict
#148 - 2017-04-09 18:34:33 UTC
Marauders suck
Eleanor Roscommon
Bleu Femme Felis
#149 - 2017-04-11 20:49:00 UTC
Wow, 8 pages of stuff, and no definitive answers!
stoicfaux
#150 - 2017-04-12 02:48:18 UTC
Eleanor Roscommon wrote:
Wow, 8 pages of stuff, and no definitive answers!

Vargur is "best" because it has the most well rounded damage types.

Guns are better than missiles due to long missile cycle times and DPS lost to overkill from grouped missiles. Plus the ability to kill frigates at range. Even with 4-5 TPs and the ability to one-shot non-elite cruisers, my Vargur times were better than my Golem times at full clears or blitzing.

Regardless, the Paladin and Kronos are spiffy gun-boats as well if you avoid the NPCs they're weakest to.

Overall, the differences between the gun Marauaders doesn't seem to justify making the claim that one of them is the best, IMO.

Pon Farr Memorial: once every 7 years, all the carebears in high-sec must PvP or they will be temp-banned.